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From: Tom Welsh <news@tom-welsh.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died))
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 15:59:54 +0100
Date: 2003-05-16T15:59:54+01:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <AZvjPKAqzPx+EwY1@nildram.co.uk> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 9fa75d42.0305160440.7846d18c@posting.google.com

In article <9fa75d42.0305160440.7846d18c@posting.google.com>, soft-eng
<softeng3456@netscape.net> writes
>
>Btw, the architect of Win-32 is the same individual
>who architected VAX-VMS.  (Bill Gates doesn't sit down
>and design Windows himself, he hires good people.)
>That might be one of the reasons why Win-32 has always
>been relatively stable, and with almost a decade of
>use behind it, has achieved very decent quality levels.

That turns out not to be the case.

1. Dave Cutler didn't architect VAX/VMS all by himself. He was a member
of a team, and not necessarily the dominant member (except perhaps in
terms of personality).

2. Cutler didn't design Win32 either. He joined Microsoft in 1988 to
write a new operating system, which turned out to be Windows NT.
Cutler's team wrote the operating system kernel and services. Win32 was
a load that NT had to carry, not a source of strength. 

3. According to G Pascal Zachary's book "Showstopper!", "...Cutler
didn't disguise his scorn for Microsoft and its products. He thought the
company's code was poorly written, and that DOS, its crown jewel, was a
'toy'".

Actually, it was the requirement to support the Windows graphics
subsystem that came closest to wrecking the whole NT project. Zachary
again: "Cutler saw the worst in graphics. 'He worried about that group
all the time,' an intimate said. 'He saw them as loose cannons'".

It is true that Cutler's work laid the foundation for a series of
"relatively stable" Microsoft operating systems. But there was (and
still is) a fundamental tension between the things that make VMS and
Windows NT stable, and the user interface glitz that have made Windows
the popular success it is.
-- 
Tom Welsh



  reply	other threads:[~2003-05-16 14:59 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 666+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <mvul4v00ftbai2g6duuh0r38jpii2qvpjl@4ax.com>
     [not found] ` <PuF2a.34145$rq4.2589125@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>
     [not found]   ` <HA8sq6.6AL@bath.ac.uk>
     [not found]     ` <a3eaa964.0302132057.7568b83d@posting.google.com>
     [not found]       ` <slrnb4qo0n.q3u.mbkennelSPAMBEGONE@lyapunov.ucsd.edu>
     [not found]         ` <a3eaa964.0302141953.16f72dfe@posting.google.com>
     [not found]           ` <3E4E8F8C.9C096985@adaworks.com>
     [not found]             ` <9fa75d42.0302250710.5549baaf@posting.google.com>
     [not found]               ` <3E5C7033.BD5DC462@adaworks.com>
     [not found]                 ` <9fa75d42.0302260618.7506cba7@posting.google.com>
     [not found]                   ` <3E5CF5C6.84822F57@adaworks.com>
2003-02-26 22:22                     ` Ada versus language-X and "getting real work done" (was): 64 bit addressing and OOP Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-26 22:50                       ` Hyman Rosen
     [not found]                         ` <1quq5v0sb922r76rbpmcs2pe19dr4i5a2r@4ax.com>
2003-02-27  3:35                           ` Steve
2003-02-27  7:17                             ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-27  4:38                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-02-27  6:47                             ` Karel Miklav
2003-04-16 20:33                             ` Tom Welsh
2003-04-23 17:56                               ` Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
2003-02-27 22:06                           ` Dr Chaos
2003-02-27 23:49                             ` JXStern
2003-02-28  0:45                               ` Dr Chaos
2003-02-28  1:08                                 ` JXStern
2003-03-07 16:14                           ` Grant Wagner
2003-04-16 20:36                             ` Tom Welsh
2003-03-07 18:59                           ` John R. Strohm
2003-03-10 15:22                             ` soft-eng
2003-03-10 18:13                               ` John R. Strohm
2003-02-27  7:09                         ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-27 15:32                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-02-28  0:05                             ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-27 12:35                       ` Marin David Condic
2003-02-27 23:57                         ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-28 11:52                           ` Marin David Condic
2003-02-28  0:13                         ` Karen
2003-02-27 14:30                       ` Colin Paul Gloster
2003-02-27 15:26                       ` soft-eng
2003-02-27 20:27                         ` Mark Thornton
2003-02-27 23:52                         ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-28 14:15                           ` soft-eng
2003-03-01 22:08                             ` AG
     [not found]                               ` <gf906vsc9rt677tusubo3btsjmn1ev1sgm@4ax.com>
2003-03-02 20:55                                 ` AG
2003-03-02 23:38                               ` soft-eng
2003-03-03 12:33                                 ` Lloyd Bonafide
2003-03-03 13:58                             ` soft-eng
2003-02-27 20:18                       ` Mark Thornton
2003-02-27 18:13                         ` CJT
2003-02-26 22:48                     ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died " Kent Paul Dolan
2003-02-27  0:38                       ` Robert C. Leif
2003-02-27 12:28                         ` Preben Randhol
2003-02-28  3:51                           ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died Richard Riehle
2003-02-28 12:24                             ` Marin David Condic
2003-02-28 12:48                               ` Marin David Condic
2003-03-01  1:42                                 ` Robert C. Leif
2003-03-01  2:56                                 ` Richard Riehle
2003-03-01 13:13                                   ` Marin David Condic
2003-03-02  0:39                                     ` Robert C. Leif
2003-03-02 16:27                                     ` John R. Strohm
2003-03-02 20:03                                       ` Robert A Duff
2003-03-03  1:21                                         ` Hide or reveal ? (Re: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Faust
2003-03-03  8:05                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-03-03  9:04                                             ` Faust
2003-03-03 18:04                                       ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died Marin David Condic
2003-04-16 20:48                       ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died (was): 64 bit addressing and OOP Tom Welsh
2003-04-17  6:16                         ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-04-17 11:15                           ` Tom Welsh
2003-04-18 18:55                           ` Richard Riehle
2003-04-22 19:26                             ` soft-eng
2003-04-22 22:40                               ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-22 23:23                                 ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-22 23:30                                 ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-23  1:05                                   ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-27 16:11                                     ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-28  9:31                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-04-28 23:17                                         ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-29  7:53                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-04-28 18:16                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2003-04-23  1:41                                   ` Dr Chaos
2003-04-27 16:21                                     ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-23  5:14                                   ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-27 16:22                                     ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-27 21:34                                       ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-28  9:33                                       ` AG
2003-04-23 23:06                                   ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-04-24  0:43                                     ` Dr Chaos
2003-04-27 16:29                                     ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-23 12:39                                 ` soft-eng
2003-04-23 13:50                                   ` Stephen Leake
2003-04-23 16:55                                     ` soft-eng
2003-04-23 17:10                                   ` P S Norby
2003-04-23 17:57                                   ` Bill Findlay
2003-04-23 18:38                                   ` Dr Chaos
2003-04-24 13:03                                     ` soft-eng
2003-04-24 14:12                                       ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-24 20:27                                         ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-04-24 17:53                                       ` Mike Silva
2003-04-25 12:48                                         ` soft-eng
2003-04-26  5:16                                           ` Mike Silva
2003-04-26 14:49                                             ` soft-eng
2003-04-26 21:34                                               ` AG
2003-04-26 23:06                                                 ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-01  9:33                                                   ` Tom Welsh
2003-04-27  2:03                                                 ` Mike Silva
2003-04-27  5:36                                                   ` AG
2003-04-27 20:35                                                     ` Eric G. Miller
2003-04-27 21:40                                                     ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-28 21:42                                                       ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-04-29  3:44                                                         ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-28 17:42                                                     ` Mike Silva
2003-04-27  2:00                                               ` Frank J. Lhota
2003-04-27  2:27                                                 ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-04-27  6:24                                               ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-04-28 12:51                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-04-28 20:25                                                   ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-04-30 14:48                                                     ` soft-eng
2003-04-30 19:30                                                       ` Rod Davison
2003-04-24 22:09                                       ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-25 17:37                                         ` soft-eng
2003-04-25 18:48                                           ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-26  2:27                                             ` AG
2003-04-26 14:54                                             ` soft-eng
2003-04-26  1:15                                           ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died (was): 64 bit addressing a Dave Harris
2003-04-27 20:12                                             ` Hyman Rosen
2003-04-24 23:25                                       ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died (was): 64 bit addressing and OOP Richard Riehle
2003-04-25 17:28                                         ` soft-eng
2003-04-25  1:51                                       ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-26 15:17                                         ` soft-eng
2003-04-25  6:44                                       ` Tom Welsh
2003-04-25  6:58                                         ` AG
2003-04-25 12:43                                           ` soft-eng
2003-04-25 18:04                                             ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-26  3:38                                               ` Wesley Groleau
2003-04-26  3:52                                                 ` AG
2003-04-26 12:00                                                 ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-25 12:37                                         ` soft-eng
2003-04-25 18:23                                           ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-26  1:32                                           ` Richard Riehle
2003-04-26 14:59                                             ` soft-eng
2003-04-30  2:26                                               ` Richard Riehle
2003-04-30 12:12                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-04-30 14:21                                                   ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-01 14:45                                                     ` soft-eng
2003-05-02  1:12                                                       ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-02 13:20                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-02 14:45                                                           ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-02 14:58                                                           ` Martin Dowie
2003-05-02 17:10                                                           ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-02 15:20                                                         ` Kevin Cline
2003-05-02 15:42                                                           ` Graham Perkins
2003-05-03  4:24                                                             ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-04 18:20                                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-06 11:57                                                               ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-07  1:28                                                                 ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-08 12:41                                                                   ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-08 15:21                                                                     ` Frank J. Lhota
2003-05-10 23:23                                                                       ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-08 21:57                                                             ` Kevin Cline
2003-05-09  6:32                                                               ` apm
2003-04-28  9:05                                             ` Peter Hermann
2003-04-23 13:08                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-04-23  5:57                               ` Richard Riehle
2003-04-23 10:51                                 ` Volkert
2003-04-23 12:24                                 ` soft-eng
2003-04-23 16:31                                   ` Marc A. Criley
2003-04-23 17:18                                   ` tmoran
2003-04-24 12:46                                     ` soft-eng
2003-04-24 13:04                                       ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2003-04-24 17:50                                         ` soft-eng
2003-04-24 18:37                                           ` tmoran
2003-04-24 19:11                                           ` Robert Spooner
2003-04-25 13:01                                             ` soft-eng
2003-04-25 14:02                                               ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-04-24 20:10                                           ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-04-25 17:22                                             ` soft-eng
2003-04-25 18:24                                               ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-04-24 23:23                                           ` Using Ada for device drivers? Vinzent Hoefler
2003-04-24 23:30                                           ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Kaz Kylheku
2003-04-25 14:11                                             ` Using Ada for device drivers? Georg Bauhaus
2003-04-26 23:23                                               ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-04-27  1:53                                             ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Frank J. Lhota
2003-04-25  7:46                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-04-30  3:09                                           ` Will
2003-04-30  6:13                                             ` John R. Strohm
2003-04-30 12:31                                               ` Will
2003-04-30 17:17                                                 ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-01  3:37                                                   ` Will
2003-05-01  3:56                                                     ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-01 12:21                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-01 15:16                                                       ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-02  4:15                                                       ` Will
2003-05-02 13:57                                                         ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-02 16:15                                                           ` Mark
2003-05-03  3:13                                                           ` Will
2003-05-03  4:24                                                             ` Chad R. Meiners
     [not found]                                                 ` <fhm6o-3u2.ln1@beastie.ix.netcom.com>
2003-05-01 15:53                                                   ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-02  1:17                                                 ` Richard Riehle
2003-04-30 16:35                                               ` Kaz Kylheku
2003-04-30 17:22                                                 ` Frank J. Lhota
2003-05-01 19:03                                                   ` Kaz Kylheku
2003-05-02  8:26                                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-02 18:43                                                     ` Using Ada for device drivers? Georg Bauhaus
2003-04-30 20:15                                                 ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) John R. Strohm
2003-05-01 14:21                                                   ` soft-eng
2003-05-01 15:22                                                     ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-01 15:56                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-02  3:15                                                         ` James S. Rogers
2003-05-02  3:24                                                         ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-11 18:52                                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-11 20:11                                                             ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-11 21:09                                                               ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-11 23:43                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-11 23:54                                                                   ` Bill Findlay
2003-05-12 17:23                                                                   ` Mike Silva
2003-05-12 18:20                                                                     ` Stephen Leake
2003-05-13 11:42                                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-15 18:18                                                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-12 18:28                                                                   ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-05-11 21:57                                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-12  0:06                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-12  1:04                                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-12  3:53                                                                   ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-11 23:33                                                               ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-11 23:51                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-12  8:40                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
     [not found]                                                                 ` <bqj3p-t23.ln1@beastie.ix.netcom.com>
2003-05-12  5:04                                                                   ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-12 14:03                                                                     ` OT: Card Shuffling Frank J. Lhota
2003-05-11 23:50                                                               ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Bill Findlay
2003-05-12  8:18                                                               ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-11 21:07                                                             ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-12  0:49                                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-12 18:23                                                                 ` Stephen Leake
2003-05-14  5:00                                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-13  2:19                                                                 ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-13  3:21                                                             ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-01 18:35                                                     ` Marc A. Criley
2003-05-01 20:49                                                       ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-02  1:27                                                       ` soft-eng
2003-05-02  3:05                                                         ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-02 13:07                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-02 13:14                                                             ` Martin Dowie
2003-05-02 14:23                                                             ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-02 17:27                                                             ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-02 21:20                                                             ` Tom Welsh
2003-05-04 13:09                                                               ` Bill Findlay
2003-05-03  4:09                                                             ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-02  3:30                                                         ` James S. Rogers
2003-05-02 13:16                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-02 14:28                                                             ` Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-02 17:35                                                             ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-02 21:23                                                             ` Tom Welsh
2003-05-02 22:18                                                             ` Jim Rogers
2003-05-03  4:07                                                               ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-06 13:21                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-06 19:03                                                                 ` Jim Rogers
2003-05-07 13:04                                                                   ` soft-eng
2003-05-07 14:05                                                                     ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-07 17:29                                                                       ` soft-eng
2003-05-07 19:37                                                                         ` Mark Thornton
2003-05-08 13:48                                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-08 15:46                                                                             ` Thant Tessman
2003-05-09  3:37                                                                               ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-09  7:23                                                                                 ` Marshall Spight
2003-05-09 13:14                                                                                   ` soft-eng
2003-05-09 12:31                                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-10  4:57                                                                                   ` Tim Ottinger
2003-05-11 19:24                                                                                     ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-12  9:51                                                                                     ` Leif Roar Moldskred
2003-05-09 15:09                                                                                 ` Thant Tessman
2003-05-07 22:58                                                                         ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-08 14:06                                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-08 17:57                                                                             ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-08 18:20                                                                             ` tmoran
2003-05-09 13:22                                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-11 20:12                                                                                 ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-11 20:24                                                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-13  1:39                                                                                     ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and whyit " Richard Riehle
2003-05-08 23:16                                                                             ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it " John R. Strohm
2003-05-09 12:24                                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-09 16:03                                                                                 ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-09 16:28                                                                                   ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-09 23:45                                                                                     ` soft-eng
2003-05-10  2:32                                                                                       ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-10  4:24                                                                                     ` Jim Weirich
2003-05-08 12:29                                                                         ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-08 20:22                                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-08 21:33                                                                             ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-08 23:21                                                                             ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-09  8:30                                                                             ` Tom Welsh
2003-05-09 13:18                                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-09 15:01                                                                                 ` Tom Welsh
2003-05-09 23:41                                                                               ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-12 13:43                                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-13  3:25                                                                                   ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-13 17:30                                                                                     ` soft-eng
2003-05-13 22:19                                                                                       ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-14 12:53                                                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-14 14:55                                                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-14 22:56                                                                                             ` Thant Tessman
2003-05-13 10:36                                                                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                                                                                 ` <9fa75d42.03051205Followup-To: comp.lang.ada <zhA3ybPlX6cW@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2003-05-13 20:53                                                                                   ` Simon Wright
2003-05-08 14:34                                                                         ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-08 17:58                                                                           ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-07 16:33                                                                     ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-07 18:48                                                                     ` Jim Rogers
2003-05-07 19:09                                                                     ` Gautier
2003-05-07 22:45                                                                     ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-02 12:57                                                         ` Marc A. Criley
2003-05-02 18:55                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-09 14:57                                                             ` soft-eng
2003-05-09 15:44                                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-10 17:17                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-12  8:06                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-12 13:48                                                                     ` soft-eng
2003-05-12 14:33                                                                       ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-08  5:14                                                         ` Gautier
2003-05-09 14:12                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-09 14:33                                                             ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-09 14:38                                                             ` Frank J. Lhota
2003-05-09 16:09                                                             ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-09 23:49                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-10  2:44                                                                 ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-11 20:59                                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-11 22:24                                                                     ` Shayne Wissler
2003-05-13  3:15                                                                   ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-13 14:29                                                                     ` Robert Spooner
2003-05-13 14:46                                                                       ` James S. Rogers
2003-05-10 10:49                                                                 ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-12  5:36                                                                   ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Anders Wirzenius
2003-05-13  0:29                                                                     ` Willard Thompson
2003-05-13  2:16                                                                       ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-13 13:53                                                                         ` Kent Paul Dolan
2003-05-13  6:36                                                                       ` Anders Wirzenius
2003-05-13 13:43                                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-13 13:49                                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-13 14:28                                                                             ` Robert Spooner
2003-05-13 17:17                                                                               ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-14 14:35                                                                               ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-14 12:27                                                                             ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-14 15:16                                                                               ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-14 16:50                                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-14 18:45                                                                                   ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-15 16:32                                                                                     ` Stephen Leake
2003-05-15 17:18                                                                                       ` Quality systems Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-15 17:48                                                                                     ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Jim Rogers
2003-05-16 12:53                                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 13:36                                                                                 ` Steve O'Neill
2003-05-16 13:44                                                                                 ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-17  8:34                                                                                 ` Martin Dowie
2003-05-17 16:30                                                                                   ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-17  9:10                                                                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-05-17 14:45                                                                                 ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-14  7:36                                                                           ` Anders Wirzenius
2003-05-14 14:30                                                                             ` Robert Spooner
2003-05-14 17:10                                                                             ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-15 14:00                                                                             ` soft-eng
2003-05-16  6:12                                                                               ` Anders Wirzenius
2003-05-16 14:25                                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 22:20                                                                                   ` Quality systems Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-14 13:49                                                                           ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Marc A. Criley
2003-05-15  1:47                                                                             ` soft-eng
2003-05-15  6:43                                                                               ` tmoran
2003-05-15 14:29                                                                                 ` achrist
2003-05-15 14:34                                                                                   ` David Lightstone
2003-05-15 15:20                                                                                     ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-16  5:17                                                                                     ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-21 20:11                                                                                     ` Brian Gaffney
2003-05-21 21:51                                                                                       ` David Lightstone
2003-05-22  2:37                                                                                       ` achrist
2003-05-22 20:34                                                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-28 22:56                                                                                         ` David Lightstone
2003-05-22 20:29                                                                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-23  6:15                                                                                         ` Richard Riehle
2003-05-23 10:37                                                                                           ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-15 14:38                                                                                   ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: theAda " David C. Hoos
2003-05-15 15:20                                                                                     ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-15 16:34                                                                                     ` tmoran
2003-05-15 15:20                                                                                   ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada " Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-15 23:00                                                                                     ` achrist
2003-05-16  3:22                                                                                       ` Ada for tiny machines ? Wesley Groleau
2003-05-16  4:40                                                                                       ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada tmoran
2003-05-16 14:31                                                                                         ` achrist
2003-05-17  5:11                                                                                           ` tmoran
2003-05-17 18:33                                                                                             ` achrist
2003-05-18  3:19                                                                                               ` tmoran
2003-05-15 15:04                                                                                 ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Wesley Groleau
2003-05-16 12:31                                                                                   ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 13:47                                                                                     ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-16 18:20                                                                                     ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-16 14:04                                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 17:42                                                                                   ` Steve O'Neill
2003-05-15  8:13                                                                               ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-15 18:07                                                                                 ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-15 18:26                                                                                   ` Shayne Wissler
2003-05-16 15:40                                                                                     ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-16 17:24                                                                                     ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 18:54                                                                                       ` Linnea
2003-05-17  0:43                                                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 19:20                                                                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-16 20:57                                                                                         ` Larry Hazel
2003-05-17  0:42                                                                                         ` Alexander Kopilovitch
2003-05-17  0:47                                                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-17  1:55                                                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-17 15:28                                                                                     ` Bjorn Reese
2003-05-17 17:28                                                                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-15 19:48                                                                                   ` Robert Spooner
2003-05-16  2:47                                                                                     ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-16  4:03                                                                                       ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-15 19:39                                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-16  6:23                                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-16  9:56                                                                                     ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-16 17:30                                                                                       ` Logic Errors and Ada (Was: A big hairy thread on Ada, Quality, and Drivers) Marc A. Criley
2003-05-18 23:02                                                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-19  1:37                                                                                           ` James S. Rogers
2003-05-19  3:13                                                                                             ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-19  5:44                                                                                             ` Anders Wirzenius
2003-05-20  0:55                                                                                               ` James S. Rogers
2003-05-19  2:00                                                                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-20 10:28                                                                                             ` Logic Errors and Ada Peter Hermann
2003-05-21  3:05                                                                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-19 11:11                                                                                           ` Logic Errors and Ada (Was: A big hairy thread on Ada, Quality, and Drivers) Martin Dowie
2003-05-19 19:42                                                                                             ` Simon Wright
2003-05-19 20:30                                                                                               ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-19 22:10                                                                                                 ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-20 13:36                                                                                                   ` Stephen Leake
2003-05-20  7:34                                                                                               ` Martin Dowie
2003-05-20 13:04                                                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-20 21:19                                                                                                   ` Martin Dowie
2003-05-21  7:19                                                                                                     ` Martin Dowie
2003-05-19 16:30                                                                                           ` Marc A. Criley
2003-05-19 21:57                                                                                           ` Gautier Write-only
2003-05-20 16:21                                                                                             ` soft-eng
2003-05-20 20:45                                                                                               ` Gautier Write-only
2003-05-20 20:52                                                                                               ` Tom Welsh
2003-05-16 17:43                                                                                       ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Chad R. Meiners
2003-05-16  9:39                                                                               ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-16 22:32                                                                                 ` AG
2003-05-17  1:48                                                                                   ` soft-eng
2003-05-17  3:20                                                                                     ` AG
2003-05-17  3:47                                                                                     ` James S. Rogers
2003-05-19  1:57                                                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-19  6:30                                                                                         ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-19  7:42                                                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-19  8:21                                                                                             ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-19 14:07                                                                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-19 14:31                                                                                                 ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-19 15:00                                                                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-19 15:21                                                                                                     ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-20 16:10                                                                                                   ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-20 19:23                                                                                                     ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-20 19:54                                                                                                       ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-22 21:15                                                                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-23  0:48                                                                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-23 18:38                                                                                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-24 22:42                                                                                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-25 10:53                                                                                                                 ` Matthew Woodcraft
2003-05-25 21:12                                                                                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-25 12:33                                                                                                                 ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-25 19:47                                                                                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-26 12:32                                                                                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-26 15:57                                                                                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-27 12:02                                                                                                                         ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-27 12:26                                                                                                                           ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-28 11:25                                                                                                                             ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-28  6:56                                                                                                                           ` AG
2003-05-28 11:34                                                                                                                             ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-28  8:24                                                                                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-28 11:38                                                                                                                             ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-29  9:17                                                                                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-29 10:55                                                                                                                                 ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-28  9:13                                                                                                                           ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-28 11:53                                                                                                                             ` Saturated Math (was: " Marin David Condic
2003-05-28 13:02                                                                                                                               ` Saturated Math Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-28 18:56                                                                                                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-28 20:06                                                                                                                                   ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-29  9:17                                                                                                                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-28 21:19                                                                                                                                   ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-28 21:45                                                                                                                                   ` Robert C. Leif
2003-05-29 11:02                                                                                                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-30  8:42                                                                                                                                     ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-30  9:22                                                                                                                                       ` AG
2003-05-30 10:54                                                                                                                                         ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-30 11:11                                                                                                                                           ` AG
2003-05-30 13:46                                                                                                                                             ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-30 18:55                                                                                                                                               ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-30 19:31                                                                                                                                                 ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-31  7:25                                                                                                                                               ` AG
2003-05-31 12:12                                                                                                                                                 ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-30 11:41                                                                                                                                       ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-30 19:10                                                                                                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-30 20:33                                                                                                                                         ` tmoran
2003-05-31  3:13                                                                                                                                           ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-31 13:31                                                                                                                                             ` Simon Wright
2003-05-30 22:50                                                                                                                                         ` John Griffiths
2003-05-31  9:30                                                                                                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-31  9:30                                                                                                                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-31 12:37                                                                                                                                           ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-30 18:49                                                                                                                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-30 19:46                                                                                                                                         ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-29  0:23                                                                                                                                 ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-29  3:13                                                                                                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-29 11:08                                                                                                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-29 17:08                                                                                                                                     ` tmoran
2003-05-30  1:33                                                                                                                                       ` Robert C. Leif
2003-05-30 11:32                                                                                                                                       ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-29 17:13                                                                                                                                     ` Mike Silva
2003-06-01 17:17                                                                                                                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-30 14:12                                                                                                                                   ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-30 14:23                                                                                                                                     ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-30 14:45                                                                                                                                       ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-30 16:03                                                                                                                                         ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-30 11:47                                                                                                                   ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Mark Lorenzen
2003-05-30 11:50                                                                                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-31  9:30                                                                                                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-31 12:45                                                                                                                         ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-31 17:19                                                                                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-27 21:08                                                                                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2003-05-23  7:27                                                                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-23 21:21                                                                                                             ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-24  7:33                                                                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-25  5:50                                                                                                             ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-25  9:13                                                                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-25 20:46                                                                                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-23 14:28                                                                                                           ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: theAda " Robert C. Leif
2003-05-25 15:38                                                                                                             ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: theAdamandate, " Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-20 20:59                                                                                                     ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, " tmoran
2003-05-21 15:11                                                                                                       ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-21 15:47                                                                                                         ` Quality systems Peter Hermann
2003-05-21 16:24                                                                                                         ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) tmoran
2003-05-21 11:42                                                                                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-21 15:29                                                                                                       ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-22  7:29                                                                                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-22 12:27                                                                                                           ` Quality systems Peter Hermann
2003-05-22 17:21                                                                                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-21 18:28                                                                                                       ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) John R. Strohm
2003-05-22  7:09                                                                                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-28 11:35                                                                                                     ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                                                                                                     ` <badvd5$raumj$1@ID-175126.newOrganization: LJK Software <QImmYdcyN2$d@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2003-05-28 12:29                                                                                                       ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-30 10:09                                                                                                     ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Larry Kilgallen
2003-05-20  3:03                                                                                                 ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-23  6:21                                                                                                 ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: theAda " Richard Riehle
2003-05-19  7:57                                                                                         ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada " Preben Randhol
2003-05-19 19:04                                                                                         ` Overflow checking in GNAT (Was: Quality systems) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2003-05-16 12:25                                                                               ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Marc A. Criley
2003-05-16 13:21                                                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-16 19:07                                                                                   ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-19  7:35                                                                                   ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2003-05-19  7:39                                                                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-19  8:46                                                                                       ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2003-05-19 14:01                                                                                         ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-19 20:38                                                                                           ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-20  7:51                                                                                           ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2003-05-20  5:52                                                                                         ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-20 13:18                                                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-21 13:57                                                                                             ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-21 14:22                                                                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-23  5:18                                                                                                 ` The Ghost In The Machine
2003-05-25  5:54                                                                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-25  6:28                                                                                                     ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-25  6:35                                                                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-16 18:14                                                                                 ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-19 14:43                                                                                 ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Larry Kilgallen
2003-05-19 15:04                                                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-13 14:43                                                                         ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) soft-eng
2003-05-13 21:01                                                                           ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-14 12:36                                                                             ` soft-eng
2003-05-15 13:55                                                                               ` Graham Perkins
2003-05-16 12:40                                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-16 14:59                                                                                   ` Tom Welsh [this message]
2003-05-16 15:52                                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-17 14:34                                                                                     ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-17 16:59                                                                                       ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-17 18:01                                                                                         ` WinGuru
2003-05-17 18:08                                                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-17 21:58                                                                                           ` AG
2003-05-18  8:12                                                                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2003-05-18  7:50                                                                                         ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-18  9:07                                                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-18  9:10                                                                                             ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-18  9:27                                                                                             ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-18  9:56                                                                                               ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-18 13:39                                                                                               ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-22 10:16                                                                                                 ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-22 11:43                                                                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-22 11:50                                                                                                     ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-22 12:52                                                                                                     ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-05-18  0:52                                                                                       ` tmoran
2003-05-18  7:54                                                                                         ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-18  9:04                                                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-18  9:25                                                                                             ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-18  9:55                                                                                               ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-18 10:50                                                                                                 ` Pascal Obry
2003-05-19  7:52                                                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-18 10:16                                                                                               ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-18 11:06                                                                                                 ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-18 11:10                                                                                                   ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-18 11:37                                                                                                     ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-19  7:50                                                                                                       ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-19  8:23                                                                                                         ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-19 15:12                                                                                                         ` Wesley Groleau
2003-05-18 11:41                                                                                                     ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-05-19  7:47                                                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-19 15:11                                                                                                     ` [off-topic] fruit inspection Wesley Groleau
2003-05-19 19:00                                                                                                       ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-22 11:00                                                                                 ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                                                                                 ` <9fa75d42.0305160440.7846d1Organization: LJK Software <bNuxBNMk4BSq@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2003-05-22 13:12                                                                                   ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2003-05-22 14:17                                                                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                                                                             ` <9fa75d42.0305140436.5 <ba067m$iph$1@south.jnrs.ja.net>
2003-05-15 14:18                                                                               ` Roy Smith
2003-05-15 16:44                                                                                 ` Quality systems Dave Aronson
2003-05-16  0:40                                                                                   ` Willard Thompson
2003-05-13 14:48                                                                         ` Quality systems (Was: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died)) Willard Thompson
2003-05-13 16:03                                                                     ` Kaz Kylheku
2003-05-09 16:23                                                             ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Wesley Groleau
2003-05-09 18:52                                                             ` Jim Rogers
2003-05-12  0:47                                                               ` Dave Thompson
2003-05-14  3:25                                                                 ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-14  5:19                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-22  6:30                                                                   ` Dave Thompson
2003-05-09 19:27                                                             ` Marc A. Criley
2003-05-10 14:09                                                               ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-10 17:37                                                                 ` soft-eng
2003-05-10 18:00                                                                   ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-05-09 22:32                                                             ` Gautier
2003-05-01 19:29                                                     ` Gautier
2003-05-09 13:36                                                       ` soft-eng
2003-05-09 16:14                                                         ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-09 17:46                                                         ` soft-eng
2003-05-10  8:40                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-10  8:30                                                         ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-10 17:35                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-12  8:16                                                             ` Preben Randhol
2003-05-01 19:44                                                     ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-02 12:29                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-09 17:37                                                       ` soft-eng
2003-05-10  6:56                                                         ` Tom Welsh
2003-05-10 14:51                                                           ` Marin David Condic
2003-05-10 17:27                                                           ` soft-eng
2003-05-11  1:36                                                             ` John R. Strohm
2003-05-11 22:13                                                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2003-05-12 13:51                                                               ` soft-eng
2003-05-13 12:12                                                                 ` Using Ada for device drivers? Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-15  1:32                                                                   ` soft-eng
2003-05-15 17:54                                                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-10 14:36                                                         ` Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) Marin David Condic
2003-05-02 18:21                                                 ` Using Ada for device drivers? Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-02 18:37                                                   ` Robert A Duff
2003-05-04 18:33                                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-05 12:30                                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-05 13:12                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-06 14:47                                                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-06 17:37                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-06 21:02                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2003-05-06  9:15                                                     ` Peter Hermann
2003-05-06 19:40                                                     ` Jim Rogers
2003-05-06 20:13                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2003-05-06 20:13                                                     ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-04-24 13:05                                       ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died (was): 64 bit addressing and OOP Larry Kilgallen
2003-04-24 13:33                                       ` Vinzent Hoefler
2003-04-24 14:09                                       ` John R. Strohm
2003-04-24 20:37                                       ` Kaz Kylheku
2003-05-01  1:32                                       ` Adam Ruth
2003-04-23 18:31                                   ` Simon Wright
2003-04-23 18:40                                   ` Samuel Tardieu
2003-04-22 19:33                             ` Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                             ` <9fa75d42.0304221126.7112b7d5@posting.gOrganization: LJK Software <d3xFAUvBYizb@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2003-04-22 21:50                               ` Robert A Duff
2003-04-23  0:01                                 ` Dale Stanbrough
2003-04-26 14:44                                   ` soft-eng
2003-04-27  4:55                                     ` Steve
2003-04-27 21:48                                       ` [off-topic] electronic mismatch Wesley Groleau
2003-04-23 13:15                               ` the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died (was): 64 bit addressing and OOP soft-eng
2003-04-23 18:40                                 ` Dr Chaos
2003-05-01  1:39                                 ` Adam Ruth
2003-04-23 13:54                               ` Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                               ` <9fa75d42.030423Organization: LJK Software <kKoVGF55fYtj@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2003-04-23 15:47                                 ` H. S. Lahman
2003-04-25 19:38                                 ` soft-eng
2003-04-23  4:28                             ` Larry Kilgallen
2003-04-23 16:24                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2003-04-25  0:15                               ` Richard Riehle
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