Re: Latin, Shakespeare, and other irrelevant topics

[Brian Rogoff <bpr@shell5.ba.best.com>]

On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Robert Dewar wrote:
> In article
> <Pine.BSF.4.21.0101271915410.28283-100000@shell5.ba.best.com>,
>   Brian Rogoff <bpr@shell5.ba.best.com> wrote:
> 
> > The Shakespeare worship
> 
> Not a matter of worship, just appreciatation

As I said, there are many art forms which I appreciate, and many which I
don't, but I don't jump up every time someone criticizes an author I like, 
since I realize that this is subjective. A very large fraction of the
people I know who like Shakespeare don't possess similar detachment 
concerning this topic. 

> > and when I reveal my distaste for this stuff
> 
> Perhaps you were badly introduced in school, which is a shame
> indeed! No one is saying you have to like Shakespeare, but we
> can be sorry that you are missing out :-) 

Are you a country and western music fan? If not consider having this 
discussion with an intelligent enthusiast of said art form, who 
can also point out the richness and range of human experience captured 
in C & W, and how much you'd are missing out on account of that C & W 
shaped gap in your heart :-). If you do like that loathsome stuff, please 
find something you don't like and try the same thought experiment. 

Quot homines, tot sententiae. 

> After all you may be missing something, and if you think Shakespeare is
> "shallow", most likely you are! 

Possibly, but it seems you're back to making sweeping statements again,
which is unfortunate. I suppose if I am shallow, then you shouldn't 
even bother continuing. 

> It's not clear how you arrive at such a conclusion, One can dislike
> Shakespeare for many reasons, but a judgment that it is shallow almost
> certainly means that there is indeed something you are missing. That's
> not so surprising. It's hard work, and often introduced very
> badly in schools.

I'll look at one dimension, ethical values. 

Let's consider the works of of Mark Twain / Samuel Clemens. Do the values 
espoused by Clemens transcend the era of the author or are they for the
most part mired in it? Now consider your beloved Bard. Would you answer
that question the same way? As you can guess, I wouldn't. 

> Of course you can dismiss this as spoutings of elitist
> nonsense, 

Yes, maybe that's a bit tougher than how I'd put it, but close enough. 

> but in this case there do seem to be a *rather*
> large number of spouters. 

Surely that argument isn't convincing, least of all here, on comp.lang.ada?

> Are you REALLY saying you see
> nothing to appreciate in Branagh's Henry V (please don't
> tell me you haven't seen it

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I haven't seen it. I haven't owned a TV
for a year and a half, and am not likely to get one either, so I don't
imagine I'll ever see it. 

While I agree that this thread is not too bothersome given it's explicit
irrelevance to Ada in the subject line, Pascal Obry's complaint is making
me wonder if it wouldn't be better off in e-mail. If we were discussing
the work of Nabokov, or even Thomas Tryon, I could probably swing it to
Ada, alas Shakespeare just doesn't give me enough to work with. :-)

Pascal, if you're truly bothered, I'll stop, but I hope that you'll apply
the same stick to the many irrelevant posts that come up under mislabeled 
topics, or the many off-topic asides in relevant threads, etc. 

-- Brian

(Anyone who can get the Thomas Tryon reference is truly well read, or has 
 a good movie memory and seen lot's of movies ;-)