Re: Fantastic Ada promotional piece from Rational (long)

[jgoodsen@trinidad.jpmorgan.com (John Goodsen)]

In article <34nc0l$obm@felix.seas.gwu.edu> mfeldman@seas.gwu.edu (Michael Feldman) writes:

   >
   >Show me one successful businessman who makes the investment to start a company
   >because they "believe" in something.  Hardly a wise business decision.  

   Hmmm. Are you _really_ saying that it is poor business practice to
   actually believe that your product is good for something? 

I think you chose to miss my point here.  I'm hardly saying that vendors are in err
if they believe in their product, but there is more than just believing
in the product that business decisions are made upon.  In particular,
market research that shows an estimated return on investment are typically
required before a company pumps money into building a market.
If a business decides choose a particular path because there is more
money in that path (e.g. C++ instead of Ada), you can't go ramrod that company
as acting irresponsible and hack at them for not pumping more and more
money into a market that is relatively shrinking when compared to other
markets.  In particular, I would say that the company is acting responsibly
on the behalf of those who have invested in the company.

   >It is completely legitimate for a company to enter a market with a plan to cash
   >in on their presence in the market.  Why do you and Greg continue to blast
   >companies for their decisions to follow a market rather than try to create
   >a market.  

   Because almost every business sector I can think of, including the
   software sector, has created its own market. The public is told it
   needs product XYZ via advertising, and either the need is self-evident
   or the public comes to agree with the need because it's been advertised to.

   Sure, there are some cynical businesspeople who sell stuff they don;t 
   believe in. But I am idealistic enough to think that most of them
   have at least _some_ commitment to the worth of their product.

   I daresay even the government is not immune. Do you think that every
   DoD decision to purchase something was not influenced in some way by
   its contractors? C'mon. You don't really believe that.

Or influenced in some way *NOT* to purchase something, in the case of Ada
compilers  :-)

   >If someone came to you and said, "Mike, I need 2 million to start
   >this company who's goal is to build cool Ada things because we believe that
   >Ada is the best language to use, can you invest?"  If you had a couple mil in
   >your back pocket, can you honestly tell me that the wisest decision is to
   >try to push a market into existence by investing into it?  Markets develop
   >out of demand from consumers, not out of pushing by vendors who want to sell
   >products.  If I've got something to sell you but you don't want to buy it,
   >then am I the bad guy because you don't buy it?  I think not.

   Gimme a break, John. American commerce is based on advertising and markets
   advertising creates. Only government contractor types would pretend that
   "the customer" simply dictates and industry magically produces.

The point being that if you went to the board of a company and presented
a project to fund, but the only defense of that product was something 
along the lines of "Ada is the best technology and it is up to us to 
create an Ada market to do business in", you'd be laughed out of the 
meeting before the first slide.  

   >I'm getting kind of tired of hearing from people who have no
   >experience starting and running a business blast (directly or
   >indirectly) those who at least have the balls to give it a shot.

   So kill the notes, John. It's a free country.

or expose the err in your logic - that's more interesting than pretending
that you don't exist :-)

   >Your
   >suggestions of giving free handouts to universities and Greg's suggestions
   >that companies who make money in the Ada market are hypocrites when
   >they pursue business in other markets are equally ludicrous.

   I'd like to know where you got the idea I was looking for free handouts
   to universities. Did I ever say that?

Yes, abosolutely!  You say this in nearly every post I read.
I'm wondering why you don't just make it part of you .signature :-)

Here's a snippet you just wrote a couple of articles ago....

  --
   >Mow about an Ada compiler that glows in the dark and comes with
   >a free pet rock?

   ...only if it's free to universities. :-) :-) :-)
  --
-- 
--
John Goodsen                         Currently on-site at:
The Dalmatian Group                       JP Morgan 
User Interface Specialists                60 Wall St., New York City
jgoodsen@radsoft.com                      jgoodsen@jpmorgan.com