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From: cwr@cts.com (Will Rose)
Subject: Re: Hungarian notation
Date: 1996/05/31
Date: 1996-05-31T00:00:00+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4om4km$est@news3.cts.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 4oehnp$onn@goanna.cs.rmit.EDU.AU


Richard A. O'Keefe (ok@goanna.cs.rmit.EDU.AU) wrote:
: bobduff@world.std.com (Robert A Duff) writes:

: >P.P.S. My take on comments is: Comment (only) where necessary.  Whenever
: >you can express some fact in the programming language, it's better to do
: >that than to write a comment.

: I like reducing things to slogans.
: I haven't been able to come up with a good one for this.
: What I say is
: 	"Your comments should tell a human reader precisely the
: 	 things s/he needs to understand the purpose and operation
: 	 of the module but are not obvious from the code."
: This is the right stuff, but it needs to be said better.
: Can anyone come up with a really memorable way of expressing this?

"Comment at one level above the code" - trouble is, this is a bit
cryptic and needs a comment to explain it...

: >Any time you feel the need to write a
: >comment, that's a failure of the programming language -- it can't
: >express what you need to say.

: I don't know that I agree with this.  How can the code make it clear
: why you chose *not* to do something?  How does the code describe
: the space of possible tradeoffs from which you selected this particular
: point and why?

I strongly disagree with the 'failure of the language' argument; I tend
to write comments at an intermediate level between the code and the
reader.  Obviously the code is written as clearly as possible, since
I have to debug it, but above that level it's handy to have reminders
of just what in the world is going on in a broader sense, and why.

The next level above comments is probably the manual, but that seldom
gets written.

Will
cwr@crash.cts.com





  parent reply	other threads:[~1996-05-31  0:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 227+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <4adem2$b5s@mercury.IntNet.net>
     [not found] ` <4ahka7$o9m@inrou.erno.de>
1996-05-13  0:00   ` Hungarian notation Roger Merritt
1996-05-14  0:00     ` Keith Whittingham
1996-05-14  0:00       ` Dr S.J. Harris
1996-05-15  0:00         ` Gerolf Wendland
1996-05-16  0:00           ` mAg
1996-05-17  0:00             ` Arne W Flones
1996-05-21  0:00               ` Norman L. Reitzel   
1996-05-21  0:00                 ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-22  0:00                   ` Peter Moylan
1996-05-23  0:00                     ` Andy Ho-Fan Chan
1996-05-23  0:00                       ` Robert Dewar
1996-05-24  0:00                         ` Bob Rodgers
1996-05-24  0:00                         ` Robert A Duff
1996-05-28  0:00                           ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-28  0:00                             ` Jeff Dege
1996-05-28  0:00                             ` Janus
1996-05-29  0:00                             ` Michael Furman
1996-05-31  0:00                               ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-31  0:00                                 ` Commenting (was Re: Hungarian notation) Alan Bowler
1996-05-31  0:00                                   ` Robert Dewar
1996-06-03  0:00                                     ` Ken Garlington
1996-06-01  0:00                                 ` Hungarian notation Warren Young
1996-06-01  0:00                                 ` Steve Willer
1996-06-03  0:00                                   ` Warren Young
1996-05-29  0:00                             ` Chris Kuan
1996-05-29  0:00                               ` Bob Rodgers
1996-05-30  0:00                                 ` Chris Kuan
1996-05-31  0:00                             ` Will Rose [this message]
1996-06-05  0:00                               ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-07  0:00                                 ` Michael Furman
1996-06-01  0:00                             ` Heinz Hemken
1996-06-02  0:00                               ` Matt Kennel
1996-06-02  0:00                               ` Jeff Dege
1996-06-05  0:00                               ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-06  0:00                                 ` Jeff Dege
1996-05-27  0:00                       ` Peter Moylan
1996-05-27  0:00                         ` Jeff Dege
1996-05-27  0:00                           ` The Amorphous Mass
1996-05-28  0:00                             ` Jeff Dege
1996-05-28  0:00                               ` The Amorphous Mass
1996-05-29  0:00                               ` Comments was: " Bob Lang 3P21 x3172
1996-05-30  0:00                                 ` Kevin Cline
     [not found]                           ` <4odgjh$6o@carrera.intergate.bc.ca>
1996-05-28  0:00                             ` try to run this! - try_me.exe [3/4] Otmar Conradus
1996-05-28  0:00                       ` Hungarian notation Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-31  0:00                         ` The Last Word on Comments (was Re: Hungarian notation) Clark L. Coleman
1996-06-03  0:00                           ` Robert A Duff
1996-06-13  0:00                             ` Kevin D. Quitt
1996-06-13  0:00                               ` Richard Riehle
1996-06-15  0:00                                 ` Train
1996-06-18  0:00                                 ` Sandy McPherson
1996-06-18  0:00                                   ` David Zink
1996-06-19  0:00                                     ` Michael Furman
1996-06-20  0:00                                       ` Robert Dewar
1996-06-23  0:00                                         ` David Zink
1996-06-23  0:00                                           ` Robert Dewar
1996-06-28  0:00                                         ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-28  0:00                                           ` Robert Dewar
1996-07-11  0:00                                             ` Ralph Silverman
1996-07-11  0:00                                               ` Robert Dewar
1996-07-12  0:00                                               ` steidl
1996-07-12  0:00                                                 ` Robert Dewar
1996-07-12  0:00                                                 ` Peter Seebach
1996-06-29  0:00                                           ` Lawrence Kirby
1996-06-29  0:00                                           ` steidl
1996-06-20  0:00                                   ` The Last Word on Comments (was Re: Hun Ian Ward
1996-06-05  0:00                           ` The Last Word on Comments (was Re: Hungarian notation) Peter Moylan
1996-06-05  0:00                             ` Mike Fulton
1996-06-05  0:00                               ` Steve Howard
1996-06-06  0:00                                 ` Jeff Dege
1996-06-05  0:00                               ` Shane Badham
1996-06-13  0:00                                 ` Steve Sobol
1996-06-14  0:00                                   ` Re-designing CS (long) (Was: Re: The Last Word on Comments) Warren Young
1996-06-21  0:00                                   ` Re-designing CS (long) Warren Young
1996-06-24  0:00                                     ` Brian J. Quandt
1996-06-06  0:00                               ` The Last Word on Comments (was Re: Hungarian notation) Bob Lang 3P21 x3172
1996-06-08  0:00                             ` Bill Hay
1996-06-11  0:00                               ` Derek Lee Beatty
1996-06-11  0:00                           ` Darius Blasbans
1996-06-11  0:00                             ` Kevin J. Weise
1996-06-13  0:00                               ` Kevin D. Quitt
1996-06-13  0:00                               ` Kevin Cline
1996-06-12  0:00                             ` Robert Dewar
1996-06-17  0:00                               ` James McKim
1996-06-18  0:00                                 ` Robert Dewar
1996-06-11  0:00                           ` Darius Blasbans
1996-06-11  0:00                           ` Darius Blasbans
1996-06-11  0:00                           ` Darius Blasbans
1996-06-11  0:00                           ` Darius Blasbans
1996-06-06  0:00                       ` Hungarian notation Sam Hunting
1996-06-06  0:00                       ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-06  0:00                         ` David Hopkins
1996-06-07  0:00                         ` Hungarian notation (an aside) Bob Lang 3P21 x3172
1996-06-07  0:00                         ` Hungarian notation Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-06-07  0:00                           ` Steve Willer
1996-06-10  0:00                             ` Michael Furman
1996-06-12  0:00                               ` Warren Young
1996-06-11  0:00                       ` I wish it was "The Last Word on Comments (was Re: Hungarian notation)" Blair MacIntyre
1996-05-23  0:00                     ` Hungarian notation Robert Dewar
1996-05-23  0:00                       ` Steve Willer
1996-05-28  0:00                         ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-29  0:00                           ` Kevin Cline
1996-05-24  0:00                       ` Jeff Dege
1996-05-24  0:00                       ` Kevin Cline
1996-05-25  0:00                         ` Steve Willer
1996-05-25  0:00                           ` Hungarian notation: the thread of choice for consummate boors The Right Reverend Colin James III
1996-05-27  0:00                             ` Ken Nicolson
     [not found]                             ` <HFsHoD96w165w@bwalk.dm.com>
1996-05-28  0:00                               ` Jon Hornstein
1996-06-05  0:00                         ` Hungarian notation Ralph Silverman
1996-06-06  0:00                           ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-06-06  0:00                           ` James McKim
1996-06-07  0:00                             ` Ralph Silverman
1996-05-26  0:00                       ` Warren Young
1996-06-03  0:00                     ` Norman H. Cohen
1996-05-21  0:00                 ` Bob Rodgers
1996-05-22  0:00                   ` Michael Furman
1996-05-22  0:00                   ` Slander (was: Hungarian notation) Graham Perkins
1996-05-23  0:00                     ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-24  0:00                       ` Tucker Taft
1996-05-22  0:00                   ` Hungarian notation Matt Kennel
1996-05-23  0:00                     ` Bob Rodgers
1996-05-23  0:00                       ` Peter Seebach
1996-05-23  0:00                     ` Steve Willer
1996-05-23  0:00                       ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-23  0:00                         ` Steve Willer
1996-05-23  0:00                   ` Peter Moylan
1996-06-10  0:00                 ` Ralph Silverman
1996-05-18  0:00             ` Richard Riehle
1996-05-23  0:00             ` James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763
1996-05-23  0:00               ` Paul J. Kossick
1996-05-25  0:00                 ` Raoul De Kezel
1996-05-23  0:00             ` Robert I. Eachus
1996-05-23  0:00             ` Laurent Guerby
1996-05-23  0:00               ` Please keep Hungarian notation thread OUT of comp.lang.modula3 Tim Mann
1996-06-05  0:00             ` Hungarian notation Ralph Silverman
1996-06-05  0:00               ` jthorpe
1996-06-06  0:00               ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-06-07  0:00                 ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-07  0:00                   ` The Amorphous Mass
1996-06-10  0:00                   ` Michael Furman
1996-06-11  0:00                   ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-06-11  0:00                     ` Kevin Cline
1996-06-11  0:00                       ` Chris Engebretson
1996-06-11  0:00                       ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-12  0:00                       ` Bob Rodgers
1996-06-12  0:00                         ` Matt Kennel
1996-06-13  0:00                           ` Jeff Dege
1996-06-13  0:00                           ` Giuliano Carlini
1996-06-22  0:00                       ` Richard Green
1996-06-11  0:00                     ` Will Rose
1996-06-07  0:00                 ` Chris Kuan
1996-06-05  0:00           ` Ralph Silverman
1996-05-14  0:00       ` Dave Mikesell
1996-05-14  0:00       ` Peter Seebach
1996-05-14  0:00         ` Pete Becker
     [not found]           ` <4ndb2j$1p0q@uni.library.ucla.edu>
1996-05-16  0:00             ` Mark Chu-Carroll
1996-05-16  0:00               ` Jay Martin
1996-05-17  0:00                 ` Scott
1996-05-23  0:00                 ` G.O.Visser
1996-05-16  0:00             ` Scott
1996-05-16  0:00               ` Giuliano Carlini
1996-05-18  0:00                 ` Warren Young
1996-05-16  0:00             ` Steve Branam
1996-05-16  0:00         ` Matt Kennel
1996-05-16  0:00       ` Dave Toland
1996-05-21  0:00       ` mAg
1996-05-21  0:00         ` Mark A Biggar
1996-05-21  0:00           ` slary61
1996-05-21  0:00         ` Peter Seebach
1996-05-23  0:00           ` Steve Willer
1996-05-23  0:00             ` Peter Seebach
1996-05-23  0:00             ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-23  0:00               ` Robert Dewar
1996-05-28  0:00                 ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-23  0:00               ` Bob Rodgers
1996-05-23  0:00                 ` Bob Kitzberger
1996-05-23  0:00               ` Train
1996-05-23  0:00                 ` jeffos2
1996-05-23  0:00             ` Robert Dewar
1996-05-24  0:00               ` slary61
1996-05-24  0:00                 ` Ian Ward
1996-05-24  0:00                 ` Jeff Dege
1996-05-24  0:00                 ` Jerry Kuch
1996-05-24  0:00                 ` Dave Toland
1996-05-24  0:00                 ` Jos A. Horsmeier
1996-05-26  0:00                   ` Richard Riehle
1996-05-27  0:00                     ` Warren Young
1996-06-03  0:00                     ` Eva
1996-05-28  0:00                   ` Paul D. DeRocco
1996-05-27  0:00                 ` Norman L. Reitzel   
1996-05-27  0:00                   ` Matt Kennel
1996-05-28  0:00                 ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-05-28  0:00                   ` Jay Martin
1996-05-29  0:00                     ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1996-06-01  0:00                     ` Michael Feldman
1996-05-29  0:00                 ` AJ Musgrove
1996-06-05  0:00                 ` Ralph Silverman
1996-06-06  0:00                 ` Ralph Silverman
1996-05-24  0:00               ` Steve Willer
1996-05-21  0:00         ` Bob Lang 3P21 x3172
1996-05-24  0:00         ` Oleg Kagan
1996-06-05  0:00           ` Ralph Silverman
1996-05-14  0:00     ` David Priest
1996-05-14  0:00     ` The Right Reverend Colin James III
1996-05-15  0:00       ` Graham Perkins
1996-05-15  0:00         ` Peter Seebach
1996-05-16  0:00           ` Pete Becker
1996-05-23  0:00     ` James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763
1996-05-28  0:00     ` Homonnai Misi
1996-05-28  0:00     ` Brian Rogoff
1996-05-20  0:00   ` James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763
1996-05-20  0:00     ` Tom Wheeley
1996-05-23  0:00     ` Steve Willer
1996-05-22  0:00   ` James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763
1996-05-23  0:00   ` James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763
1996-05-23  0:00     ` Richard Kenner
1996-06-01  0:00   ` Jim Kingdon
1996-06-10  0:00 Bob Crispen
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
1996-05-15  0:00 Bob Crispen
     [not found] <30C40F77.53B5@swsbbs.com>
     [not found] ` <30EF0415.6FE1@tus.ssi1.com>
     [not found]   ` <1996Jan7.045815.8676@ohstpy>
     [not found]     ` <4cpb00$nqk@news.xmission.com>
1996-01-08  0:00       ` Michael Feathers
1996-01-08  0:00         ` vancleef
1996-01-09  0:00         `  Todd Knarr 
1996-01-09  0:00           ` Michael Feathers
     [not found]       ` <hawkfish-0801960904580001@blv-pm3-ip24.halcyon.com>
1996-01-09  0:00         `  Todd Knarr 
     [not found] ` <marnoldDJEvtJ.1Lx@netcom.com>
     [not found]   ` <4aleun$jlk@ns.RezoNet.NET>
     [not found]     ` <marnoldDJMDBG.CFz@netcom.com>
     [not found]       ` <4asnkr$7b0@solutions.solon.com>
     [not found]         ` <4ath75$e7i@barnacle.iol.ie>
     [not found]           ` <4b4kij$svt@news.microsoft.com>
     [not found]             ` <dewar.819489496@schonberg>
     [not found]               ` <4bd <4cne0e$1020@seminole.gate.net>
1996-01-08  0:00                 ` Bob Kitzberger
1996-01-08  0:00                 ` Adam Beneschan
1996-01-08  0:00               ` Michael Feathers
     [not found] ` <4cd8fc$oud@news.manawatu.gen.nz>
1996-01-08  0:00   ` Joachim Durchholz
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