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From: Marin David Condic <nobody@noplace.com>
Subject: Re: Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications?
Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 12:01:02 GMT
Date: 2004-05-13T12:01:02+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <40A36368.7050104@noplace.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: c196a0l94v423586r18kf52ag6uvmfq8kd@4ax.com



Dmitry A. Kazakov wrote:
 >
 > I believe you are wrong here. In the area we are working, each large
 > vendor of an embedded application is surrounded by a swarm of smaller
 >  firms to which it outsource software development and testing. Each
 > satellite firm has the complete development tool chain. These tools
 > are very expensive. It is a very lucrative market. [Some tool chain
 > vendors just take GCC, build loader, add a pair windows and sell that
 >  for many k$.]
 >
It tends to not work that way here. Embedded systems software is seldom
farmed out to subcontractors. I'd agree that there is some market for
compilers here, and it isn't as grim as I characterized it. But
basically you find hyundreds of companies out there selling some little
embedded board or chip set and they have a development kit with a C
compiler & all the goodies sitting right there and they're practically
giving it away in order to sell boards. How is some alternative vendor
going to come in there with an Ada compiler and convince the developer
he needs to use theirs (without all the supporting goodies) and it will 
only cost him $20,000 a year in annual support contracts?

It won't fly unless the compiler is right there with the rest of the
development kit and doesn't cost a fortune to get.



 >
 > No. It would take too long. I am afraid that Ada is missing the
 > embedded programming market which in the foreseeable future will
 > become no less important than the conventional one.
 >
It wouldn't take too long if Ada focused in on a branch of software
systems to which its existing strengths play and whos practitioners are 
not already Ada-haters. The embedded market already hates Ada with the 
white hot intensity of a thousand suns for a variety of historical 
reasons. In language surveys "Ada" ranks behind "Other" in languages 
used to program embedded systems. I'd *love* to see Ada get some nice 
share of the embedded market, but I think it is lost for the time being 
because it is too expensive in which to play and has too much historic 
resistance to overcome.

If Ada went for something related - like communications or math or 
related fields - and tried to target that audience, they might be more 
receptive. That and they don't demand as much support gagetry just in 
order to be a player. So you can get in there easier and start building 
a market and because it might have a connection to the embedded world, 
it lets you gradually start to try to get into that arena.

MDC



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  reply	other threads:[~2004-05-13 12:01 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 119+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-05-10  9:17 Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications? Kai Glaesner
2004-05-10 11:39 ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-10 17:59   ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-05-11 11:38     ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-10 18:28   ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-10 20:10     ` Martin Dowie
2004-05-11  7:37       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-05-11  9:45         ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-11  9:52       ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-11 11:50         ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-12  0:07           ` Richard  Riehle
2004-05-12 12:21             ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-12 15:36             ` Robert C. Leif
2004-05-11 19:34         ` Bernd Trog
2004-05-11 20:46           ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-12 17:09             ` Mike Silva
2004-05-12 18:51               ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-13  5:50                 ` Pascal Obry
2004-05-13  7:21                 ` Vinzent 'Gadget' Hoefler
2004-05-13  8:10                   ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-13  8:57                     ` Vinzent 'Gadget' Hoefler
2004-05-13  9:27                     ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-05-13 11:46                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-13 19:20                       ` Randy Brukardt
2004-05-13 21:00                         ` tmoran
2004-05-13 23:41                         ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-05-14  6:44                         ` Anders Wirzenius
2004-05-14 13:54                           ` Andersen Jacob Sparre
2004-05-17  5:27                             ` Anders Wirzenius
2004-05-17 11:53                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-14 22:31                           ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-05-15  9:05                             ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-05-15 11:46                               ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-05-16 16:48                               ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-05-17  6:35                                 ` Time to market, was: " Anders Wirzenius
2004-05-17 12:17                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-18  1:05                                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-05-18  7:58                                     ` Peter Amey
     [not found]                                     ` <40A9EFFC.7090708@noplace.com>
2004-05-19  0:45                                       ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-05-17 12:04                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-17  6:09                             ` Anders Wirzenius
2004-05-18  4:45                               ` Simon Wright
2004-05-17 11:58                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-17  6:15                           ` Martin Krischik
2004-05-17 11:48                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-13 16:45                     ` Pascal Obry
2004-05-13 17:05                       ` Lutz Donnerhacke
2004-05-13 20:59                         ` Bartłomiej Świercz
2004-05-13 21:06                         ` Pascal Obry
2004-05-14  1:07                           ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-05-13 22:37                         ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-05-14  6:41                         ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-05-13 19:30                     ` Bernd Trog
2004-05-13 16:17                   ` Mike Silva
2004-05-11 20:15         ` Martin Dowie
2004-05-12 12:30           ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-13  7:55             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-05-13 12:01               ` Marin David Condic [this message]
2004-05-13 13:22                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-05-17 12:25                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-17 13:11                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-05-13 19:29                 ` Randy Brukardt
2004-05-14 10:45                   ` Kai Glaesner
2004-05-14 22:35                     ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-05-17 12:26                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-17 19:29                     ` Randy Brukardt
2004-05-18  1:09                       ` Jeffrey Carter
     [not found]                         ` <40A9F260.9080300@noplace.com>
2004-05-19  0:50                           ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-05-19  1:34                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-06-06  9:48                         ` I R T
2004-05-18  4:50                       ` Simon Wright
     [not found]                         ` <40A9F38C.9080003@noplace.com>
2004-05-18 21:05                           ` Simon Wright
2004-06-06  9:51                             ` I R T
2004-05-18 12:05                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-19 17:17                         ` Randy Brukardt
2004-05-19 22:21                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-20 19:10                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-05-21 11:39                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-19 22:42                         ` Jeff C,
2004-05-20 11:36                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-21  1:46                             ` Jeff C,
2004-05-21  5:46                               ` Richard  Riehle
2004-05-21  5:44                             ` Simon Wright
2004-06-06 10:01                               ` I R T
2004-05-12  2:32         ` Steve
2004-05-12 12:34           ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-13  6:21         ` Richard  Riehle
2004-05-13  8:30           ` End of "discussion" (was Re: Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications?) Bernd Specht
2004-05-13 15:14             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-05-13 12:09           ` Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications? Marin David Condic
2004-05-13 14:58           ` Martin Dowie
2004-05-13 20:37             ` Symbian OS (was: Re: Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications?) Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-05-11 11:41     ` Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications? Marin David Condic
2004-05-11 17:28       ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-12 12:42         ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-13  8:00           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-05-12 10:01     ` Peter Amey
2004-05-12 12:50       ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-12 14:45         ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-05-13  7:43         ` Peter Amey
2004-05-13 12:17           ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-12 17:13       ` Mike Silva
2004-05-10 21:31 ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-05-11 11:29   ` Martin Dowie
2004-05-11 20:12     ` Martin Dowie
2004-05-11 14:29   ` Britt Snodgrass
2004-06-06  9:30 ` I R T
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2004-05-12  9:06 Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-05-12 12:52 ` Marin David Condic
2004-05-12 17:58 ` Bernd Specht
2004-05-12 18:13   ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-05-12 18:28     ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-05-13 13:31   ` Mike Silva
2004-05-12 14:25 Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-05-13  7:57 Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-05-13  8:39 Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-05-14 11:44 Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-05-14 18:11 ` Martin Dowie
2004-05-16 18:53   ` Robert I. Eachus
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