From: john@assen.demon.co.uk (John McCabe)
Subject: Re: Ariane 5 - not an exception?
Date: 1996/08/25
Date: 1996-08-25T00:00:00+00:00 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <840979842.3697.0@assen.demon.co.uk> (raw)
In-Reply-To: EACHUS.96Aug23201508@spectre.mitre.org
eachus@spectre.mitre.org (Robert I. Eachus) wrote:
> I would be be fired three times over for incompetent engineering
>on that scale, and so would you. But the decisions were political and
>managerial. I can't overemphasize this. The decisions which caused
>the failure were signed off not by engineers but by government
>ministers and corporate executives.
That is one of the most major problems of working in the European
space industry - NOTHING is ever decided on purely technical terms. I
have experience of this even within my own (Anglo-French) company.
>And the effect, not the intent of
>those decisions insured that the engineers never knew how badly things
>were being botched. It speaks well for the consortium that they did
>an honest evaluation of what went wrong and published it.
I think this was necessary due to the amount of [European] government
money that went into the project in the first place, and therefore the
consortium had to make sure that _everyone_ was made aware that they
had discovered what the problem was. It would have been reasonably
easy to keep it quiet, but they need to build peoples confidence
again, and by publishing the report detailing that they knew exactly
what happened, and they knew exactly what to do about it in future, I
think they are well on their way to restoring that confidence.
>Unfortunately it was clearly bowdlerized and mentions no names. I
>suspect that this was a condition imposed upon publishing it.
That's unfortunate, I'd love to know exactly who was to blame -
perhaps more information is given in the restricted circulation
technical report? If anyone knows any more, please let us know.
Best Regards
John McCabe <john@assen.demon.co.uk>
next prev parent reply other threads:[~1996-08-25 0:00 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 194+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
1996-07-25 0:00 Ariane 5 - not an exception? Simon Bluck
1996-07-25 0:00 ` Multiple reasons for failure of Ariane 5 (was: Re: Ariane 5 - not an exception?) Kirk Beitz
1996-07-26 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-05 0:00 ` Darren C Davenport
1996-08-06 0:00 ` U32872
1996-08-07 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-08 0:00 ` Pascal Martin @lone
1996-08-09 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-10 0:00 ` dwnoon
1996-08-11 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-15 0:00 ` dwnoon
1996-08-16 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-20 0:00 ` dwnoon
1996-08-12 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-15 0:00 ` Richard Riehle
1996-08-22 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-31 0:00 ` Ada versus PL/I " Richard Riehle
1996-09-02 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-02 0:00 ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-09-03 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-03 0:00 ` Robb Nebbe
1996-09-17 0:00 ` shmuel
1996-09-17 0:00 ` Jay McFadyen
1996-09-18 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-09-20 0:00 ` shmuel
1996-09-03 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-04 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-09-07 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-06 0:00 ` PL/I or PL/1 Larry Hazel
1996-09-03 0:00 ` Ada versus PL/I (was: Re: Ariane 5 - not an exception?) J. Kanze
1996-09-07 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-09-09 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-09 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-09-09 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-09-11 0:00 ` Multiple reasons for failure of Ariane 5 " J.Worringen
1996-09-12 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-09-14 0:00 ` David Alex Lamb
1996-09-14 0:00 ` Use DejaNews to retrieve Ariane discussion David Alex Lamb
1996-09-19 0:00 ` Earl H. Kinmonth
1996-08-11 0:00 ` Multiple reasons for failure of Ariane 5 (was: Re: Ariane 5 - not an exception?) ++ robin
[not found] ` <4uibvh$References: <Dv45EJ.8r@fsa.bris.ac.uk>
1996-08-16 0:00 ` A. Grant
1996-08-08 0:00 ` bohn
1996-07-26 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
1996-08-23 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-26 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-27 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-28 0:00 ` Larry Kilgallen
1996-08-29 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-30 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-30 0:00 ` David Weller
1996-09-04 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-09-06 0:00 ` Sandy McPherson
1996-09-09 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-30 0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
1996-08-26 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-26 0:00 ` Dave Jones
1996-08-27 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-30 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-04 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-09-06 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-09-18 0:00 ` Merlin Dorfman
1996-09-20 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-30 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-30 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-09-06 0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
1996-09-06 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
1996-08-26 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-07-26 0:00 ` Ariane 5 - not an exception? Theodore E. Dennison
1996-07-29 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-07-26 0:00 ` JP Thornley
1996-07-29 0:00 ` Nigel Tzeng
1996-07-29 0:00 ` JP Thornley
1996-07-29 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1996-07-31 0:00 ` JP Thornley
1996-08-01 0:00 ` Alan Brain
1996-08-02 0:00 ` JP Thornley
1996-08-01 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-07-26 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-07-29 0:00 ` Bill Angel
1996-07-29 0:00 ` Paul_Green
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Lloyd Fischer
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Nancy Mead
1996-07-31 0:00 ` Steve O'Neill
1996-07-31 0:00 ` Tucker Taft
1996-08-01 0:00 ` root
1996-08-01 0:00 ` Tucker Taft
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Richard Shetron
1996-07-30 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Bob Kurtz
1996-08-04 0:00 ` Richard Riehle
1996-08-05 0:00 ` Fergus Henderson
1996-08-05 0:00 ` Nigel Tzeng
1996-08-06 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-05 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-13 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Darren C Davenport
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Kirk Bradley
1996-08-14 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-18 0:00 ` PL/I Versus Ada (Was: Arianne ...) Richard Riehle
1996-08-19 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-20 0:00 ` Lon Amick
1996-08-21 0:00 ` Tony Konashenok
1996-08-28 0:00 ` Richard Riehle
1996-08-29 0:00 ` Lon D. Gowen, Ph.D.
1996-08-30 0:00 ` Tony Konashenok
1996-08-30 0:00 ` Adam Beneschan
1996-08-30 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-21 0:00 ` Lon D. Gowen, Ph.D.
1996-08-21 0:00 ` Tim Dugan
1996-08-23 0:00 ` arbuckj
1996-08-22 0:00 ` Ariane 5 - not an exception? ++ robin
1996-08-22 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-14 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-19 0:00 ` Chris Papademetrious
1996-08-22 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-22 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-24 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-26 0:00 ` Byron B. Kauffman
1996-08-27 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-28 0:00 ` Byron B. Kauffman
1996-08-28 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1996-08-29 0:00 ` Ted Dennison
1996-08-30 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-22 0:00 ` Martin Tom Brown
1996-08-23 0:00 ` Bob Gilbert
1996-08-24 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1996-08-25 0:00 ` John McCabe [this message]
1996-08-27 0:00 ` Tom Speer
1996-08-26 0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
1996-08-20 0:00 ` Richard Riehle
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-02 0:00 ` Craig P. Beyers
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Steve O'Neill
1996-07-31 0:00 ` Martin Tom Brown
1996-07-31 0:00 ` Nigel Tzeng
1996-08-02 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-03 0:00 ` Thomas Kendelbacher
1996-08-01 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-01 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-05 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Mark van Walraven
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-02 0:00 ` Pascal Martin @lone
1996-08-03 0:00 ` Dr. Richard Botting
1996-08-05 0:00 ` system
1996-08-06 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-08 0:00 ` Darius Blasband
1996-08-10 0:00 ` dwnoon
1996-08-12 0:00 ` Thomas Kendelbacher
1996-08-13 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-13 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Roy Gardiner
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Lance Kibblewhite
1996-08-15 0:00 ` Richard Riehle
1996-08-05 0:00 ` Steve O'Neill
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Francis Lipski
1996-08-07 0:00 ` Martin Tom Brown
1996-08-09 0:00 ` Ken Garlington
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Frank Manning
1996-08-08 0:00 ` Steve O'Neill
1996-08-09 0:00 ` Pat Rogers
1996-08-09 0:00 ` JP Thornley
1996-08-13 0:00 ` ++ robin
1996-08-13 0:00 ` Steve O'Neill
1996-08-01 0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
1996-08-02 0:00 ` James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Robert I. Eachus
1996-08-06 0:00 ` Stefan 'Stetson' Skoglund
1996-07-26 0:00 ` Bob Gilbert
1996-07-29 0:00 ` Martin Tom Brown
1996-07-30 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-07-31 0:00 ` Greg Bond
1996-08-03 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-07-27 0:00 ` Bill Angel
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Dr. Richard Botting
1996-07-30 0:00 ` David Weller
1996-07-30 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
1996-08-08 0:00 Marin David Condic, 407.796.8997, M/S 731-93
1996-08-09 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-13 0:00 Marin David Condic, 407.796.8997, M/S 731-93
1996-08-15 0:00 ` John McCabe
1996-08-13 0:00 Marin David Condic, 407.796.8997, M/S 731-93
1996-08-15 0:00 ` John McCabe
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