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From: "Richard  Riehle" <adaworks@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics
Date: Mon, 31 May 2004 02:28:36 GMT
Date: 2004-05-31T02:28:36+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <oLwuc.17575$be.14510@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 40ba315a$0$254$edfadb0f@dread16.news.tele.dk


"Per Dalgas Jakobsen" <i@hate.spam> wrote in message
news:40ba315a$0$254$edfadb0f@dread16.news.tele.dk...
>
> One way to get their attention could be to suggest Berkeley or Oxford (or
> whoever makes these kinds of analyses) to make a thorough investigations
> based on real business cases, with help from "people in the business" =
us,
> and make them do all the economical consequence maths, for very small
> projects with no safety critical issues, to very large projects with all
the
> whistles and bells.

Any Berkeley professor who espoused, or even attempted to justify the use
of Ada, would be laughed out of her/his tenure.   That person be subjected
to a barrage of ridicule that any previous credibility would vanish like a
candle flame in a dust storm.

Wind River was originally founded by Berkeley students.  They used to deny
any
connection with Ada because, from their point of view, it is the language of
death and destruction, the programming language of war.   In more recent
times,
the Wind River management seems to have softened its stance regarding Ada,
and position it as simply an annoying language that they must temporarily
support
until it completely fades into oblivion.

Berkeley has never been a friendly place for Ada.

As to other universities, there is currently no incentive for professors to
carry out
any kind of research that might favor Ada.   The scholarly journals prefer
contributions
that avoid Ada,  the textbook publishers edit out excessive references to
Ada, and
the DoD is not funding any Ada research projects anymore.

At this point, Ada is standing entirely on its own.  It must survive on its
own merits.  It
must endure the ridicule of the academics, the widespread misinformation
among the
developers, and the inane criticism of those who have never written a
seropus system in
the language.  When one considers the obstacles that have been thrown at it
during
the past six years, it is a wonder that it survives at all.   The fact that
it continues to be
the choice of many intelligent users is a tribute to its value.   Those who
select Ada,
when there are so many other options available must be doing so for very
good
reasons.   One must ask what those reasons are.    No one can say, in this
time,
that Ada is only used because of the "mandate."

I am of the opinion that those who choose Ada are on to something that the
other
developers have failed to apprehend.   Perhaps, in time, the secret of Ada
will be
out, and more will discover that they can build better, more maintainable
software
with Ada, within well-bounded budgets, than they can with competing choices.

Until then, those who do decide for Ada will reap the benefits of that
decision while
those who decide for other options will continue to do whatever it is they
think they
are doing.

Richard Riehle





  reply	other threads:[~2004-05-31  2:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 216+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-05-30 11:46 Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Per Dalgas Jakobsen
2004-05-30 16:13 ` Pascal Obry
2004-05-30 18:03   ` Luke A. Guest
2004-05-30 19:09     ` Per Dalgas Jakobsen
2004-05-31  2:28       ` Richard  Riehle [this message]
2004-05-31 15:33         ` Wes Groleau
2004-06-01  2:56           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-01 14:51             ` Wes Groleau
2004-06-07 16:29             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-07 17:44               ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-08 16:09                 ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-08 17:30                   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-08 20:38                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-08 22:23                       ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-09  2:27                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-09  4:41                           ` I R T
2004-06-09  6:43                             ` Richard  Riehle
2004-06-10  6:53                               ` Randy Brukardt
2004-06-12  3:16                                 ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-09  6:39                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-09  7:44                             ` I R T
2004-06-09 12:13                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-09 12:34                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-09 21:13                               ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-10  2:51                                 ` Wes Groleau
2004-06-10 15:57                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-10 17:18                                     ` Pascal Obry
2004-06-10 12:13                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-11 12:48                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-11 17:31                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-14  2:30                                   ` Berend de Boer
2004-06-14  2:47                                     ` I R T
2004-06-14  3:10                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-14 11:49                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-14 16:28                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-14 17:34                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15 11:35                                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15 23:02                                               ` Brian May
2004-06-16 11:37                                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-21 14:56                                               ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-06-23 20:19                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2004-06-15 16:30                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-15 11:26                                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15 16:43                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-15 18:51                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15 21:02                                                 ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-15 22:01                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15 22:08                                                     ` Ed Falis
2004-06-15 22:26                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-17 15:50                                                         ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-17 16:12                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-17 21:05                                                             ` Pascal Obry
2004-06-17 21:47                                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-17 22:18                                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-18  5:19                                                                   ` Brian May
2004-06-18 14:44                                                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-17 23:02                                                               ` Brian May
2004-06-18  7:50                                                                 ` Martin Dowie
2004-06-19 20:40                                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-19 18:10                                                               ` Ragged arrays of strings (Was: Improving Ada's image) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-06-20 22:01                                                                 ` Pascal Obry
2004-06-19 20:54                                                             ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-20  2:20                                                               ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-06-20  4:24                                                               ` tmoran
2004-06-20 15:06                                                               ` Dr. Adrian Wrigley
2004-06-21 15:30                                                                 ` Enum'Image (Was: Improving Ada's image) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-06-21 16:06                                                                   ` Dr. Adrian Wrigley
2004-06-21 16:53                                                                     ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-22 21:38                                                                       ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-06-23 15:42                                                                         ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-23 17:15                                                                           ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-06-22 13:26                                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-06-23 16:04                                                                   ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-06-25  0:07                                                                     ` Enum'Image Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-06-25 15:55                                                                       ` Enum'Image Frank J. Lhota
2004-06-23 20:29                                                                   ` Enum'Image (Was: Improving Ada's image) Randy Brukardt
2004-06-23 23:35                                                                     ` Dr. Adrian Wrigley
2004-06-25  0:15                                                                       ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-06-26  5:11                                                               ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-27  1:00                                                                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-06-27  2:33                                                                 ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-15 23:30                                                     ` Dale Stanbrough
2004-06-15 21:59                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-25  4:21                                               ` Enum'Image (Was: Improving Ada's image) Larry Kilgallen
2004-06-15 19:28                                             ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-15 21:04                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-15 22:13                                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-16  0:05                                                 ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-15 22:08                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15 23:06                                                 ` tmoran
2004-06-16 11:47                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-17  1:33                                                     ` Brian May
2004-06-17 12:09                                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-16  0:56                                                 ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-16 11:54                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15  1:21                                       ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-07-01  4:08                                         ` Dave Thompson
2004-07-04 19:00                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-14 11:45                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-14 13:20                                     ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-06-15 11:39                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-19 23:14                                         ` Pylinius
2004-06-15 11:41                                     ` David Starner
2004-06-15 16:29                                       ` Richard  Riehle
2004-06-15 17:06                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-11 17:53                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-11 18:56                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-11 23:23                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-12  3:08                                     ` Ada BIND was: " Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-12 12:03                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-12 12:47                                         ` Jeff C,
2004-06-13 12:22                                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-14 16:33                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-13  6:08                                         ` Russ
2004-06-13 10:28                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-13 14:49                                             ` Stephen Leake
2004-06-13 20:51                                             ` Russ
2004-06-13 23:15                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-14  2:09                                             ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15  0:02                                               ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-15  2:40                                                 ` Brian May
2004-06-15 12:46                                                   ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-06-15 18:53                                                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-06-15 22:09                                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-07-01  4:08                                                   ` Dave Thompson
2004-06-14 16:43                                           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-15 11:47                                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15 16:21                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-15 19:36                                               ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-06-15 19:51                                                 ` Björn Persson
2004-06-16 13:44                                                   ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-06-15 22:13                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15 22:32                                                   ` Björn Persson
2004-06-15 23:04                                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15 23:23                                                       ` Brian May
2004-06-15 23:26                                                       ` tmoran
2004-06-16 18:11                                                         ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-06-15 23:33                                                       ` Björn Persson
2004-06-15 23:18                                                     ` Dale Stanbrough
2004-06-15 23:22                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-15 23:37                                                         ` Dale Stanbrough
2004-06-15 23:59                                                       ` Björn Persson
2004-06-16 13:38                                         ` Ada BIND was: Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Larry Kilgallen
2004-06-09 10:52                           ` Ada operating systems Peter C. Chapin
2004-06-09 12:07                         ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-11  7:05                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-11 15:07                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-09 12:32                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15 20:34                         ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-06-08 19:51                   ` Wes Groleau
2004-06-08 22:26                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-09  4:39                   ` I R T
2004-06-09  8:13                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-06-09 12:42                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-09 12:38                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-09 16:23                     ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-09 16:38                       ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-06-09 20:51                         ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-06-10 12:43                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-15 19:55                   ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-06-09 23:45                 ` Richard  Riehle
2004-06-10 12:58                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-11 18:03                   ` Russ
2004-06-14 16:16                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-01  2:45         ` Hyman Rosen
2004-06-04 17:24       ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics (why not Universities?) Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-04 18:46         ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-06-07 12:58           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-07 17:11             ` Ada in colleges and universities Peter C. Chapin
2004-06-07 17:29               ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-06-07 19:47                 ` Peter C. Chapin
2004-06-07 18:39               ` Björn Persson
2004-06-07 18:55                 ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-06-07 19:21                   ` Jerome Hugues
2004-06-07 19:27                   ` (see below)
2004-06-07 19:44                     ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-06-08  1:14                     ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-07 22:06                   ` Björn Persson
2004-06-07 22:17                     ` (see below)
2004-06-08  9:30                   ` Adrian Knoth
2004-06-08 17:12                     ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-06-08 18:19                       ` Adrian Knoth
2004-06-08  9:53                   ` Jano
2004-06-09  8:55                   ` Pascal Obry
2004-06-07 19:53                 ` Peter C. Chapin
2004-06-07 21:54                   ` Björn Persson
2004-06-09  3:52                     ` I R T
2004-06-09 12:51                       ` Björn Persson
2004-06-10  2:58                         ` Wes Groleau
2004-06-07 22:03                   ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-06-08  0:16                     ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-06-08  5:12                       ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-06-08 16:14               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-06-06 13:34         ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics (why not Universities?) Ralph W. Reid
2004-06-07  2:38           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-05-30 18:47 ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Richard  Riehle
2004-05-31 12:57   ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-31 23:36     ` Berend de Boer
2004-06-01  0:41       ` tmoran
2004-06-01 11:04       ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-01 14:44       ` Wes Groleau
2004-06-01 18:43       ` Pascal Obry
2004-06-07 16:35   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-05-31 12:45 ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-31 20:55 ` Improving Ada's image Björn Persson
2004-06-01  0:41   ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-06-01 11:23   ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-01  2:40 ` Improving Ada's image - Was: 7E7 Flight Controls Electronics Hyman Rosen
2004-06-01 21:14   ` Per Dalgas Jakobsen
2004-06-02  1:12     ` Ed Falis
2004-06-02 10:59     ` Stefan Nobis
2004-06-03  4:19       ` Jeffrey Carter
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2004-05-31  9:22 Rod Chapman
2004-06-01 11:30 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-06-18 14:43 abrandon
2004-06-18 17:49 ` Wes Groleau
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