[GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Marco Poggioli]

Subject says all.

Thanks in advance,

Marco.

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Chad R. Meiners]

I believe so.  However depending on how critical your application is, you
might consider buying support for the compiler.

"Marco Poggioli" <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> wrote in message
news:r24ojvgrhbeg6k39491cktebc6k3p9bvj6@4ax.com...
>
>
> Subject says all.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Marco.
>
>

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Steve]

So long as your closed source commercial compiler does not include elements
of the GNAT compiler or compilation tools.

The libraries included with GNAT are covered by the GMGPL (Gnat modified
GPL) which specically permits you to link your code against the libraries
and distribute the result.

Disclaimer: The above describes my understanding of the licensing associated
with GNAT.  Don't take my word for it.  I am not a lawyer.  Read the GPL
(which covers GNAT) and the GMGPL, which you'll find in the headers of the
GNAT library modules.

If you have deep enough pockets to afford a support contract from ACT,
please purchase one.  You will not regret it.  The last time I checked,
which was quite some time ago, it was $12K for 10 developer seats for a
year.  A bargain for the level of support they provide.

Steve
(The Duck)

"Marco Poggioli" <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> wrote in message
news:r24ojvgrhbeg6k39491cktebc6k3p9bvj6@4ax.com...
>
>
> Subject says all.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Marco.
>
>

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Marco Poggioli]

On Fri, 15 Aug 2003 03:42:23 GMT, "Steve"
<nospam_steved94@comcast.net> wrote:


I thank You and the other nice guys for the prompt answer.

One last question comes in mind: is the free GNAT stable enough?
Can I trust it like if it were gcc C++ ?

I'm asking  because i'm a single developer
that intends to roll out his own application and to
market it directly to customers, with well defined budget and time
limits.

I  plan to choose Ada over C++ for clarity and maintanability,
and over Java because the latter is proprietary and easily
reverse-engeneered.


Thanks,


Marco.





>So long as your closed source commercial compiler does not include elements
>of the GNAT compiler or compilation tools.
>
>The libraries included with GNAT are covered by the GMGPL (Gnat modified
>GPL) which specically permits you to link your code against the libraries
>and distribute the result.
>
>Disclaimer: The above describes my understanding of the licensing associated
>with GNAT.  Don't take my word for it.  I am not a lawyer.  Read the GPL
>(which covers GNAT) and the GMGPL, which you'll find in the headers of the
>GNAT library modules.
>
>If you have deep enough pockets to afford a support contract from ACT,
>please purchase one.  You will not regret it.  The last time I checked,
>which was quite some time ago, it was $12K for 10 developer seats for a
>year.  A bargain for the level of support they provide.
>
>Steve
>(The Duck)
>
>"Marco Poggioli" <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> wrote in message
>news:r24ojvgrhbeg6k39491cktebc6k3p9bvj6@4ax.com...
>>
>>
>> Subject says all.
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> Marco.
>>
>>
>

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Preben Randhol]

Marco Poggioli wrote:
> I thank You and the other nice guys for the prompt answer.
> 
> One last question comes in mind: is the free GNAT stable enough?

Yes get teh Gnat 3.15p (not the Gnat from gcc 3.x as the whoel gcc 3.x
is unstable at the moment)

> Can I trust it like if it were gcc C++ ?

Depends what you mean by this. Which version etc... Personally I would
trust GNAT more than gcc C++. Besides the Ada language help catch much
more bugs than the C++ compiler.

> I'm asking  because i'm a single developer that intends to roll out
> his own application and to market it directly to customers, with well
> defined budget and time limits.

Don't see why you cannot use Ada (and GNAT).

-- 
�I think fish is nice, but then I think that rain is wet.
 So who am I to judge.�
                 - The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy (radioplay)

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Marco Poggioli (a fake exposed name)]

On Fri, 15 Aug 2003 08:44:57 +0000 (UTC), Preben Randhol
<randhol+abuse@pvv.org> wrote:


>> 
>> One last question comes in mind: is the free GNAT stable enough?
>
>> Can I trust it like if it were gcc C++ ?
>
>Depends what you mean by this. Which version etc... Personally I would
>trust GNAT more than gcc C++. Besides the Ada language help catch much
>more bugs than the C++ compiler.

:-)



>
>Don't see why you cannot use Ada (and GNAT).

Ok. Point taken. count one more on the Ada Bandwagon.



Thanks all.

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Steve]

Yes.  GNAT is stable enough.

I believe you can trust it more than gcc C++.  Is it perfect? No.  Neither
is gcc C++.

Steve
(The Duck)

"Marco Poggioli" <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> wrote in message
news:nv5pjvgc0m3ne47r45cs2uvm8acuts6gee@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 15 Aug 2003 03:42:23 GMT, "Steve"
> <nospam_steved94@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
> I thank You and the other nice guys for the prompt answer.
>
> One last question comes in mind: is the free GNAT stable enough?
> Can I trust it like if it were gcc C++ ?
>
> I'm asking  because i'm a single developer
> that intends to roll out his own application and to
> market it directly to customers, with well defined budget and time
> limits.
>
> I  plan to choose Ada over C++ for clarity and maintanability,
> and over Java because the latter is proprietary and easily
> reverse-engeneered.
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Marco.
>
>
>
>
>
> >So long as your closed source commercial compiler does not include
elements
> >of the GNAT compiler or compilation tools.
> >
> >The libraries included with GNAT are covered by the GMGPL (Gnat modified
> >GPL) which specically permits you to link your code against the libraries
> >and distribute the result.
> >
> >Disclaimer: The above describes my understanding of the licensing
associated
> >with GNAT.  Don't take my word for it.  I am not a lawyer.  Read the GPL
> >(which covers GNAT) and the GMGPL, which you'll find in the headers of
the
> >GNAT library modules.
> >
> >If you have deep enough pockets to afford a support contract from ACT,
> >please purchase one.  You will not regret it.  The last time I checked,
> >which was quite some time ago, it was $12K for 10 developer seats for a
> >year.  A bargain for the level of support they provide.
> >
> >Steve
> >(The Duck)
> >
> >"Marco Poggioli" <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> wrote in message
> >news:r24ojvgrhbeg6k39491cktebc6k3p9bvj6@4ax.com...
> >>
> >>
> >> Subject says all.
> >>
> >> Thanks in advance,
> >>
> >> Marco.
> >>
> >>
> >
>

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Steve]

Oops!  That should have read:

  So long as your closed source commercial application...

But I think you got the message.

Steve
(The Duck)

"Steve" <nospam_steved94@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:hEY_a.148118$uu5.22097@sccrnsc04...
> So long as your closed source commercial compiler does not include lements
> of the GNAT compiler or compilation tools.
>

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Erlo Haugen]

On Thu, 14 Aug 2003 22:42:54 GMT
Marco Poggioli <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> wrote:

> 
> 
> Subject says all.
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Marco.
> 
> 

The GNAT compiler is not certified, afaik.
Just bear that in mind if your project requieres using Ada.

Erlo
-- 
Remove the underscores

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Preben Randhol]

Erlo Haugen wrote:
> 
> The GNAT compiler is not certified, afaik.

Which Gnat compiler are you talking about?

-- 
�I think fish is nice, but then I think that rain is wet.
 So who am I to judge.�
                 - The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy (radioplay)

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Simon Wright]

Erlo Haugen <_elh_@_terma_._com_> writes:

> The GNAT compiler is not certified, afaik.
> Just bear that in mind if your project requieres using Ada.

Nor would GCC's C, C++ compilers be, of course.

I expect you could get GNAT certified, but you would have to pay ACT
quite a bit of money. (The ACATS suite is available for download but
it is not, AIUI, easy to use).

Last time I asked, many Ada compilers' certificates had run out (I may
have misunderstood this).

But in any case, the affordable Ada compilers (public GNAT, Aonix, RR
.. any others?) are all going to do an excellent job for you.

Our viewpoint for our supported GNAT compilers is generally that we
believe the compilers could be validated if our customer wanted to pay
an extra -whatever- over the contract cost, but neither he nor we will
gain from it in practice.

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Robert I. Eachus]

Simon Wright wrote:

> Nor would GCC's C, C++ compilers be, of course.
> 
> I expect you could get GNAT certified, but you would have to pay ACT
> quite a bit of money. (The ACATS suite is available for download but
> it is not, AIUI, easy to use).
> 
> Last time I asked, many Ada compilers' certificates had run out (I may
> have misunderstood this).
> 
> But in any case, the affordable Ada compilers (public GNAT, Aonix, RR
> .. any others?) are all going to do an excellent job for you.
> 
> Our viewpoint for our supported GNAT compilers is generally that we
> believe the compilers could be validated if our customer wanted to pay
> an extra -whatever- over the contract cost, but neither he nor we will
> gain from it in practice.

It doesn't cost that much to get a validated version of GNAT.  It also 
doesn't cost much to run the ACVC tests against your environment.  The 
last time I worked on a project where doing both of those was considered 
good practice, the result was interesting.  The full validation report 
had 18 tests marked as non-applicable for one reason or another, plus 
the usual on number of digits in float types.   Fourteen of those tests 
passed in our environment, and four printed failed.  The first three 
were oh, yeah, no brainers, and the fourth resulted in spending more 
time than running the tests.

I don't want to go into why we spent so much time on the analysis.  I'll 
just say that the system had cryptographic components, and the deviation 
from the RM, while it was perfectly justifiable in terms of compiler 
validation, meant we had to redo part of our analysis of the code 
partitioning.  So in one sense it was all very worthwhile, while in 
another, it was a lot of makework.  (In the end, no code was changed as 
a result.)

--
                                            Robert I. Eachus

"As far as I'm concerned, war always means failure." -- Jacques Chirac, 
President of France
"As far as France is concerned, you're right." -- Rush Limbaugh

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Simon Wright]

"Robert I. Eachus" <rieachus@attbi.com> writes:

> Simon Wright wrote:
> 
> > Nor would GCC's C, C++ compilers be, of course.
> > I expect you could get GNAT certified, but you would have to pay ACT
> > quite a bit of money.

> It doesn't cost that much to get a validated version of GNAT.

Come to think, the quote was for an early run of the certification
process -- it's cheaper if you can agree to defer to a convenient
moment, I guess, perfectly reasonable.

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Pascal Obry]

Marco Poggioli <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> writes:

> Subject says all.

Of course and lot of peoples are doing just that. For a more formal answer
consider sending a message to ACT (sales@gnat.com).

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|         http://perso.wanadoo.fr/pascal.obry
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
--| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Marco Poggioli (a fake exposed name)]

Hi Pascal,

I just came to Your AWS web components, and i would like to know if,

given that the source files  report the same licence as the gnat
libraries, if linking  aws is free for commercial use.

Can i use the packages  in a commercial closed source application
provided that:

- i don't intend to modify aws code but only link to it
- if i should -in a remote future- see some points of amelioration i
would submit the modified code for the aws packages with GNU license ?


Thanks in advance,


Marco.


PS: I'm asking this because of the discrepancy between the clauses i
found in aws source and the ones described on the site
http://libre.act-europe.fr/ for the entire repository of the site
itself.







On 15 Aug 2003 10:47:09 +0200, Pascal Obry <p.obry@wanadoo.fr> wrote:

>
>Marco Poggioli <marco.poggioli@terrazzi.com> writes:
>
>> Subject says all.
>
>Of course and lot of peoples are doing just that. For a more formal answer
>consider sending a message to ACT (sales@gnat.com).
>
>Pascal.

Re: [GNAT commercial USE] -- can i use GNAT to develop a closed source commercial application ?

[Pascal Obry]

Hi Marco,

> I just came to Your AWS web components, and i would like to know if,
> given that the source files  report the same licence as the gnat
> libraries, if linking  aws is free for commercial use.

Yes.

> 
> Can i use the packages  in a commercial closed source application
> provided that:

Yes.

I'm not a lawyer but this was my intent by using the GMGPL (GNAT Modified GPL)
licence.

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|         http://perso.wanadoo.fr/pascal.obry
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
--| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595