From: "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de>
Subject: Re: Should Inline be private in the private part of a package spec?
Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2012 09:32:26 +0200
Date: 2012-08-22T09:32:26+02:00 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <k7637a11gmnm$.1lv7ly66jmka8$.dlg@40tude.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 5033ff28$0$6185$ba4acef3@reader.news.orange.fr
On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 23:35:35 +0200, Pascal Obry wrote:
> Dmitry,
>
>> The problem of transformation XML documents does not exist. I don't see why
>> data exchange needs that. I don't see why any transformations would be
>> necessary between systems.
>
> You don't see why because you seem to try hard to deny XML any benefit.
It is not a hard try. Yes, I have an opinion on XML because in my job
(automation systems and embedded) XML became a real plague. I asked others
to put up a practical case where XML might be useful, technically useful,
rather than per popularity vote or legacy. Nobody proposed any.
> Exchanging structured data is an important point.
It is an important problem, yes, but XML is poor for that. XML
1. is extremely inefficient
2. fails to capture the structure (e.g. recursive, interlinked structures)
3. lacks even basic data types (everything is string, not even weakly
typed)
4. lacks any means to describe the semantics (e.g. no ADT),
5. incapable to validate data (because of 4)
6. requires complex, resource consuming, vulnerable infrastructure like
parsers
7. is not redundant and at the same time absolutely permissive (requires
complex validation of itself)
> Before XML we were
> using many format and we had to write parsers for all those formats in
> every languages. Now with XML (and the corresponding xsd, or wsdl) it is
> possible to parse (and *validate*) any data set coming from any
> applications.
And it is still so with XML, because XML considered for data exchange is
not of the application level. It is just a very ugly and unsafe
transport/presentation level protocol. The application level is still to
develop and XML is no relief, it just complicates things. As for
transport/presentation there is little need in any parsing at all.
So, again, taking the data exchange issue, what is the particular
[sub]problem XML solves?
--
Regards,
Dmitry A. Kazakov
http://www.dmitry-kazakov.de
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2012-08-22 7:32 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 183+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2012-08-03 13:30 Should Inline be private in the private part of a package spec? Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-03 14:34 ` Martin Krischik
2012-08-03 15:51 ` Adam Beneschan
2012-08-03 18:07 ` Robert A Duff
2012-08-06 3:09 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-06 14:33 ` Robert A Duff
2012-08-06 15:50 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-06 17:58 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-06 21:01 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-06 21:52 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-06 22:10 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-06 23:12 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 8:29 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-09 21:44 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-08 1:48 ` Shark8
2012-08-08 7:38 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-08 8:10 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-09 21:39 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-10 1:49 ` Britt
2012-08-10 3:10 ` Shark8
2012-08-10 6:00 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-10 16:34 ` Shark8
2012-08-10 22:37 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-11 3:44 ` Shark8
2012-08-11 4:42 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-13 11:53 ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2012-08-10 7:37 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-10 16:45 ` Shark8
2012-08-10 17:03 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-10 21:35 ` Shark8
2012-08-10 22:10 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-11 3:27 ` Shark8
2012-08-11 5:25 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-11 4:48 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-11 5:12 ` Shark8
2012-08-10 17:06 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-11 0:46 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-11 1:57 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-13 22:16 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-14 2:52 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-14 14:44 ` Shark8
2012-08-14 15:09 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-14 22:04 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-15 7:51 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-15 11:08 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-15 11:55 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-15 15:49 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-15 16:24 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-15 16:53 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-15 18:53 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-15 20:39 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-21 22:46 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-22 12:49 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-22 13:10 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-22 21:55 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-23 7:56 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 9:00 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-24 4:22 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-24 10:17 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-24 15:07 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-24 22:09 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-15 21:29 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-16 7:30 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-16 11:18 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-16 12:13 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-16 12:56 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-16 18:31 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-16 19:58 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-16 22:00 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-17 18:41 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-18 6:24 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-18 8:05 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-18 21:02 ` Shark8
2012-08-18 21:52 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-19 1:34 ` Shark8
2012-08-19 13:03 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-18 23:33 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-20 13:51 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-20 14:15 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-20 16:22 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-20 18:42 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-20 19:28 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-20 20:27 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-21 11:49 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-21 13:12 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-21 14:17 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-21 15:06 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-21 15:29 ` Pascal Obry
2012-08-21 19:12 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-21 16:18 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-21 19:18 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-21 21:35 ` Pascal Obry
2012-08-21 23:11 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-21 23:37 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-22 21:40 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-21 23:54 ` Shark8
2012-08-22 6:14 ` Pascal Obry
2012-08-23 2:29 ` Shark8
2012-08-22 7:32 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov [this message]
2012-08-22 13:12 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-22 14:30 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-22 16:48 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-22 17:44 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-22 19:59 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-22 20:08 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-22 20:29 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 7:06 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 8:08 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 8:38 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 9:58 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 10:27 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 11:30 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 12:28 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 0:12 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-24 4:40 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-24 7:37 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-24 10:03 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-24 22:06 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-22 21:18 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 7:23 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 8:56 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 10:13 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 11:33 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 12:45 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 13:31 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-23 17:42 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 17:41 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 11:35 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 11:39 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-23 12:33 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2012-08-23 17:33 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-24 4:48 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-24 9:56 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-21 16:25 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-21 22:40 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-14 15:11 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-14 20:30 ` Shark8
2012-08-15 11:47 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-15 17:18 ` Shark8
2012-08-14 15:19 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-14 20:41 ` Shark8
2012-08-14 23:59 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-15 0:50 ` Shark8
2012-08-15 3:02 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-14 22:16 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-14 23:55 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-15 6:35 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-21 22:31 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-22 0:15 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-22 22:08 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-23 0:00 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-23 7:02 ` Niklas Holsti
2012-08-24 4:37 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-13 12:03 ` Project files (Was: Should Inline be private in the private part of a package spec?) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2012-08-13 22:12 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-10 8:12 ` Should Inline be private in the private part of a package spec? Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-06 23:09 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 9:33 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-07 13:09 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 13:41 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-07 14:06 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-09 22:32 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-07 13:45 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 13:55 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-07 14:12 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-09 21:56 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-07 0:25 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 10:01 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-07 13:21 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 17:28 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-07 19:26 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 13:34 ` Vasiliy Molostov
2012-08-07 17:31 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-07 13:48 ` Georg Bauhaus
2012-08-07 17:47 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-09 22:34 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-10 14:26 ` Simon Wright
2012-08-09 21:33 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-09 22:18 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-09 22:29 ` Shark8
2012-08-10 0:12 ` Randy Brukardt
2012-08-12 21:35 ` Robert A Duff
2012-08-03 16:15 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
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