ADA context sensitive editor

ADA context sensitive editor

[Wayne Elliott]

I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:

	- key word colour highlighting
	- command anticipation
	- auto indenting based on syntax
	- early syntax checking

and any other clever time-saving features/gadgets.

What's out there?  Commercial or otherwise

Thanks................................Wayne

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[David Weller]

In article <wayne.794796818@hawk>, Wayne Elliott <wayne@adied.oz.au> wrote:
>I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
>or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
>for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:
>
>	- key word colour highlighting
>	- command anticipation
>	- auto indenting based on syntax
>	- early syntax checking
>
>and any other clever time-saving features/gadgets.
>

Emacs.  Add in Ada-mode, presto:
	- Drop down menus and mouse support
	- Context sensitive help
	- Colour hilighting
	- autoindenting
	- template expansion
	- Check-in/out of source (revision control)
	- Multi-window/multi-frame development
	- Cross-referencing and automatic subprogram index
	- Switch between spec and body with a single command
		(and it will build the body from the spec if none
		exists!)
	- Invoke compiler in editor (and step through errors)
	- much more to list!

And, of course, it's free :-)

-- 
      Frustrated with C, C++, Pascal, Fortran?  Ada95 _might_ be for you!
	  For all sorts of interesting Ada95 tidbits, run the command:
"finger dweller@starbase.neosoft.com | more" (or e-mail with "finger" as subj.)
	

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Garlington KE]

Wayne Elliott (wayne@adied.oz.au) wrote:
: I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
: or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
: for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:

: 	- key word colour highlighting
: 	- command anticipation
: 	- auto indenting based on syntax
: 	- early syntax checking

: and any other clever time-saving features/gadgets.

: What's out there?  Commercial or otherwise

Try the Xinotech Program Composer. We looked at it some time back, and
it had all these gadgets.

The Rational development system editor also does a lot of this.

The DEC Language Sensitive Editor does a little bit of this, too.

: Thanks................................Wayne



--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Ken Garlington                  GarlingtonKE@lfwc.lockheed.com
F-22 Computer Resources         Lockheed Fort Worth Co.

If LFWC or the F-22 program has any opinions, they aren't telling me.

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Daneil Wengelin]

Wayne Elliott (wayne@adied.oz.au) wrote:
: I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
: or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
: for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:

: 	- key word colour highlighting
: 	- command anticipation
: 	- auto indenting based on syntax
: 	- early syntax checking

: and any other clever time-saving features/gadgets.

: What's out there?  Commercial or otherwise

If you are at ADI at Technology Park in Adelaide, you could just walk over
to CelsiusTech Australia, to check out APEX by Rational. Otherwise your 
local Rational representative could tell you all about it.

APEX is good, and does all the stuff you could need in a development
system. Unfortunately, it's pretty expensive unless you're a university,
which you are not.


------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Daniel Wengelin                 -- Team Ada, the best 0$ mem-      --
-- CelsiusTech                     -- bership fee you'll ever spend   --
-- dawe@celsiustech.se             --                                 --
-- wengelin@ozspace.brisnet.org.au --                                 --
------------------------------------------------------------------------
with Standard_Disclaimer;

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Fred McCall]

In <1995Mar11.224426.23566@nntp.brisnet.org.au> wengelin@ozspace.brisnet.org.au Daneil Wengelin writes:

>Wayne Elliott (wayne@adied.oz.au) wrote:
>: I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
>: or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
>: for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:
>
>:     - key word colour highlighting
>:     - command anticipation
>:     - auto indenting based on syntax
>:     - early syntax checking
>
>: and any other clever time-saving features/gadgets.
>
>: What's out there?  Commercial or otherwise

>APEX is good, and does all the stuff you could need in a development
>system. Unfortunately, it's pretty expensive unless you're a university,
>which you are not.

I think the price of APEX goes beyond "pretty expensive".  

I can't believe no one has mentioned GNU Emacs.  I use it in preference
to APEX, I get better highlighting than APEX gives me, and if you
install GNAT you can do most of the things that the APEX editor will
do.  Even without GNAT, it will do a certain amount of syntax checking,
will do auto indentation, and any number of other things.

And the price is much more reasonable than an APEX license.  Free.



--
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
merlin@annwfn.com -- I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[David Weller]

In article <86681A57372@annwfn.com>, Fred McCall <merlin@annwfn.com> wrote:
>>: I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
>>: or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
>>: for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:
>>
>I can't believe no one has mentioned GNU Emacs.  I use it in preference
>to APEX, I get better highlighting than APEX gives me, and if you
>install GNAT you can do most of the things that the APEX editor will
>do.  Even without GNAT, it will do a certain amount of syntax checking,
>will do auto indentation, and any number of other things.
>

YOu missed the first reply to this post, where I emphatically
recommended Emacs with Ada-mode.

And you're quite right -- it's WAY cooler than the Apex editor.


--
      Frustrated with C, C++, Pascal, Fortran?  Ada95 _might_ be for you!
	  For all sorts of interesting Ada95 tidbits, run the command:
"finger dweller@starbase.neosoft.com | more" (or e-mail with "finger" as subj.)
		if u cn rd ths, u r gd enuf to chg to Ada   :-)

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Fred J. McCall]

In article <3kia7b$cg2@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM> dweller@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM (David Weller) writes:

>YOu missed the first reply to this post, where I emphatically
>recommended Emacs with Ada-mode.

Interestingly enough, I didn't see it either at home *or* at work (which are
two totally different feed paths).

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Robb Nebbe]

In article <86681A57372@annwfn.com>, merlin@annwfn.com (Fred McCall) writes:
|> In <1995Mar11.224426.23566@nntp.brisnet.org.au> wengelin@ozspace.brisnet.org.au Daneil Wengelin writes:

|> 
|> I think the price of APEX goes beyond "pretty expensive".  
|> 
|> I can't believe no one has mentioned GNU Emacs.  I use it in preference
|> to APEX, I get better highlighting than APEX gives me, and if you
|> install GNAT you can do most of the things that the APEX editor will
|> do.  Even without GNAT, it will do a certain amount of syntax checking,
|> will do auto indentation, and any number of other things.
|> 
|> And the price is much more reasonable than an APEX license.  Free.

I even work with the Apex compiler and I still use Emacs in preference
to the Apex editor. Of course I also work with other compilers and 
it is convenient to always use the same editor.

Robb Nebbe

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Kent Mitchell]

Robb Nebbe (nebbe@lglsun.epfl.ch) wrote:
: In article <86681A57372@annwfn.com>, merlin@annwfn.com (Fred McCall) writes:
: |> In <1995Mar11.224426.23566@nntp.brisnet.org.au> wengelin@ozspace.brisnet.org.au Daneil Wengelin writes:

: |> 
: |> I think the price of APEX goes beyond "pretty expensive".  
: |> 
: |> I can't believe no one has mentioned GNU Emacs.  I use it in preference
: |> to APEX, I get better highlighting than APEX gives me, and if you
: |> install GNAT you can do most of the things that the APEX editor will
: |> do.  Even without GNAT, it will do a certain amount of syntax checking,
: |> will do auto indentation, and any number of other things.
: |> 
: |> And the price is much more reasonable than an APEX license.  Free.

: I even work with the Apex compiler and I still use Emacs in preference
: to the Apex editor. Of course I also work with other compilers and 
: it is convenient to always use the same editor.

Ummm ... While I kind of agree that our editor is *not* as powerfull as
EMACS when it come to pure editing, it's a bit of a reach to say that EMACS
can do "most of the things that the Apex editor will do" with or without GNAT.
For, example, where's the traversal, semantic completion or declaration usage
analysis?   I do understand that editors are a religious issue and you'll
be happy to know that we are working on a true integration of EMACS and
Apex so that you can have your cake and eat it too.  Look for it in a
future release.
--
Kent Mitchell                   | One possible reason that things aren't
Technical Consultant            | going according to plan is .....
Rational Software Corporation   | that there never *was* a plan!

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[jfj]

how about Ada-Assured.  It does all those things and even gives LRM references.

jfj

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Robert Dewar]

EMACS + GNAT may do a bit more than our friend from Rational thinks it can
(or would like it to be able to do :-)
It uses the cross-reference listing generated by gnatf to do some
non-trivial semantic analysis. I am not saying it does all Apex does,
but it is worth looking at!

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Vladimir Vukicevic]

In article <3krt85$srq@gnat.cs.nyu.edu> dewar@cs.nyu.edu (Robert Dewar) writes:

> EMACS + GNAT may do a bit more than our friend from Rational thinks it can
> (or would like it to be able to do :-)
> It uses the cross-reference listing generated by gnatf to do some
> non-trivial semantic analysis. I am not saying it does all Apex does,
> but it is worth looking at!

Of course it doesn't do all Apex does. It does more. :-) But if there's
anything that Apex does that emacs ada mode doesn't, it could easily
be added with some elisp code. I don't think the apex environement is
that extensible. :-)

	- Vladimir

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Kent Mitchell]

Vladimir Vukicevic (vladimir@speedy.intrepid.com) wrote:
: In article <3krt85$srq@gnat.cs.nyu.edu> dewar@cs.nyu.edu (Robert Dewar) writes:

: > EMACS + GNAT may do a bit more than our friend from Rational thinks it can
: > (or would like it to be able to do :-)
: > It uses the cross-reference listing generated by gnatf to do some
: > non-trivial semantic analysis. I am not saying it does all Apex does,
: > but it is worth looking at!

: Of course it doesn't do all Apex does. It does more. :-) But if there's
: anything that Apex does that emacs ada mode doesn't, it could easily
: be added with some elisp code. I don't think the apex environement is
: that extensible. :-)

I stand (somewhat) corrected.  I received a very good response from the
maintainer of Ada-EMACS about the capabilities that are availible in it's
current incarnation.  I find I was mistaken in some of my statements.
There are quite a few things that EMACS can do that approach the capabilities
of Apex.  In some areas it is better but there are still a fairly substantial
number of things the emacs extensions cannot do.  Contrary to what is stated
above some of the extensions could *not* be added with "some elisp" code.

I actually encourage people to make other tools with these kinds of
capabilites.  In many respects it make the job of selling Apex simpler
because at least we don't get questions anymore like "Why would I want
that?", etc.

Also contrary to what is stated above it is pretty easy to extend Apex
though the editor is somewhat closed.  Again, with the integration to emacs
this problem should be solved as well.

--
Kent Mitchell                   | One possible reason that things aren't
Technical Consultant            | going according to plan is .....
Rational Software Corporation   | that there never *was* a plan!

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Fred J. McCall]

In article <3kvdit$eot@rational.rational.com> kdm@rational.com (Kent Mitchell) writes:

>Vladimir Vukicevic (vladimir@speedy.intrepid.com) wrote:

>: Of course it doesn't do all Apex does. It does more. :-) But if there's
>: anything that Apex does that emacs ada mode doesn't, it could easily
>: be added with some elisp code. I don't think the apex environement is
>: that extensible. :-)

>I stand (somewhat) corrected.  I received a very good response from the
>maintainer of Ada-EMACS about the capabilities that are availible in it's
>current incarnation.  I find I was mistaken in some of my statements.
>There are quite a few things that EMACS can do that approach the capabilities
>of Apex.  In some areas it is better but there are still a fairly substantial
>number of things the emacs extensions cannot do.  Contrary to what is stated
>above some of the extensions could *not* be added with "some elisp" code.

I'm curious how you arrive at this conclusion, given that there's a full LISP 
environment in there.  Are you saying that there are things that simply can't 
be done in LISP, or what?

[Needless to say, I don't know that I'd buy the use of the adverb 'easily', 
but I seriously doubt there are things that you absolutely could not do.]

>Also contrary to what is stated above it is pretty easy to extend Apex
>though the editor is somewhat closed.  Again, with the integration to emacs
>this problem should be solved as well.

Is there a released date for when this is supposed to happen?

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Robb Nebbe]

In article <fjm.82.0009EC39@ti.com>, fjm@ti.com (Fred J. McCall) writes:
|> In article <3kvdit$eot@rational.rational.com> kdm@rational.com (Kent Mitchell) writes:
|>
|> >I stand (somewhat) corrected.  I received a very good response from the
|> >maintainer of Ada-EMACS about the capabilities that are availible in it's
|> >current incarnation.  I find I was mistaken in some of my statements.
|> >There are quite a few things that EMACS can do that approach the capabilities
|> >of Apex.  In some areas it is better but there are still a fairly substantial
|> >number of things the emacs extensions cannot do.  Contrary to what is stated
|> >above some of the extensions could *not* be added with "some elisp" code.
|> 
|> I'm curious how you arrive at this conclusion, given that there's a full LISP 
|> environment in there.  Are you saying that there are things that simply can't 
|> be done in LISP, or what?

From experience I know that there are things that are too slow to
do entirely in elisp. Emacs provides a way to interface with
external tools so basically any information you can get out of the
Apex environment you could use in Emacs.

I would have to agree that some extensions are beyond being added with
"some elisp" code but they could certainly be added.

Robb Nebbe

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Beth Walker]

> |> In article <3kvdit$eot@rational.rational.com> kdm@rational.com (Kent Mitchell) writes:
> |>
> |> >I stand (somewhat) corrected.  I received a very good response from the
> |> >maintainer of Ada-EMACS about the capabilities that are availible in it's
> |> >current incarnation.  

Sorry if this is a FAQ, but could you tell me how to get a copy of
Ada-EMACS?

Thanks.

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Kent Mitchell]

Fred J. McCall (fjm@ti.com) wrote:
: In article <3kvdit$eot@rational.rational.com> kdm@rational.com (Kent Mitchell) writes:

: I'm curious how you arrive at this conclusion, given that there's a full LISP 
: environment in there.  Are you saying that there are things that simply can't 
: be done in LISP, or what?

No ... what I'm saying is that inorder to do some of these kinds of
operation you need full access to all of the compilation artifacts.  While
we do export an Ada interface to most of this information (through ASIS) it
might be a little hard to access this directly from elisp.  Of course one
could always fork off an Ada program to do this kind of stuff that used ASIS.
One also might find that some infromation that one might want is not so
easy to get even with ASIS.  ASIS programs are far from trivial.  I guess
you *might* be able to do anything is elisp just like you *might* be able
to do anything in perl ;-)

: [Needless to say, I don't know that I'd buy the use of the adverb 'easily', 
: but I seriously doubt there are things that you absolutely could not do.]

: >Also contrary to what is stated above it is pretty easy to extend Apex
: >though the editor is somewhat closed.  Again, with the integration to emacs
: >this problem should be solved as well.

: Is there a released date for when this is supposed to happen?

No public release date for this but I expect we should have something in a
few months.

--
Kent Mitchell                   | One possible reason that things aren't
Technical Consultant            | going according to plan is .....
Rational Software Corporation   | that there never *was* a plan!

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Wes Groleau]

In a previous article, griffin@acm.org (Michael D. Griffin) says:

>In article <3krv0g$7jb@theopolis.orl.mmc.com> Gerald Petrey,
>gpetrey@polo.dab.ge.com writes:
>>IMHO, Ada-Assured is the worst product to ever come out of Verdix. 
>
>IMHO, Ada-Assured is a good product for ensuring compilance with the AQ&S

I witnessed the adoption of Ada-ASSURED on a major product.  

1. It does not comes from Verdix.

2. Although a pretty good product, it does have a few significant flaws.
   One of these is that it cannot distinguish between functions and procedures
   for certain details (they said they would fix this, so if maybe the rest
   of this message is moot).

   We had a rule that default mode in could NOT be used in procedures but
   should be used in functions.  The rationale (hold the flames!) was
   a. making "in" explicit in functions suggests to the uninitiated that
      there is a possibility of another mode but "in" is the "right" mode
      for "this" application.
   b. Being explicit in procedures shows that you thought about it instead of
      doing something accidentally.

Ada-ASSURED was set to "fix" procedures if "in" was left out (actually 
contrary to the spirit of (b) but it's not my fault!)  This meant that "in"
was ADDED by the tool to functions.  If the spec was "frozen" before adoption
of Ada-ASSURED, the changed function does not conform and will not compile.

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Fred J. McCall]

In article <3knpgo$odd@rational.rational.com> kdm@rational.com (Kent Mitchell) writes:

>Robb Nebbe (nebbe@lglsun.epfl.ch) wrote:
>: In article <86681A57372@annwfn.com>, merlin@annwfn.com (Fred McCall) writes:
>: |> In <1995Mar11.224426.23566@nntp.brisnet.org.au> wengelin@ozspace.brisnet.org.au Daneil Wengelin writes:

>: |> to APEX, I get better highlighting than APEX gives me, and if you
>: |> install GNAT you can do most of the things that the APEX editor will
>: |> do.  

>Ummm ... While I kind of agree that our editor is *not* as powerfull as
>EMACS when it come to pure editing, it's a bit of a reach to say that EMACS
>can do "most of the things that the Apex editor will do" with or without GNAT.
>For, example, where's the traversal, semantic completion or declaration usage
>analysis?  

If you have GNAT installed, I believe it does those things (except perhaps 
semantic completion, which I've always found annoying, personally).

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Jeff Winchester]

On 20 Mar 1995, Robb Nebbe wrote:

> |> I can't believe no one has mentioned GNU Emacs.  I use it in preference
> |> to APEX, I get better highlighting than APEX gives me, and if you
> |> install GNAT you can do most of the things that the APEX editor will
> |> do.  Even without GNAT, it will do a certain amount of syntax checking,
> |> will do auto indentation, and any number of other things.

> I even work with the Apex compiler and I still use Emacs in preference
> to the Apex editor. Of course I also work with other compilers and 
> it is convenient to always use the same editor.

Can you direct a newbie to the Ada community to an FTP site / filename, 
etc., that would let me get this editor?  Thanks.  


/--------------------------------------------------------\
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Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[jfj]

merlin@annwfn.com (Fred McCall) wrote:
>In <1995Mar11.224426.23566@nntp.brisnet.org.au> wengelin@ozspace.brisnet.org.au Daneil Wengelin writes:
>
SNIP
>>:     - key word colour highlighting
>>:     - command anticipation
>>:     - auto indenting based on syntax
>>:     - early syntax checking
>>

SNIP

I haven't seen anyone mention Ada-Assured.  It's not too expensive for a Sun.  I
believe it is also available for DOS and others...
It does everything mentioned and even gives Style Guide warnings.

jfj

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Gerald Petrey]

In article <3ko2na$f1d@bighorn.accessnv.com> jfj (John Fountain, Jr.) writes:
>I haven't seen anyone mention Ada-Assured.  It's not too expensive for a Sun.  

IMHO, Ada-Assured is the worst product to ever come out of Verdix. 

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Michael D. Griffin]

In article <3krv0g$7jb@theopolis.orl.mmc.com> Gerald Petrey,
gpetrey@polo.dab.ge.com writes:
>IMHO, Ada-Assured is the worst product to ever come out of Verdix. 

IMHO, Ada-Assured is a good product for ensuring compilance with the AQ&S
guide.  As an editor, it does require familiarity with the structure of
Ada's syntax to use it effectively.

Griff

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[rramsey]

There is a share ware Ada Editor (for MS-Windows).  It's called AdaEdit (or 
EditAda).  I got it from an FTP site (oak.oakland.edu).  It has most of what 
you wanted.  

Rick

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[John Howard]

Wayne Elliott (wayne@adied.oz.au) wrote:
: I'm just sending out feelers to see if any one knows of
: or has had experienced with context sensitive editors
: for ADA.  You know the sort of thing; features like:

: 	- key word colour highlighting
: 	- command anticipation
: 	- auto indenting based on syntax
: 	- early syntax checking

: and any other clever time-saving features/gadgets.
: What's out there?  Commercial or otherwise

OS/2 v3.0 has the Enhanced Programmers Editor (EPM) v.5x but v6.01 is 
supplied from IBM Developer's Connection CD-ROM #6 subscription.  EPM is 
extensible for various programming languages.  It does not currently have 
an Ada syntax but it can be added.  EPM supports hilighting, command 
anticipation, and auto indenting based upon syntax.  EPM can also be used 
as an editor engine with your own front-end.  EPM is a 32-bit application 
that is integrated with facilities provided by OS/2 such as drag and 
drop, custom menus, property notebook via second mouse button, etc.

I have been looking into using the EPM as an engine and with Ada95 syntax.
I think the existing EPM is confusing because of all the options.  The 
EPM engine might allow me to provide a simpler visual interface specifically 
for Ada95.  The product may be part of a commercial toolset of reusable 
components that I have begun developing.

Re: ADA context sensitive editor

[Thomas W. Hood (703)913-4308]

If you want a PC based one, try MultiEdit.  They have similar features
to DEC's LSE, but not nearly the full range of stuff available for Emacs/


Thomas Hood
hoodt@lfs.loral.com

-- I speak only for myself