Re: RE: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

Re: RE: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

[Ted Dennison]

In article <mailman.989428626.10442.comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org>, Beard, Frank
says...
>However, the ObjectAda (for Windows) IDE does allow you
..
>It has most of what I consider to be necessary features:

I consider a macro facility to be necessary (ever needed to space over 4 spaces
in 300 declarations, or create a declaration for each number in another file?),
and I notice its not in your list.

>But I hate the way you open a file in emacs.  I like the
>GUI approach of popping up an Open Dialog box to allow you
>to browse to a file.  ObjectAda has a Project window that

The way I open a file in emacs is by hitting ctrl-D to bring up dired-mode on
one of the file's parent directories. Then I browse down the directory tree
until I find the file by using the 'f' or "Enter" key. It doesn't sound
significatly different.

Sometimes, using emacs' file name completion I don't need to go through all that
effort. The Windows Open Dialog has no such capability.

---
T.E.D.    homepage   - http://www.telepath.com/dennison/Ted/TED.html
          home email - mailto:dennison@telepath.com

Re: RE: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

[Ted Dennison]

In article <mailman.989428626.10442.comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org>, Beard, Frank
says...
>However, the ObjectAda (for Windows) IDE does allow you
..
>It has most of what I consider to be necessary features:

I consider a macro facility to be necessary (ever needed to space over 4 spaces
in 300 declarations, or create a declaration for each number in another file?),
and I notice its not in your list.

>But I hate the way you open a file in emacs.  I like the
>GUI approach of popping up an Open Dialog box to allow you
>to browse to a file.  ObjectAda has a Project window that

The way I open a file in emacs is by hitting ctrl-D to bring up dired-mode on
one of the file's parent directories. Then I browse down the directory tree
until I find the file by using the 'f' or "Enter" key. It doesn't sound
significatly different.

Sometimes, using emacs' file name completion I don't need to go through all that
effort. The Windows Open Dialog has no such capability.

---
T.E.D.    homepage   - http://www.telepath.com/dennison/Ted/TED.html
          home email - mailto:dennison@telepath.com

RE: RE: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

[Beard, Frank]

-----Original Message-----
From: Ted Dennison [mailto:dennison@telepath.com]

> I consider a macro facility to be necessary (ever needed to space over 4
spaces
> in 300 declarations, or create a declaration for each number in another
file?),
> and I notice its not in your list.

I was listing what it has, not what it is missing.  As far as the 4 spaces
example,
if you are talking about indenting the 300 declarations over 4 spaces, then
yes
that is the indent/unindent that I listed.  If you are talking about adding
4 spaces
in the middle of a line, as in wanting to move the colons (:) in the
declarations 
over 4 spaces to keep them all lined up, then that is what I called the
"repeat"
feature from emacs, which I do miss.  But it is far from a monumental
problem unless
you have a huge number of lines involved, which doesn't seem to happen that
often.

> The way I open a file in emacs is by hitting ctrl-D to bring up dired-mode
on
> one of the file's parent directories. Then I browse down the directory
tree
> until I find the file by using the 'f' or "Enter" key. It doesn't sound
> significatly different.

You're right, it is similar, but less user friendly and less aesthetically
pleasing,
at least to me.

> Sometimes, using emacs' file name completion I don't need to go through
all that
> effort. The Windows Open Dialog has no such capability.

That's not exactly true, it does have something similar, in that after you
bring up
the dialog box (just as in the ObjectAda project window), if you begin
typing
characters, it will jump you to the nearest matching name.  Then you can
pick from
that part of the list.  Windows Explorer works the same way.

I really don't want to start an editor war.  Everyone has their own
preference.
Emacs is a powerful editor (as is vi).  I just don't like the more primitive
look
and feel.

Frank

Re: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

[Gary Scott]

If you're using windows, Kedit for Windows has the best of both worlds,
either GUI or command line or both in whatever mixture you might need.
Emulate virtually any other editor, extremely powerful macros and native
command set.  Not sure if there's a syntax highlighting recognition file
for Ada, but fairly easy to create one that's reasonably comprehensive. 
http://www.kedit.com  I mix usage with Visual Studio by adding Kedit to
the "tools" menu.

"Beard, Frank" wrote:
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ted Dennison [mailto:dennison@telepath.com]
> 
> > I consider a macro facility to be necessary (ever needed to space over 4
> spaces
> > in 300 declarations, or create a declaration for each number in another
> file?),
> > and I notice its not in your list.
> 
> I was listing what it has, not what it is missing.  As far as the 4 spaces
> example,
> if you are talking about indenting the 300 declarations over 4 spaces, then
> yes
> that is the indent/unindent that I listed.  If you are talking about adding
> 4 spaces
> in the middle of a line, as in wanting to move the colons (:) in the
> declarations
> over 4 spaces to keep them all lined up, then that is what I called the
> "repeat"
> feature from emacs, which I do miss.  But it is far from a monumental
> problem unless
> you have a huge number of lines involved, which doesn't seem to happen that
> often.
> 
> > The way I open a file in emacs is by hitting ctrl-D to bring up dired-mode
> on
> > one of the file's parent directories. Then I browse down the directory
> tree
> > until I find the file by using the 'f' or "Enter" key. It doesn't sound
> > significatly different.
> 
> You're right, it is similar, but less user friendly and less aesthetically
> pleasing,
> at least to me.
> 
> > Sometimes, using emacs' file name completion I don't need to go through
> all that
> > effort. The Windows Open Dialog has no such capability.
> 
> That's not exactly true, it does have something similar, in that after you
> bring up
> the dialog box (just as in the ObjectAda project window), if you begin
> typing
> characters, it will jump you to the nearest matching name.  Then you can
> pick from
> that part of the list.  Windows Explorer works the same way.
> 
> I really don't want to start an editor war.  Everyone has their own
> preference.
> Emacs is a powerful editor (as is vi).  I just don't like the more primitive
> look
> and feel.
> 
> Frank

Re: RE: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

[Larry Kilgallen]

In article <hSfK6.8063$vg1.667986@www.newsranger.com>, Ted Dennison<dennison@telepath.com> writes:
> In article <mailman.989428626.10442.comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org>, Beard, Frank
> says...
>>However, the ObjectAda (for Windows) IDE does allow you
> ..
>>It has most of what I consider to be necessary features:
> 
> I consider a macro facility to be necessary (ever needed to space over 4 spaces
> in 300 declarations, or create a declaration for each number in another file?),
> and I notice its not in your list.

Although I prefer TECO (somewhat more powerful than a Macro facility),
if those 300 lines are adjacent the feature I hear GUI editor fans
espouse is "rectangular cut and paste".

Re: powerful editors versus IDEs (was: License to Steal)

[Aron Felix Gurski]

Gary Scott wrote:
> 
> If you're using windows, Kedit for Windows has the best of both worlds,
> either GUI or command line or both in whatever mixture you might need.
> Emulate virtually any other editor, extremely powerful macros and native
> command set.  Not sure if there's a syntax highlighting recognition file
> for Ada, but fairly easy to create one that's reasonably comprehensive.
> http://www.kedit.com  I mix usage with Visual Studio by adding Kedit to
> the "tools" menu.

A non-commercial equivalent of KEdit (or IBM's XEdit) is available; it's called
THE and can be found at

	http://www.lightlink.com/hessling/THE/index.html

It's available for the Win* as well as the Un*x platforms.

-- 
        -- Aron

NB: To reply by e-mail, remove "spam-block." from my address.
- - - - - - - - - - -
There has been an alarming increase in the number of things about which you know
absolutely nothing.