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From: "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de>
Subject: Re: why learn C?
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 09:55:02 +0200
Date: 2007-04-15T09:54:06+02:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <xvf74lr2s66m$.xvsjl68lxgs2.dlg@40tude.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: XJeUh.432$F32.239@trndny02

On Sun, 15 Apr 2007 00:55:19 GMT, Hyman Rosen wrote:

> Markus E Leypold wrote:
>> This is only necessary because C/C++ has no way to specify a
>> constant array (i.e. a "array literal").
> 
> Not really. The preprocessor stuff is generating program code as
> well as data. Think about "properties" - you need to code a getter,
> a setter, a place to hold the value, a type, a descriptive string,
> and so forth. The language syntax may not allow all of this to be
> in one place, and that's where macros can come in handy.

If the language does not provide abstract member interface (primitive
operations for ".Foo") that is a deficiency.

I think that the idea of having tools (and meta programming) instead of
fixing the language is wrong. Surely there exist border cases used rarely,
which aren't worth the efforts. But getter/setter is IMO not among them.

In your example type is superfluous, it should be determinable from the
value. The value and the string would be a tuple used in the setter. For
tuples one would also need user-defined aggregates, otherwise the string
length discriminant of the tuple could not be evaluated from the string
value. Maybe anonymous record types..., anyway, I think that the sugar

   X.Foo := (1.35, "Blah");

is solvable in a statically typed language without preprocessing.

-- 
Regards,
Dmitry A. Kazakov
http://www.dmitry-kazakov.de



  reply	other threads:[~2007-04-15  7:55 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 167+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <1172144043.746296.44680@m58g2000cwm.googlegroups.com>
     [not found] ` <slrnetr31o.875.Marc.Boyer@localhost.localdomain>
     [not found]   ` <1172161751.573558.24140@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>
     [not found]     ` <slrnetri6j.875.Marc.Boyer@localhost.localdomain>
     [not found]       ` <546qkhF1tr7dtU1@mid.individual.net>
2007-02-23  8:09         ` why learn C? Marc Boyer
2007-03-20 17:37           ` adaworks
2007-03-21  8:07             ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-03-21 13:39               ` Martin Krischik
2007-03-22  7:54                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-03-21 14:10               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-03-21 17:57                 ` adaworks
2007-03-21 18:48               ` adaworks
2007-03-21 18:39                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-03-21 20:09                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-03-21 20:25                 ` Use of declare blocks Randy Brukardt
2007-03-21 20:36                   ` Gautier
2007-03-21 20:37                   ` Gautier
2007-03-21 20:43                   ` Niklas Holsti
2007-03-21 21:29                     ` Randy Brukardt
2007-03-22  1:17                       ` Adam Beneschan
2007-03-22  8:34                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-03-22  1:06                   ` Adam Beneschan
2007-03-22 17:59                   ` adaworks
2007-03-23  2:35                     ` Randy Brukardt
2007-03-23  5:23                       ` adaworks
2007-03-23  5:15                         ` Randy Brukardt
2007-03-23 10:20                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-03-23 18:25                             ` commenting, was " tmoran
2007-03-24  0:32                               ` adaworks
2007-03-24  2:12                                 ` tmoran
2007-03-24  3:19                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2007-03-24  7:36                                     ` tmoran
2007-03-24 15:35                                       ` Simon Wright
2007-03-21 13:29             ` why learn C? Alexander E. Kopilovich
2007-03-30  0:51             ` kevin  cline
2007-03-30  4:09               ` Steve
2007-03-30  4:58                 ` kevin  cline
2007-03-30  7:44                   ` Lutz Donnerhacke
2007-03-30  9:09                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-02  4:29                       ` kevin  cline
2007-04-02  6:45                         ` adaworks
2007-04-02  7:52                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-02  8:19                           ` kevin  cline
2007-04-02 12:04                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-02 23:37                             ` Randy Brukardt
2007-04-03 12:42                               ` Erasing inappropriate operations (was: why learn C?) Ludovic Brenta
2007-04-03 23:44                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-04-04  8:34                                   ` Erasing inappropriate operations Ludovic Brenta
2007-04-04 22:00                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2007-04-03  0:16                         ` why learn C? Markus E Leypold
2007-04-04 16:14                           ` jayessay
2007-04-05  7:14                             ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-05 15:35                               ` jayessay
2007-04-06  2:02                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-06  5:57                                   ` Ray Blaak
2007-04-06 11:01                                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-07 23:00                                       ` Ray Blaak
2007-04-08 19:41                                         ` jayessay
2007-04-09 14:08                                         ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-10 15:48                                           ` jayessay
2007-04-08 19:44                                       ` jayessay
2007-04-06 18:05                                     ` jayessay
2007-04-06 22:00                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-06 23:46                                         ` jayessay
2007-04-06 23:59                                         ` jayessay
2007-04-06 22:16                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-06 23:52                                       ` jayessay
2007-04-07  0:39                                         ` Ray Blaak
2007-04-06 17:52                                   ` jayessay
2007-03-30  8:29                   ` Markus E Leypold
2007-03-30  8:35                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-03-30 17:39                   ` adaworks
2007-03-31 14:59                     ` Steve
2007-03-31 15:59                       ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-01 14:32                         ` Ed Falis
2007-04-02  7:03                         ` adaworks
2007-03-31 15:14                     ` Pascal Obry
2007-04-02  5:27                     ` kevin  cline
2007-04-02  6:04                       ` Harald Korneliussen
2007-04-02  6:33                       ` Shortage on C / C++ experts Martin Krischik
2007-04-02  7:07                       ` why learn C? adaworks
2007-04-02  7:18                         ` kevin  cline
2007-04-02 13:00                       ` adaworks
2007-04-12 15:28                         ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-12 18:32                           ` Robert A Duff
2007-04-13 15:59                             ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-14 22:20                               ` Robert A Duff
2007-04-14 22:46                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-04-22 18:53                           ` adaworks
2007-04-22 19:50                             ` Gautier
2007-04-03  0:26                       ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-03  0:34                       ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-03  2:22                       ` jimmaureenrogers
2007-04-12 15:47                         ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-12 16:18                           ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-13 23:18                             ` kevin  cline
2007-04-14  9:38                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-14 10:57                               ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-15 15:10                                 ` Simon Wright
2007-04-15 16:05                                   ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-15  0:59                             ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-15 15:28                               ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-12 16:39                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-12 20:54                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-12 20:33                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-12 21:40                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-12 20:50                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-13  0:32                                   ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-14 22:27                                     ` Robert A Duff
2007-04-14  1:20                           ` jimmaureenrogers
2007-04-02  5:03                   ` Brian May
2007-04-02  6:16                     ` kevin  cline
2007-04-03  0:00                       ` Brian May
2007-04-12 15:56                         ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-12 16:19                           ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-13 23:42                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-03  0:13                       ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-02 11:47                 ` Shortage on C / C++ experts Larry Kilgallen
2007-04-02 12:01                   ` Ludovic Brenta
2007-04-02 12:15                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-02 18:47                       ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2007-04-02 20:43                         ` tmoran
2007-03-30  4:52               ` why learn C? jimmaureenrogers
2007-03-30  6:30                 ` Case Crab
2007-03-30  6:37                   ` Gautier
2007-03-30  9:17                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-03-31 13:18                     ` Peter C. Chapin
2007-04-01  1:23                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-01 11:59                         ` Peter C. Chapin
2007-04-02  6:37                       ` kevin  cline
2007-04-02  9:39                         ` Harald Korneliussen
2007-03-30 17:47                   ` adaworks
2007-03-30 19:25                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-03-30 20:29                     ` Randy Brukardt
2007-03-31  9:52                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-01  1:35                       ` adaworks
2007-03-31  2:41                   ` jimmaureenrogers
2007-03-31 12:25                     ` not NASA Ada coding standard Stephen Leake
2007-03-31 15:44                       ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-01 16:22                       ` Simon Clubley
2007-04-02 10:08                         ` Stephen Leake
2007-04-02  7:43                     ` why learn C? kevin  cline
2007-04-02  8:45                       ` Martin Krischik
2007-04-02 10:54                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-12 16:05                         ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-12 16:48                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-04-12 18:27                           ` Robert A Duff
2007-04-13 16:21                             ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-12 21:11                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-04-13 15:45                             ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-02  8:13                     ` kevin  cline
2007-04-02 23:54                       ` Randy Brukardt
2007-04-03  2:58                       ` jimmaureenrogers
2007-04-12 16:24                       ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-12 18:05                         ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-15  0:55                           ` Hyman Rosen
2007-04-15  7:55                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov [this message]
2007-04-15 15:25                             ` Markus E Leypold
2007-03-31 11:40                 ` Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                 ` <1175236212.771445.135460@y66g2Organization: LJK Software <c82IfUV$xbi8@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2007-03-31 18:56                   ` adaworks
2007-03-31 20:10                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-04-01 18:13                       ` tmoran
2007-03-31 19:33                   ` Cesar Rabak
2007-03-31 20:11                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-03-30  8:16               ` Markus E Leypold
2007-03-30  9:10               ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-03-30 19:16               ` Pascal Obry
2007-04-01 11:41                 ` Martin Krischik
2007-04-01 17:03                   ` Pascal Obry
2007-04-01 18:13                   ` tmoran
2007-04-16  2:09             ` Brian May
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