From: "Frank A. Adrian" <frank_adrian@firstdatabank.com>
Subject: Re: Which language pays most -- C++ vs. Java?
Date: 1998/02/12
Date: 1998-02-12T00:00:00+00:00 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <6bvea6$k8a$1@client2.news.psi.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 6bv816$iq6@clarknet.clark.net
docdwarf@clark.net wrote in message <6bv816$iq6@clarknet.clark.net>...
>In article <6bv72g$h7v$1@client2.news.psi.net>,
>Frank A. Adrian <frank_adrian@firstdatabank.com> wrote:
>>docdwarf@clark.net wrote in message <6bv3no$b62@clarknet.clark.net>...
>>>In article <6bti3r$e96$1@client3.news.psi.net>,
>>>Frank A. Adrian <frank_adrian@firstdatabank.com> wrote:
>>>>In short, lighten up, Mr. Language Pedant.
>>>
>>>Mr? Why do you call me 'Mr'? Permit me to offer you a challenge, Mr
>>>Adrian... I say there is a simple, readily accepted substitute for this
>>>instance of antecedant/consequent disagreement. I say, further, that you
>>>can neither generate it yourself nor, after I generate it, give any
>>>passable reason as to *why* this antecedant/consequent disagreement is
>>>superior to the alternative that you are obviously unable to generate.
>>
>>To be honest, I cannot find a solution that sounds superior to my ears
than
>>the use of the plural "they".
>
>Good of you to so publically admit your inability... try this one on your
>ears, then: (pardon my paraphrasing but I cannot remember the original
>line exactly)
>
>'The more a "programmer" knows, the more "well-rounded" this "programmer
>is said to be'
>
>Ever seen such a usage?
Of course, but again, to my ears, it does not sound superior. In fact, the
use of the passive "is said to be" is much less pleasing than the active and
simpler "they are". When you suggested a solution, I assumed you were
referring to an active generic singular pronoun replacement. I take your
use of passive voice to be a cheat.
>> Even though others have proposed
>>alternatives, they have generally been rebuffed by the only court that
holds
>>sway in the linguistic realm, the court of common usage.
>
>The example I just gave is found in this 'court' rather frequently.
Absolutely - as a bad example of passive voice where active voice would
suffice.
>> As I see the
>>current situation being satisfactory, I have no need to lower myself to
the
>>level of your suposed challenge.
>
>Oh my... *you* could not think of a common usage so to respond is to
>'lower yourself'?
No, only that responding to your attempts to turn a simple post into a
linguistic pissing match lowers myself.
>> If you find the situation intolerable, I
>>apologize about and withdraw my objection to your post and will certainly
>>not stand in your way as you make a braying ass of yourself about the
>>matter.
>
>By all means, when I make a braying ass please do mention it... when I
>point out the paucity of intellectual energy amongst readers out there you
>may respond as you already have.
My, my. The attempt to put to an end what is at this point obviously a
linguistically based troll is now a "paucity of intellectual energy". I
deny this as I deny that this thread has any further intellectual value.
>>>Are you up to the challenge, Mr Adrian? Do you say there is *no*
>>>acceptable alternative to the above cited disagreement... or that the
>>>failure to find one is just a matter of laziness?
>>
>>I admit neither.
>
>You admitted earlier that you could not find such a usage... are you
>changing this now?
I admitted I could not at the moment find such a usage. I did not admit
that one did not exist.
>> Perhaps there is an acceptable alternative. Perhaps there
>>is not. The fact that there is no acceptable alternative NOW, I will not
>>ascribe to laziness.
>
>What about the fact that there *is* an acceptable alternative of which you
>were aware and which you neglected? It was there if you looked;
>not-looking is often a sign of laziness, neh?
As I said, I was not aware at the moment. You kindly pointed out a usage
which, due to its poor style had slipped my mind. Your uncharitable
response to my lapse of memory as laziness says more about your character
than mine, I fear.
>> I might ascribe it to inertia or a lack of concern on
>>the part of English speakers, but in any case, I find the status quo with
>>respect to the issue (i.e., overloading use of the plural to also mean the
>>sex-neutral singular case) quite satisfactory. I have no need to search
for
>>this chimerical solution you prattle on about.
>
>So if it is not what you already know then you call it chimerical and the
>brayings og an ass... how lovely.
I refer more to a solution for an active voice general singular pronoun.
And I still believe that such a solution is chimerical (clever of you to try
to change the goal in mid-argument, though).
>> If you have a problem with
>>common usage, please go ahead with your Quixotic quest, friend.
>
>If mediocre is good enough for you then you will always be happy, as
>well... but this is neither here nor there, you have been proven wrong,
>just admit it and go along with your life.
Well, good enough is often good enough. In important things I do strive for
excellence. In pissing contests with trollers, I strive to put an end to
them. In any case the usefulness of this discussion has come to an end -
the points of the combatants are clear: You believe that there is such thing
as canonical "proper English usage" and you believe that sticking to this
usage is worth the use of poor writing style (which you would term "good
writing style"). I believe that there is only "common English usage" and
that in an ernest attempt to convey information in a palatable and engaging
way, this common usage is wholly acceptable, even when it means bending a
few supposed "proper English usages". I believe that linguistic history and
most of these (by now weary) newsgroups' readers are on my side. It is
clear from the insulting nature of your posts that you wish only to engage
me in your attempts to lengthen this rather unartful linguistic troll. I
refuse to be engaged further. We are no longer amused. Go back under your
bridge, Troll...
--
Frank A. Adrian
First DataBank
frank_adrian@firstdatabank.com (W)
franka@europa.com (H)
This message does not necessarily reflect those of my employer,
its parent company, or any of the co-subsidiaries of the parent
company.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~1998-02-12 0:00 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 156+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
1998-01-30 0:00 Which language pays most -- C++ vs. Java? scott
1998-01-30 0:00 ` Charles W. Hall
1998-01-30 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
1998-01-30 0:00 ` Art/Jeannie Daly
1998-01-30 0:00 ` Jahfre
1998-02-02 0:00 ` Ian Chivers
1999-07-29 0:00 ` Edwin Purvee
1999-07-30 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
1999-07-30 0:00 ` Paul Mesken
1998-02-18 0:00 ` Mad Hamish
1998-02-17 0:00 ` Dennis Weldy
1998-02-18 0:00 ` mei
1998-02-18 0:00 ` Charles W. Hall
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Rennie Allen
1998-01-30 0:00 ` James Giles
1998-02-10 0:00 ` Graham Broadbridge
1998-02-10 0:00 ` dogmat
1998-02-11 0:00 ` Richard Kenner
1998-02-11 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-11 0:00 ` Frank A. Adrian
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Peter Hermann
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Frank A. Adrian
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Frank A. Adrian [this message]
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` dogmat
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Ethics Gradient
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Steven B Mohler
1998-02-18 0:00 ` Mad Hamish
1998-02-14 0:00 ` Richard Kenner
1998-02-14 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Ethics Gradient
1998-02-15 0:00 ` Flaagg
1998-02-16 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-16 0:00 ` Flaagg
1998-02-16 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-17 0:00 ` Flaagg
1998-02-17 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-17 0:00 ` Anthony Jenkins
1998-02-18 0:00 ` Sakurambo
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Vinay Mutha
1998-02-20 0:00 ` WeeSaul
1998-02-21 0:00 ` Sakurambo
1998-02-21 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Dave Hillstrom
1998-02-16 0:00 ` WeeSaul
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Steven B Mohler
1998-02-14 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Ethics Gradient
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Paulo Pena
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Dik T. Winter
1998-02-19 0:00 ` D J Mann
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Harold Stevens ** PLEASE SEE SIG **
1998-02-19 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
[not found] ` <6cigl4$m11@news.Hawaii.Edu>
1998-02-20 0:00 ` Paul Stevenson
1998-02-20 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-03-02 0:00 ` Mailuser
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Will Rose
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
[not found] ` <01bd3803$441d4c30$ee6de288@ato-10098>
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Jeff York
1998-02-13 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-13 0:00 ` M.L. Scott
1998-02-13 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-13 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-16 0:00 ` tgg
1998-02-16 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-17 0:00 ` martin dowie
1998-02-16 0:00 ` tgg
1998-02-16 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Eric Clayberg
1998-02-11 0:00 ` Dietmar Stumpe
1998-02-11 0:00 ` Patricia Shanahan
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Chris Gray
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Michael Entwistle
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Stephen Taylor
1998-02-12 0:00 ` John W. Lewellen
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Michael Rubenstein
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Michael Rubenstein
1998-02-12 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-12 0:00 ` James Giles
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Michael Rubenstein
1998-02-12 0:00 ` James Giles
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Michael Rubenstein
1998-02-13 0:00 ` James Giles
1998-02-17 0:00 ` K. C. Putnam
1998-02-17 0:00 ` gypsy
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Benz
1998-02-13 0:00 ` Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
[not found] ` <01bd37cf$fa30c4e0$56dacdcf@ms112188.mindspring.com>
1998-02-12 0:00 ` docdwarf
1998-02-12 0:00 ` Michael Rot13 Klein
1998-02-12 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-14 0:00 ` cyanide
1998-02-17 0:00 ` Joseph T. Adams
1998-02-17 0:00 ` Richard Kenner
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
1997-12-19 0:00 Which language pays most 17457 " James Giles
1997-12-22 0:00 ` Lawrence Kirby
1997-12-21 0:00 ` James Giles
1997-12-28 0:00 ` Lawrence Kirby
1997-12-30 0:00 ` paulr
1997-12-31 0:00 ` Which language pays most " arnie sherman
1997-12-30 0:00 ` Dann Corbit
1997-12-31 0:00 ` John Slaman
[not found] ` <01bd198f$4050d960$68c8b5cc@dhite.unicomp.net>
1998-01-06 0:00 ` Jedi
1998-01-10 0:00 ` Highlander Consulting
1998-01-11 0:00 ` Patricia Shanahan
1998-01-11 0:00 ` Barrabazz
1998-01-11 0:00 ` Patricia Shanahan
1998-01-12 0:00 ` Ron Peterson
1998-01-14 0:00 ` anonymous
1998-01-19 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
[not found] ` <01bd2526$66b70fa0$d6d945cf@juddesk>
1998-01-23 0:00 ` dnns
1998-01-27 0:00 ` Robert Garskof
1998-01-28 0:00 ` Steve Dekorte
1998-01-28 0:00 ` Barrabazz
1998-01-28 0:00 ` dogmat
1998-01-29 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1998-01-29 0:00 ` coryb
1998-01-29 0:00 ` Wayne L. Beavers
1998-01-29 0:00 ` Frank A. Adrian
1998-02-03 0:00 ` GLE
1998-02-03 0:00 ` The Goobers
1998-02-03 0:00 ` Harold Stevens ** PLEASE SEE SIG **
1998-01-30 0:00 ` Robert S. White
1998-01-30 0:00 ` Patricia Shanahan
1998-01-31 0:00 ` Paul Van Bellinghen
1998-02-01 0:00 ` Nick Roberts
1998-02-09 0:00 ` cyanide
1998-02-10 0:00 ` Bill Lynch
1998-02-10 0:00 ` Jeff Knaggs
1998-02-10 0:00 ` Michael Rot13 Klein
1998-02-10 0:00 ` dogmat
1998-01-29 0:00 ` Tim Oxler
1998-01-29 0:00 ` Tim Oxler
1998-02-09 0:00 ` cyanide
1998-02-10 0:00 ` dogmat
1999-07-29 0:00 ` Edwin Purvee
[not found] ` <01bd2c3c$6726d520$8101b8c7@MIS-RKW95.spartan.com>
1998-02-10 0:00 ` Steve Dekorte
1998-02-10 0:00 ` Bill Lynch
1998-02-11 0:00 ` dogmat
1998-01-29 0:00 ` Joe Gwinn
1998-01-31 0:00 ` Larry Wiggins
1999-07-29 0:00 ` Ben Pfaff
1999-07-29 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
[not found] ` <6alu5l$onm$1@owl.slip <01bd2c3c$6726d520$8101b8c7@MIS-RKW95.spartan.com>
1998-02-02 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
1998-02-02 0:00 ` Michael C. Kasten
[not found] ` <6alu5l$onm$1@owl.slip <34E0D798.E29D6CA0@cableol.co.uk>
1998-02-11 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
[not found] ` <gwinn-1901981219520001@dh5055142. <34CE059C.634DE881@snet.com>
1998-01-27 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
1998-01-28 0:00 ` Robert Garskof
1998-02-09 0:00 ` cyanide
1998-01-11 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
1998-01-11 0:00 ` Carsten Arnholm
1998-01-15 0:00 ` Highlander Consulting
1998-01-16 0:00 ` Charles F Hankel
1999-08-09 0:00 ` Paul Groves
1999-08-09 0:00 ` Kaz Kylheku
1998-01-02 0:00 ` Philip Hunt
replies disabled
This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox