[Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Rolf Ebert]

We are proud to announce the first release of AVR-Ada, one of the first 
GCC based Ada compilers targeting 8-bit microcontrolers.

You can get the project description and some (limited) documentation at

     avr-ada.sourceforge.net
     
The SF development pages with the download section are at

     www.sourceforge.net/projects/avr-ada
     

AVR-Ada is available in source form only.  Binary packages of the 
cross compiler for Linux and Windows are expected to appear with 
future releases of cdk4avr (cdk4avr.sourceforge.net) and WinAVR 
(winavr.sourceforge.net).

Feel free to join the mailing list at 

     https://lists.sourceforge.net/mailman/listinfo/avr-ada-devel.  
     
It has quite low traffic.


Please use SF's bug reporting system for guiding future development 
of AVR-Ada.


Goal
====

The goal of the AVR-Ada project is make the gcc based Ada compiler GNAT
available for the AVR microcontrollers.

More specifically the project wants to provide 

 -  a working compiler based on the existing AVR and Ada support in gcc
 -  a minimalistic Ada runtime system
 -  a useful AVR specific support library


Status
======

Although the compiler and the library have considerably improved in
the last few months they still have some problems.  Do not base a
commercial project on this tool chain.  Or if you do, do it at your
own risk :-).

Most of Ada's static features can be used with AVR-Ada.
A typical Ada run time system is practically non-existant (and will
probably never be).  As a consequence we have to sacrifice some of the
typical useful Ada features like run time checks, exception handling,
timing commands (no delay statement), tasking, etc.  Some of them are
on our todo list for future releases, though.

We provide an Avr package hierarchy with some useful type and
interface definitions and most importantly the necessary definitions
for most AVR parts.

Some sample programs in the apps/ directory show how to use the
compiler and the library.  This includes the tutorial program from
the avr-libc distrubution translated to Ada.

The documentation is very low and consists only of the pages at
avr-ada.sourceforge.net.  A copy of the pages is in the directory
AVR-Ada/web/ for offline reading.

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Jim Granville]

"Rolf Ebert" <rolf.ebert_nospam_@gmx.net> wrote in message
news:46b8b50a.0312050448.654d6da4@posting.google.com...
> We are proud to announce the first release of AVR-Ada, one of the first
> GCC based Ada compilers targeting 8-bit microcontrolers.

Interesting.  I presume this outputs C, which is then compiled ?
How does this then handle symbolic debug in the AVR source, in (eg) AVR
Studio ?

Is anyone working on Ada for 51MX core (FAR calls etc extensions, just
starting to appear in FLASH),
and/or perhaps for the 128KF/256KF 80C51variants from Winbond, Cygnal, STm
?
 Of these, the ST and Cygnal devices have good In Circuit DEBUG support.

There was talk a while ago of Ada for the XA51, but that has only 2 flash
models,
with smallish code size and not a wide market base.

-jg

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Jeff C,]

"Jim Granville" <no.spam@designtools.co.nz> wrote in message
news:HobAb.11589$ws.1077937@news02.tsnz.net...
> "Rolf Ebert" <rolf.ebert_nospam_@gmx.net> wrote in message
> news:46b8b50a.0312050448.654d6da4@posting.google.com...
> > We are proud to announce the first release of AVR-Ada, one of the first
> > GCC based Ada compilers targeting 8-bit microcontrolers.
>
> Interesting.  I presume this outputs C, which is then compiled ?
> How does this then handle symbolic debug in the AVR source, in (eg) AVR
> Studio ?
>

That would be a strange thing to presume. While there are Ada compilers that
take that approach I would
assume that since this is based on the Ada front end of GCC with a GNAT
heritage that it produces
code just like every other (well nearly every other) GCC/GNAT compiler.

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Rolf Ebert]

"Jim Granville" <no.spam@designtools.co.nz> wrote in message news:<HobAb.11589$ws.1077937@news02.tsnz.net>...
> "Rolf Ebert" <rolf.ebert_nospam_@gmx.net> wrote in message
> news:46b8b50a.0312050448.654d6da4@posting.google.com...
> > We are proud to announce the first release of AVR-Ada, one of the first
> > GCC based Ada compilers targeting 8-bit microcontrolers.
> 
> Interesting.  I presume this outputs C, which is then compiled ?

No.  Like all other language front-ends in GCC, GNAT does directly
generate assembler code for the target processor.  All compilers in
GCC share the same code generator back end.

> How does this then handle symbolic debug in the AVR source, in (eg) AVR
> Studio ?

AVR studio up to V4.07 uses the old COFF format which is quite
limited.  Get the V4.08 beta and use the extended COFF format.  The
easiest is to use the WinAVR distribution (winavr.sourceforge.net) to
get used to GCC on Windows first.

> Is anyone working on Ada for 51MX core (FAR calls etc extensions, just
> starting to appear in FLASH),
> and/or perhaps for the 128KF/256KF 80C51variants from Winbond, Cygnal, STm
> ?
>  Of these, the ST and Cygnal devices have good In Circuit DEBUG support.
> 
> There was talk a while ago of Ada for the XA51, but that has only 2 flash
> models,
> with smallish code size and not a wide market base.
> 
> -jg

I do not know about Ada compilers for other processors.  In my project
I use the AVR AT90S2313 which has only 2kB of flash for program space
and 128 bytes RAM.  The generated Ada code isn't any bigger as the
equivalent C code.  You can write lots of useful programs with a good
compiler like gcc despite the size limitations.


    Rolf

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[David Brown]

"Jim Granville" <no.spam@designtools.co.nz> wrote in message
news:HobAb.11589$ws.1077937@news02.tsnz.net...
> "Rolf Ebert" <rolf.ebert_nospam_@gmx.net> wrote in message
> news:46b8b50a.0312050448.654d6da4@posting.google.com...
> > We are proud to announce the first release of AVR-Ada, one of the first
> > GCC based Ada compilers targeting 8-bit microcontrolers.
>
> Interesting.  I presume this outputs C, which is then compiled ?

No, gcc is built in two halves - the front-ends and back-ends are fairly
well seperated.  When the back-end has been ported to a processor (such as
the avr), you get all the front-ends for free.  That means that once the gcc
C compiler was working on the AVR, much of the gnu ada, fortran, C++,
objective C, and possibly even java compilers were also done.  There is a
certain amount of interaction between the front-end and the back-end that
needs to be catered for, but I expect that the main bulk of the work in
getting AVR-Ada in action was the support libraries.

> How does this then handle symbolic debug in the AVR source, in (eg) AVR
> Studio ?

gdb works with the jtag ice, and will support Ada fine.  You could use that
with gvd as a front-end, which will probably work very well since the gvd
authors are ADA addicts themselves (gvd is written in ADA).


>
> Is anyone working on Ada for 51MX core (FAR calls etc extensions, just
> starting to appear in FLASH),
> and/or perhaps for the 128KF/256KF 80C51variants from Winbond, Cygnal, STm
> ?
>  Of these, the ST and Cygnal devices have good In Circuit DEBUG support.
>
> There was talk a while ago of Ada for the XA51, but that has only 2 flash
> models,
> with smallish code size and not a wide market base.
>
> -jg
>
>

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Ulf Samuelsson]

> No.  Like all other language front-ends in GCC, GNAT does directly
> generate assembler code for the target processor.  All compilers in
> GCC share the same code generator back end.
>
> > How does this then handle symbolic debug in the AVR source, in (eg) AVR
> > Studio ?
>
> AVR studio up to V4.07 uses the old COFF format which is quite
> limited.  Get the V4.08 beta and use the extended COFF format.  The
> easiest is to use the WinAVR distribution (winavr.sourceforge.net) to
> get used to GCC on Windows first.
>

I hear native gcc-avr file format support will probably appear in AVR
Studio,
but it will take quite some time (end 2004?).

-- 
Best Regards
Ulf at atmel dot com
These comments are intended to be my own opinion and they
may, or may not be shared by my employer, Atmel Sweden.

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Uwe Bonnes]

In comp.arch.embedded Ulf Samuelsson <ulf@nospamatmel.com> wrote:
: > No.  Like all other language front-ends in GCC, GNAT does directly
: > generate assembler code for the target processor.  All compilers in
: > GCC share the same code generator back end.
: >
: > > How does this then handle symbolic debug in the AVR source, in (eg) AVR
: > > Studio ?
: >
: > AVR studio up to V4.07 uses the old COFF format which is quite
: > limited.  Get the V4.08 beta and use the extended COFF format.  The
: > easiest is to use the WinAVR distribution (winavr.sourceforge.net) to
: > get used to GCC on Windows first.
: >

: I hear native gcc-avr file format support will probably appear in AVR
: Studio,
: but it will take quite some time (end 2004?).

During Electronica 2002 I talked to Atmel representatives, and heard the
same for 2003 

-- 
Uwe Bonnes                bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de

Institut fuer Kernphysik  Schlossgartenstrasse 9  64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 162516 -------- Fax. 06151 164321 ----------

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Ulf Samuelsson]

> : I hear native gcc-avr file format support will probably appear in AVR
> : Studio,
> : but it will take quite some time (end 2004?).
>
> During Electronica 2002 I talked to Atmel representatives, and heard the
> same for 2003
>

If they said that it would take time, then I guess they were correct !
I have no clue about schedule, so your geuss is as good as mine.

> -- 
> Uwe Bonnes                bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de
>
> Institut fuer Kernphysik  Schlossgartenstrasse 9  64289 Darmstadt
> --------- Tel. 06151 162516 -------- Fax. 06151 164321 ----------



-- 
Best Regards
Ulf at atmel dot com
These comments are intended to be my own opinion and they
may, or may not be shared by my employer, Atmel Sweden.

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Christopher Fairbairn]

Hi,

Jeff C, wrote:
> That would be a strange thing to presume. While there are Ada compilers
> that take that approach I would
> assume that since this is based on the Ada front end of GCC with a GNAT
> heritage that it produces
> code just like every other (well nearly every other) GCC/GNAT compiler.

GCC vss GCC :-)

Some people I know of are not aware of the true meaning to GCC. To them 
(mostly people doing embedded development work, using windows based 
development hosts) GCC stands for the "GNU C compiler" and not a lot more, 
they are not fully aware of it's origins or how it internally is 
architectured. They might know of other GNU compilers for languages such as 
Pascal, Ada or Fortran etc but they are not totally aware of how they are 
related with GCC.

However, explaining GCC as the "GNU Compiler Collection" helps clarify 
things up quite a lot.

GCC is made up of two major "components". Front-ends which parse languages 
such as C, C++, Fortran and Ada etc into an intermediate form and a series 
of back-ends which take the intermediate form and end up generating machine 
code for a particular architecture.

Some things are shareable between the particular targets, for example there 
is a whole range of optomisations which can be done on the intermediate 
form which is not backend (target) specific and hence is shared across the 
different compilers. On the other hand there are optomisations which are 
exteremly architecture dependant and hence belong in code developed 
specifically for that port.

A compiler built as part of the GNU Compiler collection is obviously the 
combination of a selected front end intergrated with a selected backend. 
The avr-gcc executable on my box is obvioulsy the combination of the avr 
backend and the C front end, while m68k-palmos-gcc is the same front end 
married to a different backend.

Hopefully I havn't messed up that simplified description too much...

There has been a backend for the AVR architecture for a while now, however 
the original developers (as far as I can remember off the top of my head) 
only worried about getting the C front end working reasonably well.

As the original poster commented, there are various aspects of all languages 
which mean work before a "raw" backend code generator for that architecture 
can be utilised. Things such as how language constructs such as exceptions 
should map to architecture capabilities and any runtime library support 
required. In the case of a C compiler choices include things such as what 
size a long or short int should be etc etc.

Hopefully I've clarified things slightly for those interested, and hopefully 
I havn't mucked up my simpilified description too much.

Hope it helps,
Christopher Fairbairn.

Re: [Announce] AVR-Ada V0.1 released

[Warren W. Gay VE3WWG]

Christopher Fairbairn wrote:
> Jeff C, wrote:
> 
>>That would be a strange thing to presume. While there are Ada compilers
>>that take that approach I would
>>assume that since this is based on the Ada front end of GCC with a GNAT
>>heritage that it produces
>>code just like every other (well nearly every other) GCC/GNAT compiler.
> 
> GCC vss GCC :-)
> 
> Some people I know of are not aware of the true meaning to GCC. To them 
> (mostly people doing embedded development work, using windows based 
> development hosts) GCC stands for the "GNU C compiler" and not a lot more, 
> they are not fully aware of it's origins or how it internally is 
> architectured. They might know of other GNU compilers for languages such as 
> Pascal, Ada or Fortran etc but they are not totally aware of how they are 
> related with GCC.
> 
> However, explaining GCC as the "GNU Compiler Collection" helps clarify 
> things up quite a lot.

In all fairness to everyone here, I believe the title change to
"GNU Compiler Collection" was a relatively recent innovation ;-)
-- 
Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
http://home.cogeco.ca/~ve3wwg