* GNAT version for Ada training? @ 2011-01-29 13:20 Marco 2011-01-29 14:25 ` Jeffrey Creem 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Marco @ 2011-01-29 13:20 UTC (permalink / raw) We are going to create an Ada training class for "experienced" (loosely) programmers. We need a free native compiler that works currently on XP and maybe Vista currently but will work on Windows 7 (64 bit) in the near term. GPL license is just fine. I really don't want a cygwin based solution if possible because that is a somewhat cumbersome arrangement for Windows. A native MinGW compiler would be fine or maybe something from AdaCore. We only need Ada95 since the "graduates" will be working on enhancements, upgrades and fixes to existing code bases. Command-line interface is fine because we have GUI editors such as Slickedit available. Please include URLs if possible with your recommendations. Non GNAT solutions are ok also but vendors please don't expect any additional sales. It is an opportunity for these young developers to learn a good language. thanks Marco ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: GNAT version for Ada training? 2011-01-29 13:20 GNAT version for Ada training? Marco @ 2011-01-29 14:25 ` Jeffrey Creem 2011-01-30 13:12 ` John McCormick 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Jeffrey Creem @ 2011-01-29 14:25 UTC (permalink / raw) On 1/29/2011 8:20 AM, Marco wrote: > We are going to create an Ada training class for "experienced" (loosely) programmers. We need a free native compiler that works currently on XP and maybe Vista currently but will work on Windows 7 (64 bit) in the near term. GPL license is just fine. I really don't want a cygwin based solution if possible because that is a somewhat cumbersome arrangement for Windows. A native MinGW compiler would be fine or maybe something from AdaCore. We only need Ada95 since the "graduates" will be working on enhancements, upgrades and fixes to existing code bases. Command-line interface is fine because we have GUI editors such as Slickedit available. > > Please include URLs if possible with your recommendations. > Non GNAT solutions are ok also but vendors please don't expect any additional sales. > > It is an opportunity for these young developers to learn a good language. > > thanks > Marco Seems like GNAT GPL edition is what you want. http://libre.adacore.com/libre/ Certainly can pair with slickedit if you'd like but GPS (which is also available there) is sort of hard to beat (though I must admit it still feels a little off under Windows as compared to Linux/Solaris). ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: GNAT version for Ada training? 2011-01-29 14:25 ` Jeffrey Creem @ 2011-01-30 13:12 ` John McCormick 2011-02-06 20:21 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: John McCormick @ 2011-01-30 13:12 UTC (permalink / raw) On Jan 29, 8:25 am, Jeffrey Creem <j...@thecreems.com> wrote: > > Seems like GNAT GPL edition is what you want. > > http://libre.adacore.com/libre/ > > Certainly can pair with slickedit if you'd like but GPS (which is > also available there) is sort of hard to beat (though I must admit > it still feels a little off under Windows as compared to Linux/Solaris). AdaGIDE by Martin Carlisle at the US Air Force Academy is a nice simple IDE for GNAT that we use in our freshman level classes. The AdaGIDE home page is at http://adagide.martincarlisle.com/ John ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: GNAT version for Ada training? 2011-01-30 13:12 ` John McCormick @ 2011-02-06 20:21 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) 2011-02-07 22:28 ` Randy Brukardt 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) @ 2011-02-06 20:21 UTC (permalink / raw) Le Sun, 30 Jan 2011 14:12:11 +0100, John McCormick <mccormick@cs.uni.edu> a écrit: >> Certainly can pair with slickedit if you'd like but GPS (which is >> also available there) is sort of hard to beat (though I must admit >> it still feels a little off under Windows as compared to Linux/Solaris). > > AdaGIDE by Martin Carlisle at the US Air Force Academy is a nice > simple IDE for GNAT that we use in our freshman level classes. The > AdaGIDE home page is at http://adagide.martincarlisle.com/ Wanted to ask a question here: why do installation of AdaGIDE in Windows, requires administrative rights ? I've tried to install it from a user account (for multiple reasons, I self restrict the use of the administrative account), and was so much surprise this kind of application requires an administrative account to be installed, that I thrown it to the trash-bin right after I get this message. -- Si les chats miaulent et font autant de vocalises bizarres, c’est pas pour les chiens. “I am fluent in ASCII” [Warren 2010] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: GNAT version for Ada training? 2011-02-06 20:21 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) @ 2011-02-07 22:28 ` Randy Brukardt 2011-02-08 5:29 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Randy Brukardt @ 2011-02-07 22:28 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1948 bytes --] "Yannick Duch�ne (Hibou57)" <yannick_duchene@yahoo.fr> wrote in message news:op.vqhz552bule2fv@garhos... >> AdaGIDE by Martin Carlisle at the US Air Force Academy is a nice >> simple IDE for GNAT that we use in our freshman level classes. The >> AdaGIDE home page is at http://adagide.martincarlisle.com/ >Wanted to ask a question here: why do installation of AdaGIDE in Windows, >requires administrative rights ? I've tried to install it from a user >account (for multiple reasons, I self restrict the use of the >administrative account), and was so much surprise this kind of application >requires an administrative account to be installed, that I thrown it to >the trash-bin right after I get this message. Windows tries hard to discourage installation of any program without administrator permissions, especially on Windows XP and more recent. Any program that needs to modify the registry is going to have problems - and "good" Windows programs will write various things into the registry. I've tried to make this for for Janus/Ada, and it works OK Windows XP if you chose restrictive settings (install for current user only, don't install Claw). But I cannot make the installer work on Windows 7 that way, and it isn't worth the fight. So the next version of the installer is going to be administrator only (presuming I can figure out how to get the manifest set properly). Note that all Windows installers ought to register an uninstaller with Windows (requiring registry writes). And a program like AdaGIDE probably will want to register extensions like .Ada as well -- that definitely requires registry writing only in administrator mode. (This is the same reason that you can't install Claw from a non-administrator account: the builder registers its extensions and that doesn't work.) So I don't find that unusual; I'd pretty much expect it to be the case. Randy. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: GNAT version for Ada training? 2011-02-07 22:28 ` Randy Brukardt @ 2011-02-08 5:29 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) 2011-02-09 0:21 ` Randy Brukardt 0 siblings, 1 reply; 7+ messages in thread From: Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) @ 2011-02-08 5:29 UTC (permalink / raw) Le Mon, 07 Feb 2011 23:28:17 +0100, Randy Brukardt <randy@rrsoftware.com> a écrit: > Windows tries hard to discourage installation of any program without > administrator permissions, especially on Windows XP and more recent. Any > program that needs to modify the registry is going to have problems - There are plenty of useful things which can already be done with HKEY_CURRENT_USER. Writing to this one, does not requires administrative rights. > and > "good" Windows programs will write various things into the registry. The quotes was welcome, as as-the time goes, more people enjoy configuration in files instead of the registry: drop-and-run, the same it is possible with MacOS. The application reside in its own directory, and mostly write only there, optionally in Application Data, except the documents it generates. If better OS integration is needed, a *.reg file to be merged in the registry may be provided as an option. Some provide two options: download classic installer or download zip archive and perform optional integration from withing the application (some provide a dialog to add file association or misc handlers) or manually and optionally. > I've tried to make this for for Janus/Ada, and it works OK Windows XP if > you > chose restrictive settings (install for current user only, don't install > Claw). That's legitimate there. If one want to install for all user, not surprising administrative account will be required. For single user installation, this should not. > But I cannot make the installer work on Windows 7 that way, and it > isn't worth the fight. So the next version of the installer is going to > be > administrator only (presuming I can figure out how to get the manifest > set > properly). Do not have access to a Windows 7, so I don't know. > Note that all Windows installers ought to register an uninstaller with > Windows (requiring registry writes). And a program like AdaGIDE probably > will want to register extensions like .Ada as well -- that definitely > requires registry writing only in administrator mode. No, really (unless I missed something), you can register an uninstaller and file extensions, from a user account. MinGW do that for its uninstaller. I may need to say if I avoid using the admin account, this is to disable applications to do dangerous things (I believe I am not the only one). And when something wants to do administrative things while its purpose does not seems to requires so much high level privileged, I feel alarmed (why would someone need a knife to go to pick its children at school, looks suspect). May be this would be better to at least display a message to tell the user why this need admin account when there is really no other way. -- Si les chats miaulent et font autant de vocalises bizarres, c’est pas pour les chiens. “I am fluent in ASCII” [Warren 2010] ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
* Re: GNAT version for Ada training? 2011-02-08 5:29 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) @ 2011-02-09 0:21 ` Randy Brukardt 0 siblings, 0 replies; 7+ messages in thread From: Randy Brukardt @ 2011-02-09 0:21 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1686 bytes --] "Yannick Duch�ne (Hibou57)" <yannick_duchene@yahoo.fr> wrote in message news:op.vqkj61qcule2fv@garhos... Le Mon, 07 Feb 2011 23:28:17 +0100, Randy Brukardt <randy@rrsoftware.com> a �crit: >> Windows tries hard to discourage installation of any program without >> administrator permissions, especially on Windows XP and more recent. Any >> program that needs to modify the registry is going to have problems - >There are plenty of useful things which can already be done with >HKEY_CURRENT_USER. Writing to this one, does not requires administrative >rights. Right, but that doesn't include registering programs, help files, and extensions. It's pretty hard to write a good Windows program without doing those things. >> and >> "good" Windows programs will write various things into the registry. >The quotes was welcome, as as-the time goes, more people enjoy >configuration in files instead of the registry: drop-and-run, the same it >is possible with MacOS. The application reside in its own directory, and >mostly write only there, optionally in Application Data, except the >documents it generates. Janus/Ada used to be that way, but people can't figure it out. These days, they expect do-everything installers. I'd surely prefer to spend my time on other things, but you can't claim customers are always wrong and expect to have any customers... >May be this would be better to at least display a message to tell the user >why this need admin account when there is really no other way. This is detailed in the installation documentation. I doubt anyone ever reads that (you could be the first :-), but we still send it... Randy. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 7+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2011-02-09 0:21 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 7+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2011-01-29 13:20 GNAT version for Ada training? Marco 2011-01-29 14:25 ` Jeffrey Creem 2011-01-30 13:12 ` John McCormick 2011-02-06 20:21 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) 2011-02-07 22:28 ` Randy Brukardt 2011-02-08 5:29 ` Yannick Duchêne (Hibou57) 2011-02-09 0:21 ` Randy Brukardt
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