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* GDB Woes Continued...
@ 1998-01-31  0:00 wanker
  1998-01-31  0:00 ` Jerry van Dijk
  1998-02-02  0:00 ` Stephen Leake
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 32+ messages in thread
From: wanker @ 1998-01-31  0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)




Hello everyone,

I'm running the latest version of GDB for WinNT on Win95
(I was told it should work with the latest GNAT WinNT distribution),
and I just want to check on a few things:

1) Does GDB decide to spontaneously abort half the time you
   load an executable?

2) Does GDB bring your entire system down to its knees when you
   try to quit?

3) Is the online help broken?  When you click on anything, does
   it whine about not finding stdout or some Unix-ish nonsense?

4) Does GDB expect you to debug in C, even though you just
   wrote your code in Ada?

I'm asking these questions because GDB is giving me all these
problems and more (no native look and feel, ad nauseum).  

RTFM? Sure, once I find the FM!

With the online help being broken and nothing remotely resembling
documentation to be found, I can't find any information on this
at all.

I'm sorry if you are sick of hearing from me, but there is no
where else to turn.  Nothing works, and the documentation
(when it is to be found) is 100% useless or worse (misleading).

The only thing now keeping me from reverting to C/C++ (at least
I know their distributions work), is the fact that there are
people here who claim to actually have this stuff working, so
I still have some glimmer of hope.  

Thanks, and my email address is buggered so please post answers
here.





^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 32+ messages in thread
* Re: GDB Woes Continued...
@ 1998-02-02  0:00 Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96
  1998-02-05  0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 32+ messages in thread
From: Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96 @ 1998-02-02  0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)



Robert Dewar <dewar@MERV.CS.NYU.EDU> writes:
>However, to explain my comment above. I continue to think that most people
>greatly overuse debuggers. It is much better to write error-free code in
>the first place, and if you do have errors, to think about what is wrong,
>and fix it, rather than spending ages in a debugger looking arond.
>
    This is very true for most types of "workstation-ish" programs. In
    most of the things I've built using Gnat on a Sun platform, I've
    found very little use for a debugger because you can usually bench
    check the code to be mostly error free from the beginning. (At
    least for the kinds of errors most commonly found with a debugger.
    If the program executes, but doesn't perform the task correctly
    because you've messed up a requirement somewhere, the debugger is
    going to be of little value.) Bench checking for routine errors
    also invariably leads to: "Gee! That's not supposed to be here..."
    sorts of discoveries which tend to minimize the fundamental flaws
    you don't see when checking for superficial flaws with a debugger.

    My experience is that the more clear you are about what a program
    or piece of a program is supposed to do, the more likely you are
    to get it right the first time. Some folks can do this in their
    heads up front - sometimes it has to come from more formal
    methods. But either way, if you understand it thoroughly, you tend
    to write clear, direct, to-the-point code which doesn't need to be
    debugged.

    Although I don't use gdb that much, I still think it's handy -
    especially when you end up with an error during elaboration &
    don't get a traceback to know what module caused the trouble. Gdb
    is pretty good at filling that gap. I'd have to agree that there
    is a bit of a dearth of good documentation, but with what's
    available that I've seen, you can get it to work.

>We have certainly found NT to be much more reliable than Win95, and most
>of our customers using the NT/WIn95 version of GNAT are indeed using NT.
>GDB itself has always been more stable under NT (the delay in releasing
>it was solely because of the Win95 problems, since we realize that users
>of the public version are more likely NOT to be serious developers and to
>be fiddling with Win95).
>
    I've driven Win95 around a bit on laptops and other platforms and
    my experience is that it is a pretty pathetic attempt to label
    something an operating system. I've never had much trouble getting
    Win95 to crash - even using Micro$oft's own software. Granted, my
    experience is limited - a little like my experience with sitting
    on hot stoves, or poking sharp objects into my eyes. Maybe you get
    used to it after a while.

    WinNT has performed for me quite reliably. I've occasionally had
    some applications go casters-up, but they have never taken down
    the whole system. For any sort of serious development I'd find
    WinNT the right way to go.... with a single caveat:

    From what I've been able to determine, you can't really use WinNT
    successfully for real time work if by "real time" you mean cycle
    times under 20 milliseconds. (O.K., maybe if WinNT doesn't have to
    drive anything but your app, you can make things predictable. But
    if the machine runs your app and may also be called on to run
    other apps, you have some real problems with guaranteeing
    latencies such as responding to interrupts.) For some of these
    apps, you might be better off working with an MS-DOS environment,
    because you can pretty much move MS-DOS out of your way and
    guarantee response based on the bare hardware.

    And for real time (embedded) apps you'll find me changing my tune
    entirely about debuggers because this is usually the only
    visibility you have into what the software is doing. So much so
    that we build our lab tests for embedded boxes around a home grown
    debugger.

    MDC

Marin David Condic, Senior Computer Engineer     Voice:     561.796.8997
Pratt & Whitney GESP, M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600  Fax:       561.796.4669
West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600                  Internet:  CONDICMA@PWFL.COM
=============================================================================
    "Languages don't kill people. *Programmers* do!"
        --  Rich Stewart - Language Lawyer & Language Control Opponent.
=============================================================================




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 32+ messages in thread
* Re: GDB Woes Continued...
@ 1998-02-02  0:00 Robert Dewar
  1998-02-04  0:00 ` Anonymous
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 32+ messages in thread
From: Robert Dewar @ 1998-02-02  0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)



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Car has had only two owners, runs wonderfully, is in very good shape and
looks great.  I have major-maintenance records since my purchase (1992).
Car gets great gas mileage, rarely needs any oil between changes
(performed regularly)

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Have I revealed too much?  Folks who know Volvos, know that this is a
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Contact Chuck Taylor for more information or to see vehicle:
977-1729 or e-mail cwt9s@virginia.edu (no office calls please)


--
                    Charles W. Taylor, III
     Station Manager, WTJU-FM   University of Virginia
Land Line:  804-924-0885           E-mail:  cwt9s@virginia.edu
      WWW Homepage: http://www.virginia.edu/~wtju






^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 32+ messages in thread
* Re: GDB Woes Continued...
@ 1998-02-02  0:00 tmoran
  1998-02-02  0:00 ` wanker
  1998-02-02  0:00 ` Robert Dewar
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 32+ messages in thread
From: tmoran @ 1998-02-02  0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)



>deleted it from my system because there wasn't a useful debugger
>available.  Without being able to debug my code, ...
  Did your Ada system give source code walkbacks on unhandled
exceptions, or (in Ada 95) in Ada.Exceptions.Exception_Information?
I find *much* less usage of the debugger now that I have those.




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 32+ messages in thread
* Re: GDB Woes Continued...
@ 1998-02-03  0:00 Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96
  1998-02-04  0:00 ` Robert Dewar
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 32+ messages in thread
From: Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96 @ 1998-02-03  0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)



wanker@EXPLOITED.BARMY.ARMY writes:
>In article <6b50fl$knt@lotho.delphi.com>,  <tmoran@bix.com> wrote:
>>>deleted it from my system because there wasn't a useful debugger
>>>available.  Without being able to debug my code, ...
>>  Did your Ada system give source code walkbacks on unhandled
>>exceptions, or (in Ada 95) in Ada.Exceptions.Exception_Information?
>>I find *much* less usage of the debugger now that I have those.
>
>Unfortunately, it did not give me any sort of walkback.
>

    If you are using gdb, try these instructions to get a traceback.
    It's bailed me out more than once:

    Instructions for getting the Gnat Debugger to do a stack dump
    (traceback) when some crash is occurring.

    1) Compile and link with debug options set.

        gnatmake -f -g <main unit> -largs g

    2) Run program with GDB as documentation indicates.

        gdb <program name>

    (gdb) break __gnat_unhandled_exception
    (gdb) run
    (gdb) backtrace
    (gdb) quit


    Good luck with it...

    MDC

Marin David Condic, Senior Computer Engineer     Voice:     561.796.8997
Pratt & Whitney GESP, M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600  Fax:       561.796.4669
West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600                  Internet:  CONDICMA@PWFL.COM
=============================================================================
    "I filled out an application that said, 'In Case Of Emergency
    Notify'. I wrote 'Doctor'... What's my mother going to do?"
        --  Steven Wright
=============================================================================




^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 32+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~1998-02-09  0:00 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 32+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
1998-01-31  0:00 GDB Woes Continued wanker
1998-01-31  0:00 ` Jerry van Dijk
1998-02-02  0:00   ` Roger Racine
1998-02-02  0:00     ` wanker
1998-02-02  0:00       ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-03  0:00         ` Ronald Cole
1998-02-03  0:00           ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-04  0:00             ` Roger Racine
1998-02-04  0:00               ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-04  0:00                 ` Roger Racine
1998-02-04  0:00                   ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-04  0:00             ` Jerry van Dijk
1998-02-05  0:00               ` Larry Kilgallen
1998-02-09  0:00               ` Martin C. Carlisle
1998-02-04  0:00             ` Andrew Lynch
1998-02-02  0:00       ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-02  0:00         ` Larry Kilgallen
1998-02-04  0:00         ` John English
1998-02-04  0:00           ` nA edisA Nick Roberts
1998-02-02  0:00   ` GDB Woes Continued Martin C. Carlisle
1998-02-03  0:00   ` vonhend
1998-02-02  0:00 ` Stephen Leake
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
1998-02-02  0:00 Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96
1998-02-05  0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1998-02-02  0:00 Robert Dewar
1998-02-04  0:00 ` Anonymous
1998-02-04  0:00   ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-02  0:00 tmoran
1998-02-02  0:00 ` wanker
1998-02-02  0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1998-02-03  0:00 Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96
1998-02-04  0:00 ` Robert Dewar

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