Am I "Overqualified"?

Am I "Overqualified"?

[Ed Berard]

Howdy Folks,

It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
of assignments, because I am "overqualified."

I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:

   * product architecture

   * product line architectures

   * process architectures.

I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
think that this has much to do with my problem.

If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
page:

   http://www.toa.com

Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

        -- Ed

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[topmind]

On Jan 30, 1:21 pm, Ed Berard <ed.ber...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy Folks,
>
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
>
>    * product architecture
>
>    * product line architectures
>
>    * process architectures.
>
> I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> think that this has much to do with my problem.
>
> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:
>
>    http://www.toa.com
>
> Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks.
>
>         -- Ed


That's a code-word for "too old" or "too expensive". Time to lie.

Welcome to IT in Amerika.

-T-

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[apm35]

On 30 Jan, 21:43, topmind <topm...@technologist.com> wrote:
> On Jan 30, 1:21 pm, Ed Berard <ed.ber...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Howdy Folks,
>
> > It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> > of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> > I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
>
> >    * product architecture
>
> >    * product line architectures
>
> >    * process architectures.
>
> > I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> > think that this has much to do with my problem.
>
> > If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> > page:
>
> >    http://www.toa.com
>
> > Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> > Thanks.
>
> >         -- Ed
>
> That's a code-word for "too old" or "too expensive". Time to lie.
>
> Welcome to IT in Amerika.

I agree but this has nothing to do with America. The desire to pay a
potential hire the minimum one can get away with is universal.

It is time to remove most of your experience from your CV. Although I
am a techie I have been involved in recruiting and I have seen (and
had to work with) employers that say "he's over-qualified". I always
argue against it but it is hard work.

>
> -T-

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[topmind]

On Jan 31, 12:21 am, ap...@student.open.ac.uk wrote:
> On 30 Jan, 21:43, topmind <topm...@technologist.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jan 30, 1:21 pm, Ed Berard <ed.ber...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Howdy Folks,
>
> > > It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> > > of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> > > I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
>
> > >    * product architecture
>
> > >    * product line architectures
>
> > >    * process architectures.
>
> > > I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> > > think that this has much to do with my problem.
>
> > > If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> > > page:
>
> > >    http://www.toa.com
>
> > > Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> > > Thanks.
>
> > >         -- Ed
>
> > That's a code-word for "too old" or "too expensive". Time to lie.
>
> > Welcome to IT in Amerika.
>
> I agree but this has nothing to do with America. The desire to pay a
> potential hire the minimum one can get away with is universal.
>
> It is time to remove most of your experience from your CV. Although I
> am a techie I have been involved in recruiting and I have seen (and
> had to work with) employers that say "he's over-qualified". I always
> argue against it but it is hard work.
>

This is part of the reason that it is suggested one tailor their
resume to a given position rather than use a generic one.  Just
include stuff that is relevant to their environment and snip out other
stuff or use very general summaries for such, especially if you've
been in the industry for a long time. For good or bad, the market does
NOT appreciate general IT development experience after about 7 years
out. After 7 years, they pretty much only care about specific tool
experience (unless maybe it is a quasi-management position).

-T-

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[KarlNyberg]

Precisely.  Ask for the world, pay the least you can.  Early on in my
career, I worked at a company you might recognize where the running
joke was that they only hired single people because they didn't have
social lives and would work way more than the normal 40 hour workweeks
without overtime...

There is some rationale for the overqualified (other than the age
discrimination thing), though.  If employers end up hiring somebody
who would be bored by the work, they find that their investment in
that person regarding their local processes and standards, etc. is
more likely wasted when that person finds something more "interesting"
and leaves.  That's not to say that sometimes you don't take jobs that
are the moral equivalent of "flipping burgers", either because it's
all that's available in your region or you REALLY have to pay the
mortgage, get medical insurance, or any other number of reasons, but
in those instances, the employer should realize that it's a limited
time engagement.  (And I use the word employer generically - although
it is significantly more difficult to be a contractor than a serial
employee, even in instances where the work being done is project based
and employers would discard the short-term employees as quickly as
contractors.)  Additionally, many companies (reasonably so, I believe)
don't want to go hiring "at the top" from outside the company - they
want people to "move up the ranks" and don't want to have somebody new
(or a contractor) in a relatively responsible position (of authority)
on a project.

Then again, sometimes one develops a reputation (good, bad, or
otherwise), which, when coupled with the above issues, in the current
environment that just make it not work out and employers need a polite
way of saying "no".  Besides "overqualified", there's "we don't hire
contractors" (at several companies where I've ended up being a
contractor), "we can't pay that kind of money to somebody who works
out of their house" (but if I got an office that I was never in, since
they required me to be "onsite", it would be OK - go figure),
"unqualified" (that was for one Ada flipping-burgers project where the
money was already "wired" to somebody else and they had to find me
unqualified because I underbid the other party).

I like to do work in Ada (and look for those opportunities where I can
and which make sense).  I may not be completely "overqualified", with
my only twenty+ years experience, numerous clients, extensive
publications, recent awards from Sun Microsystems and ACM SIGAda and
all.  But it's a small, small world and there are too many of those
abovementioned kinds of issues in the limited Ada marketplace these
days.  Thank goodness that other markets don't have these constraints
- I'm busily coding away on Java and C on Solaris and Linux from the
comfort of my basement office, making more money than I've been paid
to do any project in Ada in years.

And it beats flipping burgers...

-- Karl --

http://www.grebyn.com

On Jan 31, 3:21 am, ap...@student.open.ac.uk wrote:
> On 30 Jan, 21:43, topmind <topm...@technologist.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 30, 1:21 pm, Ed Berard <ed.ber...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Howdy Folks,
>
> > > It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> > > of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> > > I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
>
> > >    * product architecture
>
> > >    * product line architectures
>
> > >    * process architectures.
>
> > > I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> > > think that this has much to do with my problem.
>
> > > If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> > > page:
>
> > >    http://www.toa.com
>
> > > Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> > > Thanks.
>
> > >         -- Ed
>
> > That's a code-word for "too old" or "too expensive". Time to lie.
>
> > Welcome to IT in Amerika.
>
> I agree but this has nothing to do with America. The desire to pay a
> potential hire the minimum one can get away with is universal.
>
> It is time to remove most of your experience from your CV. Although I
> am a techie I have been involved in recruiting and I have seen (and
> had to work with) employers that say "he's over-qualified". I always
> argue against it but it is hard work.
>
>
>
> > -T-

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Gautier]

Ed Berard:

> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."

It's better to be overqualified than underqualified: you can selectively hide 
some qualifications, putting them in the private part of your package (to speak 
Ada...).

G.

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Ludovic Brenta]

Gautier writes:
> Ed Berard:
>
>> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
>> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> It's better to be overqualified than underqualified: you can
> selectively hide some qualifications, putting them in the private
> part of your package (to speak Ada...).

I have also had the same feeling, and I'm not sure I agree with you.
I wouldn't like to be hired for a low-end job with low-end wages and
low-end colleagues.  Unfortunately, I get the impression that most of
the job market consists of such positions.  Except, of course, in the
mission- or life-critical sectors.

-- 
Ludovic Brenta.

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Phlip]

Ed Berard:
 
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."

We have an opening for XP with Ruby on Rails in Irvine, CA. Our 
development is very rapid, with a trivial bug rate, and no formal QA. 
(Also we get to see my assert{ 2.0 } in action!;)

Opinionated: Good.

Too busy pontificating to pair, write tests, pass them, and refactor: 
Overqualified.

-- 
  Phlip

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Jeffrey R. Carter]

Ed Berard wrote:
> 
> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:
> 
>    http://www.toa.com

No, I can't:

Error 404: The Item You Requested Could Not Be Found.

-- 
Jeff Carter
"Sheriff murdered, crops burned, stores looted,
people stampeded, and cattle raped."
Blazing Saddles
35

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Ed Berard]

Jeff:

On Jan 30, 6:07 pm, "Jeffrey R. Carter"
<spam.jrcarter....@acm.nospam.org> wrote:
> Ed Berard wrote:
>
> > If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> > page:
>
> >    http://www.toa.com
>
> No, I can't:
>
> Error 404: The Item You Requested Could Not Be Found.

Fixed.

            -- Ed

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Tom]

Ed:

Enter a number of papers to A. M. G. Solo's conferences and feature them 
prominately on your resume.  Then the discerning reader will know that 
you cannot be overqualified.

Seriously, I doubt that your resume can be the problem as I doubt that 
anyone would buy or reject you based on that.  I know you (or at least 
knew your 20 years ago) and your reputation is excellent.  People usually 
hire those they know and already trust.

I think the problem may be more that people don't know you.  You may not 
be doing enough publicity work (talks, presentations, free consulting, 
etc.) to catch prospective clients.

Tom Reid

[posted and mailed]

Ed Berard <ed.berard@gmail.com> wrote in news:d91db3d5-4a34-4ec7-bda1-
a6ecb770b0f0@s37g2000prg.googlegroups.com:

> Howdy Folks,
> 
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
> 
> I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
> 
>    * product architecture
> 
>    * product line architectures
> 
>    * process architectures.
> 
> I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> think that this has much to do with my problem.
> 
> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:
> 
>    http://www.toa.com
> 
> Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
>         -- Ed

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Michael Bolton]

> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."

> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:

>    http://www.toa.com

> Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.

"Overqualified" from a potential client might mean "involved in too
many things that aren't important to me".

Think about your reader.  /Your reader is not you./  His interests are
very different from yours.  Your reader has two issues:

1) He has a problem that he wants solved or task he wants done.

2) He wants to find quickly someone who can solve that problem for
him.

ANYTHING that slows him down in this task is going to work against
you.  He isn't interested in anything that isn't relevant to solving
his problem, and he's certainly not interested in slogging through 11
pages of biography and citations.  Focus on your potential client's
needs.  Your covering letter is closer to the idea--but then you ask
him to look up a whole bunch of stuff on the Web.

One more hint:  your client may need someone who is able to summarize.

---Michael B.

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[xpyttl]

I do kind of see a disconnect reviewing your resume.

You have product/process architecture experience.  This immediately says to 
anyone reading, "not a programmer".  The company that is going to hire a 
process architect is going to be a large one.  For that large company, they 
are likely to want more than a lone individual.  Chances are they will want 
a consulting firm that can deliver a variable supply as the needs change. 
Besides that, a lot of larger companies are wrapped up in, or getting 
wrapped up in, Lean and Six Sigma processes. This is especially true if they 
understand the importance of process and might be inclined to hire an 
in-house process architect.  I see that as missing from your experience.

..


"Ed Berard" <ed.berard@gmail.com> wrote in message 
news:d91db3d5-4a34-4ec7-bda1-a6ecb770b0f0@s37g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> Howdy Folks,
>
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
>
>   * product architecture
>
>   * product line architectures
>
>   * process architectures.
>
> I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> think that this has much to do with my problem.
>
> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:
>
>   http://www.toa.com
>
> Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks.
>
>        -- Ed 

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Ed Berard]

Hi xpyttl:

On Feb 1, 11:08 am, "xpyttl" <xpyttl_NOS...@earthling.net> wrote:
> I do kind of see a disconnect reviewing your resume.
>
> You have product/process architecture experience.  This immediately says to
> anyone reading, "not a programmer".

I assume that you equate "programmer" with "coder."

> The company that is going to hire a process architect is going to be a large one.

I have worked as a software architecht with companies with as few as 6
software
people, and as large as 2,500 software people

> For that large company, they  are likely to want more than a lone individual.

Large companies are likely to have groups of people working on various
aspects
of software architecture, software process architecture, and software
product
line architecture. There is, as you might expect, a good deal of cross-
group
activities among the architecture groups involving, e.g. standardies,
software
quality assurance, software reusability, various forms of governance,
testing,
and configuration management.

> Chances are they will want a consulting firm that can deliver a variable
> supply as the needs change.

I have a fair amount of experience in this arena. A common scenario
requires that a lone (or small number of) consultant works with the
company hashing out many of the architectural issues. The large
company,
with "preliminary sketches" in hand, and with the assistance of the
consultant(s), hires, trains, and integrates the in-house architects.

Depending on the needs and desires of the large company, they may hire
their own architects, ask the consulting (external) architect to
furnish
architects on an as needed basis, or a combination of these
approaches.

Warning: There are many pseudo-architects out there, e.g.:

   * Far too many people thing that "architecture:" is just another
name
      for "design." For that matter, I have encoountered some people
      who think that anyone who has anything to do with the creation
      or enhancement of software is an "architect"

   * "Product line" is another frequently-corrupted term. For example,
     people sometimes take it to mean "a collection of any software
     products we sell, regardless of how unrelated the products might
     be to each other

   * The words "architect" and "architecture" are very-frequently mis-
applied.
      Watch out, for example, for people with job titles such as
"solution architect."

> Besides that, a lot of larger companies are wrapped up in, or getting
> wrapped up in, Lean and Six Sigma processes.

Lean and Six Sigma are seldom found in the same place, in the places
I visit. Depending on the flavor of "Lean" you may be using,
many of the concepts behind "architecture" and "Six Sigma" are viewed
as "unnecessary overhead."

> This is especially true if they understand the importance of process and
> might be inclined to hire an in-house process architect.

This is a frequent outcome in my universe. You might say that my job
is
done when my clients can do what I was doiing for them.

I have no desire to make my clients unnecessarily dependent upon me.

> I see that as missing from your experience.

             -- Ed

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Phlip]

Ed Berard wrote:

> I assume that you equate "programmer" with "coder."

Maybe you can't get a gig because the industry is moving away from the 
"architect who never writes code" myth.

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Martin Vuille]

Ed Berard <ed.berard@gmail.com> wrote in
news:c705ae6d-76c5-47c1-bdf7-1676bb5abb5c@q39g2000hsf.googlegrou
ps.com: 

> Lean and Six Sigma are seldom found in the same place, in the
> places I visit. Depending on the flavor of "Lean" you may be
> using, many of the concepts behind "architecture" and "Six
> Sigma" are viewed as "unnecessary overhead."

What do you make of "Lean Six Sigma" then?

Seems to be all the rage in some organizations.

MV

-- 
I do not want replies; please follow-up to the group.

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[kevin cline]

On Jan 30, 3:21 pm, Ed Berard <ed.berard@gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy Folks,
>
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."

What sort of assignments are you trying to get?  "Overqualified" is a
euphemism for "You have a lengthy and impressive resume, but I don't
see anything to indicate that you would be of any value to my
business."

I read your resume, and I did not get a favorable impression.

First, referring to yourself in the third person gave me the
impression that you are rather pompous and self-impressed.  Listing
your MENSA membership reinforces that impression.  MENSA-level
intelligence is almost a given in this industry, and many people of
high intelligence believe MENSA to be an organization of the socially
inept.  In general, unless you hold a high office, listing social
activities on a resume is a mistake.

The second problem is that I have no idea what you can do, or want to
do.  You seem to have spent a lot of time on the periphery of software
projects, writing documentation and giving training, but little time
actually writing software.  It all gives the impression of someone
with great ambition but little talent.

Finally, I looked at the "What is the WBM?" web page, and I still
haven't got a clue what it is.  Is it a web server, like Apache?  Is
it a web development framework, like RAILS?  And if it is either of
those things, why would anyone pay money for it?  Why did you write it
in the first place?  And why on earth did you write "The sheer expanse
of the Web Business Manager is impressive to most people?"  The people
I know are impressed by clear, concise writing, both in prose and in
code.  Sheer expanse is quite expensive, and best avoided.

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[apm35]

On 30 Jan, 21:21, Ed Berard <ed.ber...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy Folks,
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:
>    http://www.toa.com
> Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.

I have just started to have a look. If I had rcvd this CV for a IT
position I was advertising I would reject your CV simply because it is
too long. No CV should be more than 4 pages and in general I would
advise 3 or less. For someone with alot of experience I think it is
better to get it down to 1 page if you can.

Here are some other points:

Using the third person is a bit unusual these days and hence a bit
distracting.

No career objective or summary - IMHO this should be at the top of
page 1.

You need to pick an emphasis for the kind of job you want. Your CV
seems to me to emphasis training and documentation. This does not help
when applying for an architect position despite the architectural
experience you mention. CVs are not read, they are skimmed, and
impressions are what count.

It's good to see someone who has published so much but I do not expect
to see a comprehensive list of publications on a CV when the list is
so large. I think its better to point people to a web site that has
the links and mention that some of the articles are published by the
IEEE.

The examples of experience section goes from the oldest to the most
recent. Employers except this to be the other way round. They are most
interested in what you have just done.

Detailed paragraphs on the ancient machines used in the 70's just
wastes space.

I wouldn't mention that you belong to MENSA. I have heard all sorts of
weird stories about MENSA members. I'm sure that you're not a weird
member but a prospective employer might think differently.

> Thanks.
>
>         -- Ed

Regards,

Andrew Marlow

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[Phlip]

apm35 wrote:

> I have just started to have a look. If I had rcvd this CV for a IT
> position I was advertising I would reject your CV simply because it is
> too long. No CV should be more than 4 pages and in general I would
> advise 3 or less. For someone with alot of experience I think it is
> better to get it down to 1 page if you can.

A candidate must survive two phases - the initial resume triage, and the 
subsequent review and interview process. Hence, after one graduates from 
the 1 page resume, one should send out one-pagers edited to fit the 
opening's requirements, and should provide the real, long resume during 
any subsequent communication.

> No career objective or summary - IMHO this should be at the top of page
> 1.

That's for the short version.

-- 
  Phlip

Re: Am I "Overqualified"?

[strazzerj]

On Jan 30, 4:21 pm, Ed Berard <ed.ber...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Howdy Folks,
>
> It seems that lately, I have been turned down for an increasing number
> of assignments, because I am "overqualified."
>
> I have been doing a good deal of "architecture tasks," as in:
>
>    * product architecture
>
>    * product line architectures
>
>    * process architectures.
>
> I do tend towards the more formal "C&C" viewpoints. However, I don't
> think that this has much to do with my problem.
>
> If you want, you can chck my resume at the bottom of our home
> page:
>
>    http://www.toa.com
>
> Any constructive feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks.
>
>         -- Ed

What kind of assignments are you seeking?

For these assignments, are you indeed overqualified?  (iew, what are
the posted job  requirements?)