From: Stephen Leake <stephen_leake@stephe-leake.org>
Subject: Re: Structured exception information
Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2007 11:16:16 -0500
Date: 2007-01-20T11:16:16-05:00 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <u1wlpy8q7.fsf@stephe-leake.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: wccd55alqzu.fsf@shell01.TheWorld.com
Robert A Duff <bobduff@shell01.TheWorld.com> writes:
> Stephen Leake <stephen_leake@stephe-leake.org> writes:
>
>> So far, you have presented no case to show I am wrong.
>
> By now, several cases have been presented. Are you convinced?
Well, none were very detailed.
But I agree there are times when some more structure is needed.
I'm certainly not willing to give up any of Ada's other features to
get it.
> To me, it seems pretty simple: if you restrict the type of anything
> (parameters, variables, exception-data) to be String, you're losing
> type information.
That's true. But the devil is in the details.
>> If you look into the details of "structured exception handling" in
>> other languages and implementations, they have bugs, and fundamental
>> flaws in design.
>
> Please be more specific.
Well, I can't. I plead guilty to arguing from authority and vague
memory on this one. The memory is of discussions of problems with
various exception implementations in C++ and Java, on other
newsgroups.
I _believe_ that if you read the discussions of attempting to add
structured exceptions to Ada, you will find these arguments.
Obviously, you are closer to that than I am.
>> So if you find yourself fighting Ada to do something, you need to step
>> back and think more carefully about _why_ you are doing it that way.
>> Ada is telling you it is inherently unsafe.
>
> Well, I suppose I should be flattered, given that I was one of the
> designers of Ada 95. But the fact is: we made mistakes. If Ada is
> telling you "it is inherently unsafe", perhaps Ada is simply wrong.
That's certainly possible.
But I still find it a useful approach, especially since I'm stuck with
today's Ada language :).
I look forward to proposals for safe structured exceptions in Ada 2015 :).
--
-- Stephe
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2007-01-20 16:16 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 181+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2007-01-15 13:44 Structured exception information Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-15 17:17 ` claude.simon
2007-01-16 9:04 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 22:39 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-15 17:28 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-15 18:29 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-15 19:44 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-15 20:06 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-15 21:56 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-15 22:32 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 18:36 ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-16 19:18 ` C# versus Ada (was: Structured exception information) Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-16 23:29 ` C# versus Ada Markus E Leypold
2007-01-18 10:22 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-17 18:14 ` C# versus Ada (was: Structured exception information) Ray Blaak
2007-01-16 23:27 ` Structured exception information Markus E Leypold
2007-01-17 7:28 ` Martin Krischik
2007-01-16 22:36 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 16:12 ` Bob Spooner
2007-01-17 23:42 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-16 9:11 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 10:45 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 13:26 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 14:44 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 15:15 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 17:50 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-16 18:31 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-16 22:52 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 8:58 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-17 18:38 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-17 23:18 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 23:46 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-18 6:34 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-19 7:34 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-19 13:52 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-19 18:57 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-19 19:57 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-20 20:59 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-18 9:55 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-18 18:28 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-17 23:36 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-18 10:16 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-15 22:19 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 13:12 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-15 22:42 ` Adam Beneschan
2007-01-15 23:22 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 6:03 ` tmoran
2007-01-16 13:30 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-16 14:33 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-16 14:45 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-16 17:54 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-16 22:55 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-17 12:10 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-17 14:05 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-19 9:47 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-19 11:03 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-20 15:04 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-21 10:40 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-23 7:28 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-23 14:21 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-25 2:39 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-19 13:36 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-20 15:33 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 16:33 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-21 22:42 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-21 23:45 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-22 9:14 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-23 7:33 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-23 15:07 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-23 15:54 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-23 17:10 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-23 23:59 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-22 9:28 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-23 9:46 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-23 14:18 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-25 2:32 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-25 8:53 ` Maciej Sobczak
2007-01-26 9:35 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-26 11:16 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-26 13:46 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-27 18:17 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-28 12:38 ` Simon Wright
2007-01-28 12:39 ` Simon Wright
2007-01-28 13:18 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-28 15:44 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-28 21:48 ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-28 18:50 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 2:15 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-31 18:58 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-02-01 12:20 ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-01 14:17 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-25 21:52 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-24 0:10 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-24 14:17 ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-24 14:49 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-24 23:48 ` Wasteful internationalization Björn Persson
2007-01-25 9:45 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-24 21:03 ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Randy Brukardt
2007-01-25 11:17 ` Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-25 21:37 ` Wasteful internationalization Björn Persson
2007-01-25 21:57 ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Randy Brukardt
2007-01-26 9:13 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-26 12:12 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-27 4:09 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-27 17:15 ` Wasteful internationalization Stephen Leake
2007-01-27 20:44 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-28 0:09 ` Björn Persson
2007-01-28 1:08 ` Björn Persson
2007-01-28 15:21 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-29 1:23 ` Larry Kilgallen
2007-01-29 19:02 ` Björn Persson
2007-01-29 20:19 ` Larry Kilgallen
2007-02-01 6:23 ` Simon Wright
2007-02-03 0:48 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03 1:04 ` Adam Beneschan
2007-02-03 11:52 ` Larry Kilgallen
2007-02-03 2:36 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03 2:37 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03 19:59 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03 20:16 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-05 19:26 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-04 4:51 ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2007-02-05 19:27 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-06 1:32 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-02-06 1:54 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-07 1:55 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-07 2:20 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-12 1:33 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-12 8:16 ` Franz Kruse
2007-02-12 9:20 ` Not at all wasteful internationalization Martin Krischik
2007-02-12 11:08 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-02-12 13:02 ` Martin Krischik
2007-02-07 20:39 ` Wasteful internationalization Randy Brukardt
2007-02-08 13:33 ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-12 2:42 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-06 11:01 ` Peter Hermann
2007-02-06 19:02 ` OT: Flash (was: Re: Wasteful internationalization) Jeffrey R. Carter
2007-02-06 19:40 ` OT: Flash Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03 11:51 ` Wasteful internationalization Larry Kilgallen
2007-01-29 18:54 ` Björn Persson
2007-01-29 19:03 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-30 17:46 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 19:37 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-30 20:43 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 20:50 ` Georg Bauhaus
2007-01-30 21:54 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-01-31 11:26 ` Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-31 15:17 ` Markus E Leypold
2007-02-03 0:49 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03 16:05 ` Alex R. Mosteo
2007-02-03 0:48 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-01 12:08 ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-03 0:49 ` Björn Persson
2007-02-03 9:46 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-02-03 18:48 ` Stephen Leake
2007-02-03 20:27 ` Björn Persson
2007-01-30 2:20 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-30 10:01 ` Wasteful internationalization (Was: Structured exception information) Harald Korneliussen
2007-01-19 15:45 ` Structured exception information Robert A Duff
2007-01-20 16:08 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 21:59 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-19 18:14 ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-19 20:07 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-20 16:16 ` Stephen Leake [this message]
2007-01-20 21:20 ` Ray Blaak
2007-01-21 22:34 ` Stephen Leake
2007-01-20 22:07 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-21 10:45 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-21 23:51 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-22 14:39 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-22 19:02 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-23 14:23 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2007-01-29 1:30 ` Brian May
2007-01-16 13:30 ` Structured exception information (task, ANEX E) Martin Krischik
2007-01-16 23:07 ` Randy Brukardt
2007-01-19 16:01 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-22 7:17 ` Martin Krischik
2007-01-22 19:40 ` Robert A Duff
2007-01-16 15:48 ` Structured exception information Alex R. Mosteo
2007-01-16 18:07 ` Jeffrey Carter
2007-01-17 6:38 ` Duncan Sands
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