From: Adam Beneschan <adam@irvine.com>
Subject: Re: Operation can be dispatching in only one type
Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 13:35:00 -0800 (PST)
Date: 2009-11-16T13:35:00-08:00 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <adaa8b66-1394-45f9-a822-48f0bfb5c2cb@u16g2000pru.googlegroups.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 1u0im1tdws15u.1n9v9rz7bu4t4$.dlg@40tude.net
On Nov 16, 12:28 pm, "Dmitry A. Kazakov" <mail...@dmitry-kazakov.de>
wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 09:43:06 -0800 (PST), Adam Beneschan wrote:
> > By the way, for a while I was considering requesting a language change
> > to allow this sort of restricted multiple dispatch, in cases where a
> > primitive operation of two types could be declared and inherited for
> > two derived types that are derived in the same package, and when
> > dispatching, the program would check to make sure the two actual types
> > really were declared in the same package. This would avoid having to
> > deal with M x N combinations of types---something that I think is an
> > issue with MI---since it only deals with pairs (or triplets, etc.) of
> > types that are defined to "go together".
>
> But you still have these combinations independently on where you derive.
> You allow the "diagonal" of the full dispatching table. I.e. the
> combinations:
>
> A1, B1,
> A2, B2,
> A3, B3
>
> But other combinations are still there, because they can be spelt. It is
> just so that they raise Constraint_Error. This "diagonal" behavior is what
> we already have for multi-methods (a form of MD with only one hierarchy
> A=B). I suppose this is one of the motivations of your proposal.
>
> But the problem with "diagonal" dispatch is that it is inconsistent with
> the idea of static typing. I would insist on the design rule that dispatch
> shall never fail in a legal program. I.e. the compiler shall enforce all
> possible combinations of types no later than at compile time.
Since a call to a dispatching operation may have parameters that are
themselves of class-wide types, I don't think this is possible.
In Ada as it exists currently, you can declare a primitive operation
with two parameters of the same tagged type (maybe that's what you
meant by "multi-method"---sorry, I don't know the jargon). E.g.
type T is abstract tagged null record;
procedure Some_Operation (Param_1 : T; Param_2 : T);
If you later call
Some_Operation (X, Y);
and X is declared to be of type T1 (a descendant of T) and Y is
declared to be of type T2 (also a descendant of T), then the compiler
can statically determine that this will fail. But if either X or Y
(or both) is declared to be of type T'Class, then the compiler can't
statically tell whether the dispatch will fail or not. So a runtime
check is needed. Similarly for the proposal I was thinking of making.
> Further, it
> shall not "invent" broken implementations. In "diagonal" dispatch it would
> do (and does) exactly this, it would override A1, B2 with an implementation
> raising Constraint_Error.
>
> At the same time the case represented by "diagonal" dispatch is very
> important in other situations, like parallel hierarchies of types. E.g.
> when we wanted to force a new instance from B'Class for each new instance
> from A'Class. But again that enforcement shall be static. BTW, it is not
> multiple dispatch. Technically this is rather single dispatch where the
> tuple of types (A, B) is considered as root of some class of tuples, in
> which (A1, B1), (A2, B2) are instances. Presently we have nothing in the
> language to handle this (except the jack-of-all-trades, generics). It would
> be interesting to speculate how tuples can be supported in Ada, especially
> their flattening in the arguments lists, and using tuples as multiple
> results of a function.
>
> > I could try to write a
> > proposal if there's enough interest, but I think it's too late to get
> > into the next language revision.
>
> I am incredibly interested in MD (and in tuples as well), but I think we
> should not touch it until we knew how to do it right.
I don't think the proposal I was considering was a solution to MD, but
rather to a smallish subset of MD-related problems---although it was a
subset I thought would be useful, and I may have run into a case in my
own code where I would have wanted to use it.
-- Adam
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2009-11-16 21:35 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 132+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2009-11-13 20:12 Operation can be dispatching in only one type xorque
2009-11-13 20:34 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-13 20:43 ` xorque
2009-11-13 21:14 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-13 20:44 ` xorque
2009-11-16 17:43 ` Adam Beneschan
2009-11-16 20:28 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-16 20:32 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-16 21:35 ` Adam Beneschan [this message]
2009-11-16 22:28 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-17 22:10 ` Adam Beneschan
2009-11-18 9:46 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-18 16:39 ` Adam Beneschan
2009-11-18 19:21 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-19 0:27 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-11-19 2:11 ` Robert A Duff
2009-11-19 15:57 ` Adam Beneschan
2009-11-19 19:39 ` Robert A Duff
2009-11-19 23:43 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-11-19 8:50 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-19 23:54 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-11-20 8:34 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-20 10:58 ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2009-11-21 6:02 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-11-21 13:07 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-22 5:45 ` xorque
2009-11-22 11:25 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-11-22 11:30 ` xorque
2009-11-22 16:25 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-22 16:27 ` xorque
2009-11-22 16:42 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-22 16:52 ` xorque
2009-11-22 17:41 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-22 18:03 ` xorque
2009-11-22 18:08 ` xorque
2009-11-22 18:28 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-22 18:41 ` xorque
2009-11-22 21:47 ` Robert A Duff
2009-11-23 3:42 ` stefan-lucks
2009-11-30 20:36 ` Robert A Duff
2009-11-30 23:54 ` (see below)
2009-12-01 12:13 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-01 12:23 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-01 12:44 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-01 13:48 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-01 15:02 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-01 16:18 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-01 17:52 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-01 18:47 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-01 21:53 ` John B. Matthews
2009-12-02 0:32 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-02 11:18 ` John B. Matthews
2009-12-02 14:29 ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2009-12-02 15:35 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-02 1:13 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-02 9:07 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-02 12:35 ` John B. Matthews
2009-12-02 13:35 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-03 5:23 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-12-03 20:21 ` John B. Matthews
2009-12-03 5:29 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-12-03 11:24 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-03 23:08 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-12-04 8:52 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-05 2:45 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-12-05 10:32 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-08 0:19 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-12-08 4:30 ` stefan-lucks
2009-12-08 9:12 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-10 4:09 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-12-11 0:10 ` Robert A Duff
2009-12-08 9:22 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-08 10:06 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-08 10:23 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-08 10:33 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-12-08 10:49 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-01 23:51 ` Randy Brukardt
2009-11-23 8:52 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-11-30 20:43 ` Robert A Duff
2009-12-01 9:00 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-01 5:45 ` stefan-lucks
2009-12-01 11:12 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-01 8:01 ` stefan-lucks
2009-12-01 13:37 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2009-12-15 23:54 ` Robert A Duff
2009-11-23 7:48 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-11-23 7:58 ` Georg Bauhaus
2009-11-19 16:04 ` Adam Beneschan
2009-11-19 2:23 ` tmoran
2009-11-19 8:32 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2015-11-23 10:23 operation " Serge Robyns
2015-11-23 11:29 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-23 13:05 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-23 13:48 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-23 14:16 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-23 14:59 ` G.B.
2015-11-23 15:52 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-23 17:40 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2015-11-24 9:08 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-24 16:44 ` AdaMagica
2015-11-24 17:09 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2015-11-24 18:37 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-24 20:18 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2015-11-24 20:40 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-24 20:25 ` Niklas Holsti
2015-11-24 21:48 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2015-11-25 8:24 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-25 11:22 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-25 17:38 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-26 11:30 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-26 13:14 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-26 14:27 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-26 15:16 ` J-P. Rosen
2015-11-26 18:27 ` Serge Robyns
2015-11-26 21:20 ` J-P. Rosen
2015-11-27 8:37 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-27 12:58 ` J-P. Rosen
2015-11-27 13:39 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-11-30 22:22 ` Randy Brukardt
2015-12-01 8:46 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-12-01 11:19 ` G.B.
2015-12-01 13:56 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-12-01 16:05 ` G.B.
2015-12-01 17:58 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-12-02 13:06 ` G.B.
2015-12-02 13:31 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2015-12-02 19:33 ` Randy Brukardt
2015-12-02 19:27 ` Randy Brukardt
2015-11-29 17:59 ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2015-11-30 22:29 ` Randy Brukardt
2015-11-25 12:27 ` G.B.
2015-11-25 17:25 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
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