From: stt@houdini.camb.inmet.com (Tucker Taft)
Subject: Re: Ada vs C++ vs Java
Date: 1999/01/22
Date: 1999-01-22T00:00:00+00:00 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <F5yz53.5qC.0.-s@inmet.camb.inmet.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 916962713.14158.0.nnrp-01.c2decf94@news.demon.co.uk
forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk wrote:
: i know several non-validated C compilers that are vastly more reliable
: than several validated Ada compilers, so let's have fewer snide
: remarks about the importance of being validated.
Good point. Sorry I appeared snide. My point was that simply in
the C compiler world, it is a bit harder to rely on any particular
compiler enforcing a particular rule in a particular way.
An example is whether an enumeration type is allowed as a bit field. This
is not allowed by standard C, but is allowed by standard C++,
and since most C compilers these days can also operate in a C++ mode,
and this feature seems pretty harmless to allow, it is accepted
by most (but not all) C compilers. If you decide to play by
the official C rules and not use enumeration types in a bit field,
you are punished in the debugger, because it displays your values
numerically rather than using the enumeration identifiers.
Other examples include whether you can write
default:
}
at the end of a switch statement. Officially that is not allowed
by the syntax -- you need at least one statement there, but a number of
C compilers accept it anyway. It's hard to call it a serious bug, but
it creates niggling portability problems.
One of the things that "validation" does is to force compilers to
check and complain about all of these "trivial" illegalities. If
most compilers are validated for a particular language, then that
helps to define what rules are enforced by most compilers, and what
rules are overlooked (not many if the validation suite is good).
But as you point out, validation does not guarantee reliability of
compilers, though it does tend to help quite a bit with portability
of programs.
--
-Tucker Taft stt@averstar.com http://www.averstar.com/~stt/
Technical Director, Distributed IT Solutions (www.averstar.com/tools)
AverStar (formerly Intermetrics, Inc.) Burlington, MA USA
next prev parent reply other threads:[~1999-01-22 0:00 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 366+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <m3k8yhy6fe.fsf@fred.muc.de>
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Ada vs C++ vs Java Tucker Taft
1999-01-21 0:00 ` forsyth
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Tucker Taft [this message]
1999-01-25 0:00 ` Walter Mallory
1999-01-13 0:00 Leszek Sczaniecki
1999-01-13 0:00 ` David A. Frantz
1999-01-14 0:00 ` forsyth
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-15 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Network
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Ken Keys
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Stanley R. Allen
[not found] ` <369CF2CF.440F413C@hercii.mar.lmco.com>
1999-01-16 0:00 ` bob
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
1999-01-12 0:00 Leszek Sczaniecki
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Erik Funkenbusch
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Peter
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Corvus
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Ralph Cook
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Bob Munck
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Erik Funkenbusch
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Dave Whipp
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Ken Keys
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Ken Keys
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-14 0:00 ` John Woodruff
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Ken Keys
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Marc A. Criley
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Erik Funkenbusch
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Chris Gray
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Gerhard Menzl
1999-01-14 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Pat Rogers
1999-01-16 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Pat Rogers
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Mike Coffin
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Mike Coffin
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Mike Coffin
1999-01-19 0:00 ` adam
1999-01-18 0:00 ` kevin
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Mike Coffin
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-01-21 0:00 ` adam
1999-01-23 0:00 ` Simon Wright
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Michael Rubenstein
1999-01-19 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Lieven Marchand
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-22 0:00 ` adam
1999-01-23 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-24 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-01 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1999-02-01 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-02-02 0:00 ` Jerry van Dijk
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1999-01-19 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1999-01-21 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-21 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1999-01-21 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1999-01-24 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-24 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1999-01-25 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-25 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1999-01-27 0:00 ` Ola Liljedahl
1999-01-27 0:00 ` Scott Johnson
1999-01-28 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Ell
1999-01-17 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-04 0:00 ` mll
1999-02-04 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-04 0:00 ` John McCabe
1999-02-04 0:00 ` Hyman Rosen
1999-02-04 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-05 0:00 ` John McCabe
1999-02-05 0:00 ` Stephen Leake
1999-02-06 0:00 ` Michael Stark
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Stanley Friesen [Contractor]
1999-02-12 0:00 ` Michael Stark
1999-02-05 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-05 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-05 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-05 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-06 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-06 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-06 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-08 0:00 ` dennison
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-02-08 0:00 ` William Clodius
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Matt Austern
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1999-02-06 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1999-02-08 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-09 0:00 ` atomly
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-02-09 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-10 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-10 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-10 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-10 0:00 ` nabbasi
1999-02-10 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-02-12 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-12 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-10 0:00 ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
1999-02-11 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-12 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-13 0:00 ` Dale Stanbrough
1999-02-15 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-15 0:00 ` P.S. Norby
1999-02-16 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
[not found] ` <79fnce$iv8@drn.newsguy.c <36beecef.70d8ed5e@pwfl.com>
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-02-07 0:00 ` James S. Rogers
1999-02-07 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-07 0:00 ` Simon Wright
1999-02-09 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-09 0:00 ` nabbasi
1999-02-07 0:00 ` James S. Rogers
1999-02-07 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-07 0:00 ` atomly
1999-02-08 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Dan Nagle
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Pascal Obry
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-02-08 0:00 ` robert_dewar
[not found] ` <79 <36BF2098.11E0761B@erols.com>
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Bjarne Stroustrup
1999-02-09 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
[not found] ` <79k65l$s0t@drn.news <36c006b8.fc6c187d@acenet.com.au>
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-02-05 0:00 ` Tucker Taft
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Fredric L. Rice
1999-02-05 0:00 ` Richard D Riehle
1999-02-06 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-05 0:00 ` Andrew Koenig
1999-02-05 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Stanley Friesen [Contractor]
1999-02-08 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-09 0:00 ` P.S. Norby
1999-02-06 0:00 ` Brian Rogoff
1999-02-08 0:00 ` mike
1999-02-08 0:00 ` Brian Rogoff
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Brian Rogoff
1999-02-09 0:00 ` Geoff Bull
1999-02-09 0:00 ` dennison
1999-02-09 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Bjarne Stroustrup
1999-01-16 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Gerhard Menzl
1999-01-15 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Crazy Pete
1999-01-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Judah Diament
1999-01-16 0:00 ` bill
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-01-17 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-17 0:00 ` bill
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Judah Diament
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Dennis
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-18 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-18 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Peter Hend�n
1999-01-19 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Crazy Pete
1999-01-19 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Christopher Browne
1999-01-19 0:00 ` bill
1999-01-20 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Peter Hend�n
1999-01-20 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-20 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-20 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-20 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-21 0:00 ` dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` bourguet
1999-01-21 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-20 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-21 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
[not found] ` <m3g194bhzh.fsf@fred.muc.de>
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Stephen Leake
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-21 0:00 ` bill_1
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-22 0:00 ` bill_1
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-23 0:00 ` Simon Wright
1999-01-23 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-24 0:00 ` Simon Wright
1999-01-24 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-24 0:00 ` dewar
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Tarjei Tj�stheim Jensen
1999-01-20 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1999-01-20 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-20 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Martin Dowie
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Gerhard Menzl
1999-01-18 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-15 0:00 ` James Kanze
1999-01-16 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-17 0:00 ` phil
1999-01-17 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-18 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-18 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-18 0:00 ` James Kanze
1999-01-18 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-18 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-19 0:00 ` James Kanze
1999-01-18 0:00 ` James Kanze
1999-01-18 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-18 0:00 ` James Kanze
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Wolfgang Denk
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Ola Liljedahl
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Herman
1999-01-15 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-16 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Ken Keys
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Tucker Taft
1999-01-13 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Corvus
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Herman
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Craig Garrett
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Michael Trausch
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Martijn Lievaart
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Craig Garrett
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Jeff Carter
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-18 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-18 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-24 0:00 ` Nick Roberts
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Peter Flynn
[not found] ` <01be3f41$c1205ba0$5704fbd1@longslide>
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Tom Maier
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Vladyslav Kosulin
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Thaddeus L. Olczyk
1999-01-17 0:00 ` Craig Garrett
1999-01-20 0:00 ` Gerry Quinn
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Tov Are Jacobsen
1999-01-13 0:00 ` John Woodruff
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Peter
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Peter Sch�ller
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dewar
1999-01-15 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-14 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Richard Krehbiel
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Dave Hansen
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-14 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dewar
1999-01-15 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-13 0:00 ` David Gillon
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Peter Amey
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Ola Liljedahl
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Ola Liljedahl
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Chris Gray
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Tom Maier
1999-01-21 0:00 ` Brent A Ellingson
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Crazy Pete
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Markus Kuhn
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Peter
1999-01-15 0:00 ` David C. Hoos, Sr.
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Tucker Taft
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Herman
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-15 0:00 ` David R. Conrad
1999-01-15 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Al Christians
1999-01-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Michael J. Tobler
1999-01-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Bob Munck
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Patrick Wibbeler
1999-01-26 0:00 ` Ken
1999-01-27 0:00 ` Scott Johnson
1999-01-26 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-27 0:00 ` Peter Amey
1999-01-29 0:00 ` P.S. Norby
1999-01-27 0:00 ` Robert Garskof
1999-01-27 0:00 ` Jay O'Connor
1999-01-28 0:00 ` Marin David Condic
1999-01-28 0:00 ` Joshua fit de wall
1999-01-29 0:00 ` Herman
1999-01-31 0:00 ` Ruth Ivimey-Cook
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Bob Cousins
1999-01-14 0:00 ` jim.hyslop
1999-01-15 0:00 ` robert_dewar
1999-01-14 0:00 ` dennison
1999-01-13 0:00 ` Tucker Taft
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Emil Rojas
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Pete Becker
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Scott Johnson
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Matthew Heaney
1999-01-18 0:00 ` James Kanze
1999-01-19 0:00 ` Scott Johnson
[not found] ` <01be3f5e$26453ca0$5704fbd1@longslide>
1999-01-14 0:00 ` Siamak Kaveh
1999-01-16 0:00 ` Craig Garrett
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Ken Keys
1999-01-15 0:00 ` Bruce Detter
1999-01-18 0:00 ` John Birch
1999-01-18 0:00 ` Bruce Detter
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Dr. Hubert B. Keller
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Bob Cousins
1999-01-22 0:00 ` Roedy Green
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