comp.lang.ada
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From: Simon Clubley <clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP>
Subject: Re: a new language, designed for safety !
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 22:50:46 +0000 (UTC)
Date: 2014-06-06T22:50:46+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <lmtgk6$fji$1@dont-email.me> (raw)
In-Reply-To: wcc38fhhnvn.fsf@shell01.TheWorld.com

On 2014-06-06, Robert A Duff <bobduff@shell01.TheWorld.com> wrote:
>
> You are mixing up "safe" as applied to programming language features,
> and "safe" as in the real-world sense of preventing injury and death.
> Sorry for the misunderstanding, but the rest of your rant doesn't apply
> to anything I actually said -- as if I advocate ignition keys that kill
> (sheesh!).
>
> Unsafe programming language features can cause injury or death
> -- but only in safety critical systems.  (E.g. dangling dispatch
> in Objective C won't kill anybody if the program is a word processor.)
> But safe programming language features can cause injury or death, too
> (in safety critical systems).  You see the difference?
>

Indeed. There's nothing to stop you from creating the next Therac-25
using Ada. That's why the language is only one part of the safety
critical process.

However, languages like Ada are _very_ useful in the problem areas
which don't justify a full safety critical process and where you rely
a lot more on the language itself.

A really good example are the security libraries at the core of the
applications in use on the Internet. Unfortunately, for reasons
previously discussed, you are not going to be able to replace
OpenSSL (for example) with a Ada version. (Sadly :-()

Simon.

-- 
Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Microsoft: Bringing you 1980s technology to a 21st century world


  reply	other threads:[~2014-06-06 22:50 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 285+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-06-03  1:37 a new language, designed for safety ! Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-06-04  0:21 ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-04  1:19   ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-04  4:05     ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-04  6:59       ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-04  4:12     ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-04  5:44   ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-04 15:25 ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-04 19:43   ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-04 21:32     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-05  9:13     ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-06-05 15:33       ` Adam Beneschan
2014-06-05 19:19         ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-05 15:55       ` Adam Beneschan
2014-06-05 19:15         ` sbelmont700
2014-06-05 22:40       ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-06 15:13         ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-06 17:51           ` G.B.
2014-06-06 18:39             ` Niklas Holsti
2014-06-06 19:43               ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-06 20:42                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-08  9:40               ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-08 13:56                 ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-08 16:13                   ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-08 17:22                     ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-08 19:36                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-09  5:30                       ` Niklas Holsti
2014-06-09  7:06                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-09 16:07                           ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-10  7:44                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-10 16:31                               ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-10 16:52                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-06 18:52           ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-06 22:50             ` Simon Clubley [this message]
2014-06-23  0:40       ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-23  0:43         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-23  0:51           ` Shark8
2014-06-23  1:47             ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-06-23  6:46               ` Shark8
2014-06-23 14:17             ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-23 15:39               ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-23 17:04               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-05  8:26   ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-09 10:03 ` Pascal Obry
2014-06-10  9:36   ` Stephen Leake
2014-06-10 10:48     ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-10 18:31       ` Pascal Obry
2014-06-23  1:01         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-10 12:28     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-10 12:42       ` Lucretia
2014-06-10 12:50         ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-10 13:00           ` Lucretia
2014-06-10 14:43             ` Brad Moore
2014-06-10 15:15               ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-10 20:28                 ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-10 20:39                   ` Pascal Obry
2014-06-10 21:04                     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-11  7:17                       ` Pascal Obry
2014-06-25 22:37                         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-10 22:09                   ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-12 23:58                     ` Shark8
2014-06-13  1:28                       ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-25 22:41                         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26  1:36                           ` Shark8
2014-06-26 10:19                           ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-25 22:40                     ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26  7:39                       ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-26  7:42                         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26 10:07                           ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-26 10:18                       ` J-P. Rosen
2014-07-02 22:06                         ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-11  0:16                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-11  7:29                     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-11 19:22                       ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-12 11:48                         ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-12 16:59                           ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-10 15:33               ` Lucretia
2014-06-10 16:31                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-10 19:34                   ` Tero Koskinen
2014-06-11  6:46                     ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-11  8:45                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-11  9:05                       ` Simon Wright
2014-06-11 12:09                       ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-11 12:34                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-11 12:42                           ` björn lundin
2014-06-11 13:04                           ` Lucretia
2014-06-11 12:11                     ` björn lundin
2014-06-10 19:49                 ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-10 22:09                   ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-11  9:01                     ` Simon Wright
2014-06-16 16:22                     ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-16 17:11                       ` Ada platforms and pricing, was: " Simon Clubley
2014-06-17 19:34                         ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-17 20:16                           ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-18  5:56                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-18  6:34                               ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-06-18 19:57                           ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-19  3:46                             ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-22 19:50                               ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-22 23:38                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-23  6:18                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2014-06-23  7:42                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-23 11:17                                       ` Simon Wright
2014-06-23 17:14                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-23 19:21                                           ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-23 20:14                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-23 21:48                                               ` Simon Wright
2014-06-24  1:18                                                 ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-06-24  2:15                                                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-24  7:51                                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-23 21:52                                               ` Simon Wright
2014-06-24  1:04                                                 ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-26  3:24                                               ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26  3:27                                                 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-24  1:01                                             ` Shark8
2014-06-24 10:24                                               ` Simon Wright
2014-06-24 11:25                                                 ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-24 15:55                                                   ` Shark8
2014-06-24 18:06                                                     ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-24 18:44                                                       ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-24 18:49                                                       ` Shark8
2014-06-24 21:25                                                         ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-24 16:48                                                   ` Simon Wright
2014-06-26  3:41                                                   ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-23 20:40                                           ` Simon Wright
2014-06-24  7:48                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-23 11:48                                       ` G.B.
2014-06-24  7:52                                       ` Maciej Sobczak
2014-06-24  8:33                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-07-01 10:28                                           ` Simon Wright
2014-07-01 12:41                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-26  2:50                                         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26 10:04                                           ` G.B.
2014-06-26 18:20                                             ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-25 17:24                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2014-06-26  2:43                                       ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-23  7:31                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-23 20:08                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-23 20:20                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-24 11:56                                         ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-24 12:13                                   ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-17 20:27                         ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-18  7:09                           ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-18 10:32                             ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-18 11:50                               ` Brian Drummond
2014-06-18 17:34                               ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-18 17:56                                 ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-19  7:22                                   ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-19 12:02                                     ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-20  7:03                                       ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-19 13:33                                     ` Lucretia
2014-06-20  7:07                                       ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-20 11:44                                         ` Lucretia
2014-06-20 12:47                                           ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2014-06-18 18:24                                 ` Lucretia
2014-06-19  7:26                                   ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-18 18:47                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-18 20:17                                   ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-18 22:51                                     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-19  8:51                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-19  3:35                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-19  7:34                                   ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-19  8:19                                     ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-19  9:11                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-19 12:08                                       ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-19 13:48                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-19 20:59                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-26  2:04                                           ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26 22:24                                             ` Shark8
2014-06-26 22:44                                               ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-26 22:51                                                 ` Shark8
2014-06-27 12:43                                               ` Ada platforms and pricing, was: Re: a new language, anon
2014-06-19 21:13                                         ` Ada platforms and pricing, was: Re: a new language, designed for safety ! Robert A Duff
2014-06-19 23:47                                           ` Adam Beneschan
2014-06-19 21:03                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-20  7:26                                       ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-20 19:50                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-21  8:35                                           ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-22 23:26                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-26  2:16                                             ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-20  9:54                                   ` anon
2014-06-20 12:25                                     ` Lucretia
2014-06-20 19:32                                       ` Ada platforms and pricing, was: Re: a new language, designed for anon
2014-06-18 17:01                             ` Ada platforms and pricing, was: Re: a new language, designed for safety ! Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-19  7:53                               ` Natasha Kerensikova
2014-06-19 21:10                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-19 22:27                                   ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-16 21:31                       ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-16 23:02                         ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-17 11:14                           ` gvdschoot
2014-06-17 17:42                             ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-17 12:56                           ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-17 17:43                             ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-17 19:46                               ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2014-06-26  1:20                                 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-17 19:41                             ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-17 20:08                               ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-18  5:46                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-18  8:02                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-18  9:34                                     ` G.B.
2014-06-18 12:30                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-18 14:43                                         ` G.B.
2014-06-18 16:39                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-20  8:27                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-25 22:43                 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-12 23:56               ` Shark8
2014-06-10 20:22         ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-10 21:14           ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-10 22:09             ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-10 22:09           ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-11  0:05           ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-11  7:32             ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-11 16:50               ` G.B.
2014-06-11 19:20               ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-12  7:01                 ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-12 17:46                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-12 21:40                     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-13  6:37                       ` J-P. Rosen
2014-06-13 12:03                         ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-13 15:34                           ` Lucretia
2014-06-13 17:00                             ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-13 22:21                           ` Brian Drummond
2014-06-14 20:41                             ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-15  6:26                               ` Tero Koskinen
2014-06-16  0:11                                 ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-15 18:10                               ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-16  0:00                                 ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-25  6:42                   ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-25  7:29                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-25 12:17                     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-12 23:53         ` Shark8
2014-06-13  4:28           ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-13  8:17             ` gvdschoot
2014-06-13 13:16               ` Simon Wright
2014-06-13 14:13                 ` gvdschoot
2014-06-13 15:52                   ` Shark8
2014-06-13 17:04                   ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-13 20:10                     ` Simon Wright
2014-06-15  6:33                 ` Tero Koskinen
2014-06-15  7:47                   ` gvdschoot
2014-06-15  8:13                     ` gvdschoot
2014-06-15  8:18                     ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-06-16  0:16                       ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-16  0:35                     ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-16  6:08                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-16  6:19                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-16 12:08                           ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-25 22:28                             ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-16 12:30                           ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-16  6:22                         ` gvdschoot
2014-06-25  6:28         ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57)
2014-06-11  8:27     ` Maciej Sobczak
2014-06-11 19:39       ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-11 19:52         ` Luke A. Guest
2014-06-12  1:39           ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-12  2:46             ` Dan'l Miller
2014-06-12 11:24               ` Peter Chapin
2014-06-12 11:36                 ` Lucretia
2014-06-12 14:48                 ` björn lundin
2014-06-12 22:12                   ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-13  8:36                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-13 15:55                       ` Shark8
2014-06-13 16:13                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-13 20:57                       ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-14  7:27                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-14 21:02                         ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-16 16:39                         ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-16 17:13                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-16 17:24                           ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-16 19:13                             ` Simon Wright
2014-06-16 20:25                               ` Simon Clubley
2014-06-17 16:10                                 ` Simon Wright
2014-06-16 21:53                           ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-16 23:02                             ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-06-16 23:42                               ` Robert A Duff
2014-06-17 19:18                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2014-06-14 21:05                       ` Maciej Sobczak
2014-06-15  6:52                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-15 10:04                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-06-15 12:25                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-17  8:18                           ` Maciej Sobczak
2014-06-17  9:13                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-18  7:55                               ` Maciej Sobczak
2014-06-18  8:31                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-06-12  8:16         ` Georg Bauhaus
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