Re: windows programming tutorials

Re: windows programming tutorials

[tmoran]

> ... and take a look at the source code for GWindows,
> AdaGIDE, Windex, and other open source projects.
  And the 2MB of open .ads & .adb files in the CLAW demo at
www.rrsoftware.com

Re: windows programming tutorials

[kryptoz]

In article <slrn7qu0iq.q4.aidan@skinner.demon.co.uk>,
  aidan@skinner.demon.co.uk wrote:
> On Mon, 09 Aug 1999 00:22:45 GMT, kryptoz <kryptoz@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> >language. I'd like to know if there are any tutorials out there on
how I
>
> There's the lovelace tutorial by David A Wheeler at
> http://www.adahome.com/Tutorials/Lovelace/lovelace.html
>
> >mentality :)). I'm using GNAT 3.11p for Windows and AdaGIDE and
GRASP as
>
> <mumbles something about emacs being the one true editor>
>
> - Aidan
> --
> Gimme money, gimme sex, gimme UNIX and root access.
> http://www.skinner.demon.co.uk/aidan/



The Lovelace tutorial is nice but it doesn't say anything about Win32
programming. Moreover, it doesn't have many code examples (at least the
ones I feel are important). Right now I'm reading Feldman and
Koffman's "Ada 95 Problem Solving and Program Design" (the electronic
edition) and I find it much more useful pedagogically (although I don't
agree so much with their not using "use".) I started last Thursday and
today I'm struggling to finish the fifth chapter. I hope to finish the
book this month and continue with an intermediate/advanced text next
month and finish with Win32 programming using Ada in October.
Regarding Emacs I have tried it before and I find it very interesting.
But right now I'm really concentrated on learning Ada and just don't
have the time to learn the intricacies of an editor such as Emacs.


kryptoz


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windows programming tutorials

[kryptoz]

Hi all!

I've just started with Ada (my first love, er... language) and I really
love it (I'm presently tinkering with ASM also - very challenging!). Ada
is simply powerful and elegant. I tried different forms of Basic, C, and
Euphoria, but it's with Ada that I got stuck with. I'm thinking of doing
MS Windows programming using Ada in the very near future (two months at
the most :)) when I become a little bit more proficient with the
language. I'd like to know if there are any tutorials out there on how I
should go about this (I get the impression that tutorials are not as
popular with the Ada folks as they are with the ASM cracker/hacker
groups). I don't have money right now to invest in ObjectAda nor Claw
(the demo versions are practically useless anyway) so I decided to do it
the tedious way (I think I'm getting too much influenced by the ASM
mentality :)). I'm using GNAT 3.11p for Windows and AdaGIDE and GRASP as
IDE's.
Thanks in advance!


kryptoz


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[Aidan Skinner]

On Mon, 09 Aug 1999 00:22:45 GMT, kryptoz <kryptoz@my-deja.com> wrote:

>language. I'd like to know if there are any tutorials out there on how I

There's the lovelace tutorial by David A Wheeler at
http://www.adahome.com/Tutorials/Lovelace/lovelace.html 

>mentality :)). I'm using GNAT 3.11p for Windows and AdaGIDE and GRASP as

<mumbles something about emacs being the one true editor>

- Aidan
-- 
Gimme money, gimme sex, gimme UNIX and root access.
http://www.skinner.demon.co.uk/aidan/

Re: windows programming tutorials

[David Botton]

See:

http://www.adapower.com/windows

and

http://www.adapower.com/com

See the examples there, and take a look at the source code for GWindows,
AdaGIDE, Windex, and other open source projects.

Also check out Jerry's Ada on Windows site http://stad.dsl.nl/%7Ejvandyk/

David Botton


kryptoz wrote in message <7ol70d$e4g$1@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>Hi all!
>
>I've just started with Ada (my first love, er... language) and I really
>love it (I'm presently tinkering with ASM also - very challenging!). Ada
>is simply powerful and elegant. I tried different forms of Basic, C, and
>Euphoria, but it's with Ada that I got stuck with. I'm thinking of doing
>MS Windows programming using Ada in the very near future (two months at
>the most :)) when I become a little bit more proficient with the
>language. I'd like to know if there are any tutorials out there on how I
>should go about this (I get the impression that tutorials are not as
>popular with the Ada folks as they are with the ASM cracker/hacker
>groups). I don't have money right now to invest in ObjectAda nor Claw
>(the demo versions are practically useless anyway) so I decided to do it
>the tedious way (I think I'm getting too much influenced by the ASM
>mentality :)). I'm using GNAT 3.11p for Windows and AdaGIDE and GRASP as
>IDE's.
>Thanks in advance!
>
>
>kryptoz
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

Re: windows programming tutorials

[kryptoz]

In article <7om2kq$214m$1@news.gate.net>,
  "David Botton" <David@Botton.com> wrote:
> See:
>
> http://www.adapower.com/windows
>
> and
>
> http://www.adapower.com/com
>
> See the examples there, and take a look at the source code for
GWindows,
> AdaGIDE, Windex, and other open source projects.
>
> Also check out Jerry's Ada on Windows site http://stad.dsl.nl/%
7Ejvandyk/
>
> David Botton
>



I have visited your site a number of times before already and I find it
very nice. In fact I've downloaded some stuff from there and I find
them very interesting. But I didn't find any tutorials on Win32
programming using Ada there (nor in Jerry's site). Or maybe I just have
to wait till I become more proficient in Ada (and stop being a newbie)
and find it out myself? In many asm sites I know there are so many
tutorials on Win32 programming using Assembly, but it's very difficult
to find such information in Ada sites. It seems like there aren't any
newbies amongst Ada programmers. Everyone seems to be a guru.
Thanks.


kryptos


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[Ted Dennison]

In article <7onqa3$9ol$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  kryptoz <kryptoz@my-deja.com> wrote:
> In article <7om2kq$214m$1@news.gate.net>,

> and find it out myself? In many asm sites I know there are so many
> tutorials on Win32 programming using Assembly, but it's very difficult
> to find such information in Ada sites. It seems like there aren't any

That's a bit more understandable for an Assembly site, because Assembly
is a completely different programming paradigm than C. Ada and C are
both procedural languages, so the basics of doing Win32 programming in
Ada are not significatly changed from doing it in C. There are some
rather stark differences between the two, but generally those
differences need have little impact on Win32 programming. If you want,
you can take a set of thin bindings and a C-based tutorial and you
should have little trouble.

--
T.E.D.


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[Ted Dennison]

In article <7onnql$84p$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  kryptoz <kryptoz@my-deja.com> wrote:

> edition) and I find it much more useful pedagogically (although I
don't
> agree so much with their not using "use".) I started last Thursday and

At the risk of starting it up again, there was a raging debate on this
subject a week or two ago. If you have no problem with the "use" clause,
you are in good company. But as an anit-user myself, I think you should
probably at least hear the arguments on both sides. For that reason I
suggest you try to dig up that thread on deja.com next time you get a
couple of spare hours.

> Regarding Emacs I have tried it before and I find it very interesting.
> But right now I'm really concentrated on learning Ada and just don't
> have the time to learn the intricacies of an editor such as Emacs.

The NT version of emacs is quite usable as an editor by just usnig the
arrow keys, the mouse, and the menus. I'd suggest using it like that for
starters. You can learn what else is available incrementally. That's how
I learned it.

--
T.E.D.


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[Robert Dewar]

In article <7opd3d$cgq$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  Ted Dennison <dennison@telepath.com> wrote:
> The NT version of emacs is quite usable as an editor by just
usnig the
> arrow keys, the mouse, and the menus. I'd suggest using it
like that for
> starters. You can learn what else is available incrementally.
That's how
> I learned it.


If you are an NT only user, you probably want to use EMACS
configured to have the NT look and feel, rather than the
normal Unix L&F.


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[David Botton]

Once you learn Ada, a couple of quick looks at some Win32 examples should be
enough to transfer over knowledge you have in the C / C++ world for
programming Win32. If you don't have a background in Win32 programming then
things get a little more difficult. In that case I would first suggest
deciding what your goal is, to learn Win32 APIs or to just write Ada
software that runs on Windows. The two are different goals with different
paths.

If you are looking to write Ada software that runs on Windows, learn how to
use one of the GUI frameworks from http://www.adapower.com/windows

If you are looking to learn Win32, I would recommend Petzold's Programming
Windows and translating example by example to Ada as a start.

David Botton


kryptoz wrote in message <7onqa3$9ol$1@nnrp1.deja.com>...
> Or maybe I just have
>to wait till I become more proficient in Ada (and stop being a newbie)
>and find it out myself? In many asm sites I know there are so many
>tutorials on Win32 programming using Assembly, but it's very difficult
>to find such information in Ada sites. It seems like there aren't any
>newbies amongst Ada programmers. Everyone seems to be a guru.
>Thanks.
>
>
>kryptos
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

Re: windows programming tutorials

[John Duncan]

> If you are an NT only user, you probably want to use EMACS
> configured to have the NT look and feel, rather than the
> normal Unix L&F.

Except that the NT l&f is very, very slow. The beautiful thing about Emacs
is having the most used keys on the home row and under the index fingers.

If it weren't such a hard habit to break, i'd switch caps-lock to control.

I'm not looking to start a war about this, just thought I'd state that
everyone should at least *try* the emacs l&f before switching it to NT.

-John

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Robert Dewar]

In article <7oqv9v$7sl$1@usenet01.srv.cis.pitt.edu>,
  "John Duncan" <jddst19+@pitt.edu> wrote:
>
> Except that the NT l&f is very, very slow. The beautiful thing
about Emacs
> is having the most used keys on the home row and under the
index fingers.
>
> If it weren't such a hard habit to break, i'd switch caps-lock
to control.
>
> I'm not looking to start a war about this, just thought I'd
state that
> everyone should at least *try* the emacs l&f before switching
it to NT.

Well I was simply giving my advice based on experience. Most
NT folks will dislke the standard L&F, simply because it is
so unfamiliar. The "so slow" comment is probably irrelevant'
to many NT users who much prefer using the mouse to cryptic
key sequences. The trouble with the standard EMACS L&F is that
it can easily put people off completely very quickly if they
are used to a windowsy environment, and it is important to
know that you do NOT have to live with what you may well
perceive (quite reasonably) from a Winwdows point of view
as a junky interface.

In my experience, the ONLY people who have felt as John does
are those who learn EMACS in a Unix environment and then come
to a NT environment later.


>
> -John
>
>


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[Geoff Bull]

John Duncan wrote:
> 
> If it weren't such a hard habit to break, i'd switch caps-lock to control.

I did just this on my Sun box, and converted the alt/graph key to a
right
control key (otherwise typing C-A etc is murder). It is now much easier
for me to switch between Sun and Windows keyboards.

This doesn't have much to do with Ada, does it?

Re: windows programming tutorials

[kryptoz]

In article <7ooes4$339m$1@news.gate.net>,
  "David Botton" <David@Botton.com> wrote:
> Once you learn Ada, a couple of quick looks at some Win32 examples
>should be enough to transfer over knowledge you have in the C / C++
>world for programming Win32. If you don't have a background in Win32
>programming then things get a little more difficult. In that case I
>would first suggest deciding what your goal is, to learn Win32 APIs or
>to just write Ada software that runs on Windows. The two are different
>goals with different paths.
>


Actually I want both. I want to be able to write software that runs on
Windows and also to be able to do Win32 programming using Ada and not
C/C++. The first one is of course more easy as there are a number of
tools like ObjectAda, Claw, Windex, WinAda, etc.,which one can use
(these last two are still a mystery for me at this stage of my Ada
ignorance). The second one, I understand, is more difficult as one has
to rely on one's own resources to be able to do it, but it gives one
more freedom to do whatever one wants. But, of course, first I have to
learn well my Ada and then the Win32 APIs :) :).


kryptoz


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[jerry]

kryptoz <kryptoz@my-deja.com> wrote:

: Actually I want both. I want to be able to write software that runs on
: Windows and also to be able to do Win32 programming using Ada and not
: C/C++.

You have two challenges ahead of you:

a) learn Ada programming
b) learn Windows programming

and than combine them.

Apart from some C-isms remaining in the current Win32 API for Ada, programming
Windows applications in Ada is not very much different than programming them
in C or C++.

-- 
-- Jerry van Dijk | Leiden, Holland
-- Team Ada       | jdijk@acm.org
-- see http://stad.dsl.nl/~jvandyk

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Marin David Condic]

jerry@jvdsys.stuyts.nl wrote:

> You have two challenges ahead of you:
>
> a) learn Ada programming
> b) learn Windows programming
>
> and than combine them.
>
> Apart from some C-isms remaining in the current Win32 API for Ada, programming
> Windows applications in Ada is not very much different than programming them
> in C or C++.
>

Out of curiosity - and respect for your considerable expertise in Win32ada - what
books do you recommend as the best way to learn this? I've got a book called Win32
System Services by Marshal Brain which I've found helpful for doing lots of casual
hacking, but I'd like to find something a bit more "big picture" and that
addressed the GUI stuff as well.

MDC
--
Marin David Condic
Real Time & Embedded Systems, Propulsion Systems Analysis
United Technologies, Pratt & Whitney, Large Military Engines
M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600, West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600
***To reply, remove "bogon" from the domain name.***

Visit my web page at: http://www.mcondic.com/

Re: windows programming tutorials

[jerry]

Marin David Condic <condicma@bogon.pwfl.com> wrote:

: Out of curiosity - and respect for your considerable expertise in Win32ada - what
: books do you recommend as the best way to learn this? I've got a book called Win32
: System Services by Marshal Brain which I've found helpful for doing lots of casual
: hacking, but I'd like to find something a bit more "big picture" and that
: addressed the GUI stuff as well.

For the 'big picture' I find Petzhold's book still to be the best (but then,
I started OS/2 PM programming many moons ago with his OS/2 PM book).

For GUI programming I think that 'Win32 Programming' by Rector & Newcomer
(AWL) is one of the best, providing suffient detail (but, think 'Cohen' :-)
and am tempted to whisper 'gtk'...

For finding specific information, microsofts MSDN site is of course very
useful, although for us Ada types, their specifications leave something
to be desired.

And then, of course, you will need books on the the various specific topics, 
from winsockets to com, which will start to stack up on your desk, and slowly
spread throughout your workspace, fighting for the best spots with your
Ada books...

-- 
-- Jerry van Dijk | Leiden, Holland
-- Team Ada       | jdijk@acm.org
-- see http://stad.dsl.nl/~jvandyk

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Marin David Condic]

jerry@jvdsys.stuyts.nl wrote:

> For the 'big picture' I find Petzhold's book still to be the best (but then,
> I started OS/2 PM programming many moons ago with his OS/2 PM book).
>

Thanks. Do you have a title? I want to call our library and have them order it so I can
look it over. Given that Pratt has just announced the closing of the Florida plant, and
my fear of Connecticut snowflakes in any quantity makes me reluctant to move, I figure
now is a good time to dust off some of the more marketable skills and Win32api is
something useful. FWIW, the Marshall Brain book is pretty good for as far as it attempts
to go - it just doesn't cover GUI stuff.

MDC
--
Marin David Condic
Real Time & Embedded Systems, Propulsion Systems Analysis
United Technologies, Pratt & Whitney, Large Military Engines
M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600, West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600
***To reply, remove "bogon" from the domain name.***

Visit my web page at: http://www.mcondic.com/

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Stephen Leake]

Marin David Condic <condicma@bogon.pwfl.com> writes:

> jerry@jvdsys.stuyts.nl wrote:
> 
> > For the 'big picture' I find Petzhold's book still to be the best (but then,
> > I started OS/2 PM programming many moons ago with his OS/2 PM book).
> >
> 
> Thanks. Do you have a title? I want to call our library and have them order it so I can
> look it over. Given that Pratt has just announced the closing of the Florida plant, and
> my fear of Connecticut snowflakes in any quantity makes me reluctant to move, I figure
> now is a good time to dust off some of the more marketable skills and Win32api is
> something useful. FWIW, the Marshall Brain book is pretty good for as far as it attempts
> to go - it just doesn't cover GUI stuff.

"Programming Windows 95", Charles Petzold, Microsoft Press 1996 
"Win32 Programming", Brent E. Rector, Joseph M. Newcomer, Addison-Wesley, 1997 

Marin - I heard on the news Pratt & Whitney is moving to Connecticut!
Are you going to have to give up your location in the sun? Maybe you'd
consider coming to Washington DC and writing Ada for NASA, instead of
moving all the way to the Frozen North :).

-- Stephe

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Marin David Condic]

Stephen Leake wrote:

> Marin - I heard on the news Pratt & Whitney is moving to Connecticut!
> Are you going to have to give up your location in the sun? Maybe you'd
> consider coming to Washington DC and writing Ada for NASA, instead of
> moving all the way to the Frozen North :).
>

Actually, to be 100% accurate, they've always been in Connecticut. The plan is to close down
the Florida plant and consolidate the Large Military Engine business with the Commercial
Engine business. There are actually a fair amount of contract issues and security problems
that have to be worked out, but the executive committee seems determined to move ahead with
it.

Washington DC? Become a Beltway Bandit? Sounds entertaining, but my current (and I stress
*current*) plan is to try to remain in South Florida and not have to sell my house while 4000
other houses in the North County area go up on the block. I'm open to short-term contract
positions as long as the money and conditions are right. Anything else, I'm willing to
consider if the situation sounds interesting enough. Go check out my resume on my web site.

Thanks for showing some concern about it. The whole thing has everyone down here a little
depressed and stressed out. Eventually, it will all work itself out, but in the mean time,
we're in for a rocky road. I just hope that all this doesn't endanger the F22 program. They
sure don't need any additional trouble these days. :-)

MDC
--
Marin David Condic
Real Time & Embedded Systems, Propulsion Systems Analysis
United Technologies, Pratt & Whitney, Large Military Engines
M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600, West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600
***To reply, remove "bogon" from the domain name.***

Visit my web page at: http://www.mcondic.com/

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Ted Dennison]

In article <37B33248.AACCF655@pwfl.com>,
  e108678@pwflcom wrote:

> look it over. Given that Pratt has just announced the closing of the
> Florida plant, and my fear of Connecticut snowflakes in any quantity
> makes me reluctant to move, I figure now is a good time to dust off
> some of the more marketable skills and Win32api is something useful.

Back in '94 when Martin Marietta (now LMC) started consolidating plants
with the newly acquired GE Aerospace plants, they decided that one
particlar operation in Vermont would be moved to Orlando. Of course they
sent out offers to all the engineers to move to the Orlando plant. Only
a couple of engineers agreed, and they were both very junior. The rest
of the engineers threatened to start up a competeing company in the
newly-abandoned plant (with much cheaper rent).

The operation ended up staying in Vermont.

(not that I'm suggesting anything...)
--
T.E.D.


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[Marin David Condic]

Ted Dennison wrote:

> Back in '94 when Martin Marietta (now LMC) started consolidating plants
> with the newly acquired GE Aerospace plants, they decided that one
> particlar operation in Vermont would be moved to Orlando. Of course they
> sent out offers to all the engineers to move to the Orlando plant. Only
> a couple of engineers agreed, and they were both very junior. The rest
> of the engineers threatened to start up a competeing company in the
> newly-abandoned plant (with much cheaper rent).
>
> The operation ended up staying in Vermont.
>
> (not that I'm suggesting anything...)
> --

Pretty clever!

Not that I'm shooting the idea down - or considering a revolution - but I
think it would be very difficult to do that here. A "competing" business
would be one that was making large military jet engines. Not something you
can easily get venture capital to back & contracts being as scarce as they
are, you could be waiting for years just to be able to bid on something.
Even if you broaden the scope to include all jet/rocket endeavors, it would
be hard to start from bottom-dead-center and get a marketable product off
the ground in some reasonable span of time. Coupled with the fact that the
industry is plateaued and probably in decline, it wouldn't pay off as well
as some other industries might.

Now figuring out some other use for the facilities & making a bid on it
might be more likely to succeed....

But this is, of course, way off topic. Unless we figure out how to do a
start-up with the Ada engineers that are suddenly willing to consider a
career change. (Hmmmmm.......)

MDC
--
Marin David Condic
Real Time & Embedded Systems, Propulsion Systems Analysis
United Technologies, Pratt & Whitney, Large Military Engines
M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600, West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600
***To reply, remove "bogon" from the domain name.***

Visit my web page at: http://www.mcondic.com/

Re: windows programming tutorials

[Ted Dennison]

In article <37B490B1.4FDDB063@pwfl.com>,
  e108678@pwflcom wrote:

> think it would be very difficult to do that here. A "competing"
business
> would be one that was making large military jet engines. Not something
you
> can easily get venture capital to back & contracts being as scarce as
they

Well, I guess my main point was the very small amount of folks that were
enticed to move from New England to Florida. One would think it would be
even tougher to get folks to move the other way. Any projects that move
w/o any of their engineers are going to be DOA. It may be unusual for a
large company to stare into the face of stark reality and make the
intelligent decision, but it wouldn't be unprecidented.

As for the rest: if it gives you ideas or just cheers you up, more's the
better.


--
T.E.D.


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Re: windows programming tutorials

[John Duncan]

> In my experience, the ONLY people who have felt as John does
> are those who learn EMACS in a Unix environment and then come
> to a NT environment later.
>

Except John, of course :)

-John