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From: Jeffrey Carter <spam.jrcarter.not@spam.acm.not.org>
Subject: Re: Structured exception information
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:38:21 GMT
Date: 2007-01-17T18:38:21+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <x2urh.309672$FQ1.158886@attbi_s71> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1lpy2h06scx34.1i2k4dlbg0nfy.dlg@40tude.net>

Dmitry A. Kazakov wrote:
> 
> I doubt that others could or should be called preconditions.

> The point is that violated preconditions are non-states and cannot be
> handled at all. Provided, that one understands precondition as a method of
> proving program correctness. Otherwise, it is something else.

It's clear that you're locked into the concept of a precondition as part 
of correctness proofs. In that context, yes, you statically prove that 
preconditions are met, and do not need to dynamically test them. This is 
the case with SPARK, for example.

In general, though, preconditions are a useful tool for documenting SW, 
especially SW that will be used by people other than the developer. It's 
a useful way of communicating to the client what he needs to ensure in 
order for the SW to function normally (this condition must be true), and 
the consequences of failing to do so (this exception is raised).

Ideally, you'd use the same syntax for both uses of preconditions. Then 
SW that's written for general use could be used in SW that does 
correctness proofs without changes; without correctness proofs the 
compiler would automatically generate the tests, and with proofs, the 
tests would not be generated.

In retrospect, the syntax I thought up on the spur of the moment in my 
previous post is not very good, since, for a precondition P, what you 
write is not P. That would not be very useful for correctness proofs.



  reply	other threads:[~2007-01-17 18:38 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 181+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2007-01-15 13:44 Structured exception information Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-15 17:17 ` claude.simon
2007-01-16  9:04   ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 22:39     ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-15 17:28 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-15 18:29   ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-15 19:44     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-15 20:06       ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-15 21:56         ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-15 22:32           ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 18:36             ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-16 19:18               ` C# versus Ada (was: Structured exception information) Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-16 23:29                 ` C# versus Ada Markus E Leypold
2007-01-18 10:22                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-17 18:14                 ` C# versus Ada (was: Structured exception information) Ray Blaak
2007-01-16 23:27               ` Structured exception information Markus E Leypold
2007-01-17  7:28               ` Martin Krischik
2007-01-16 22:36             ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 16:12               ` Bob Spooner
2007-01-17 23:42                 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-16  9:11           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 10:45             ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 13:26               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 14:44                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 15:15                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 17:50             ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-16 18:31               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 22:52                 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17  8:58                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-17 18:38                     ` Jeffrey Carter [this message]
2007-01-17 23:18                       ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 23:46                         ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-18  6:34                         ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-19  7:34                           ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-19 13:52                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-19 18:57                               ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-19 19:57                                 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-20 20:59                                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-18  9:55                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-18 18:28                         ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-17 23:36                     ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-18 10:16                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-15 22:19     ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 13:12       ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-15 22:42 ` Adam Beneschan
2007-01-15 23:22   ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16  6:03     ` tmoran
2007-01-16 13:30 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-16 14:33   ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 14:45     ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-16 17:54     ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-16 22:55       ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 12:10     ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-17 14:05       ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-19  9:47         ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-19 11:03           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-20 15:04             ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-21 10:40               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-23  7:28                 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-23 14:21                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-25  2:39                     ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-19 13:36           ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-20 15:33             ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 16:33               ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-21 22:42                 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-21 23:45                   ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-22  9:14                     ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-23  7:33                     ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-23 15:07                       ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-23 15:54                         ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-23 17:10                           ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-23 23:59                       ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-22  9:28               ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-23  9:46                 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-23 14:18                   ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-25  2:32                     ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-25  8:53                       ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-26  9:35                         ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-26 11:16                           ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-26 13:46                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-27 18:17                             ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-28 12:38                               ` Simon Wright
2007-01-28 12:39                               ` Simon Wright
2007-01-28 13:18                               ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-28 15:44                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-28 21:48                                 ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-28 18:50                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30  2:15                                 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-31 18:58                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-02-01 12:20                                     ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-01 14:17                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-25 21:52                       ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-24  0:10                   ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-24 14:17                     ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-24 14:49                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-24 23:48                         ` Wasteful internationalization Björn Persson
2007-01-25  9:45                           ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-24 21:03                       ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Randy Brukardt
2007-01-25 11:17                         ` Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-25 21:37                           ` Wasteful internationalization Björn Persson
2007-01-25 21:57                           ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Randy Brukardt
2007-01-26  9:13                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-26 12:12                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-27  4:09                               ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-27 17:15                             ` Wasteful internationalization Stephen Leake
2007-01-27 20:44                               ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-28  0:09                                 ` Björn Persson
2007-01-28  1:08                                   ` Björn Persson
2007-01-28 15:21                                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-29  1:23                                       ` Larry Kilgallen
2007-01-29 19:02                                         ` Björn Persson
2007-01-29 20:19                                           ` Larry Kilgallen
2007-02-01  6:23                                             ` Simon Wright
2007-02-03  0:48                                             ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03  1:04                                               ` Adam Beneschan
2007-02-03 11:52                                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
2007-02-03  2:36                                               ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03  2:37                                                 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03 19:59                                                 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03 20:16                                                   ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-05 19:26                                                     ` Björn Persson
2007-02-04  4:51                                                   ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2007-02-05 19:27                                                     ` Björn Persson
2007-02-06  1:32                                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2007-02-06  1:54                                                     ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-07  1:55                                                       ` Björn Persson
2007-02-07  2:20                                                         ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-12  1:33                                                           ` Björn Persson
2007-02-12  8:16                                                             ` Franz Kruse
2007-02-12  9:20                                                             ` Not at all wasteful internationalization Martin Krischik
2007-02-12 11:08                                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-02-12 13:02                                                                 ` Martin Krischik
2007-02-07 20:39                                                         ` Wasteful internationalization Randy Brukardt
2007-02-08 13:33                                                           ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-12  2:42                                                           ` Björn Persson
2007-02-06 11:01                                                     ` Peter Hermann
2007-02-06 19:02                                                     ` OT: Flash (was: Re: Wasteful internationalization) Jeffrey R. Carter
2007-02-06 19:40                                                       ` OT: Flash Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03 11:51                                               ` Wasteful internationalization Larry Kilgallen
2007-01-29 18:54                                       ` Björn Persson
2007-01-29 19:03                                         ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-30 17:46                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 19:37                                             ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-30 20:43                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 20:50                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 21:54                                                 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-31 11:26                                               ` Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-31 15:17                                                 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03  0:49                                                 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03 16:05                                                   ` Alex R. Mosteo
2007-02-03  0:48                                               ` Björn Persson
2007-02-01 12:08                                             ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-03  0:49                                               ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03  9:46                                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-02-03 18:48                                                 ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-03 20:27                                                   ` Björn Persson
2007-01-30  2:20                                       ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-30 10:01                         ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Harald Korneliussen
2007-01-19 15:45           ` Structured exception information Robert A Duff
2007-01-20 16:08             ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 21:59               ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-19 18:14           ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-19 20:07           ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-20 16:16             ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 21:20               ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-21 22:34                 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 22:07               ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-21 10:45                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-21 23:51                   ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-22 14:39                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-22 19:02                       ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-23 14:23                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-29  1:30   ` Brian May
2007-01-16 13:30 ` Structured exception information (task, ANEX E) Martin Krischik
2007-01-16 23:07   ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-19 16:01   ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-22  7:17     ` Martin Krischik
2007-01-22 19:40       ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 15:48 ` Structured exception information Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-16 18:07   ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-17  6:38     ` Duncan Sands
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