Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[paus]

In article <3gbs98$47f@network.ucsd.edu> mbk@inls1.ucsd.edu (Matt Kennel) writes:
> David Weller (dweller@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM) wrote:

> All science (which demands international collaboration),
> and most higher-tech engineering is metric.

That's complete nonsense! As you can see in my signature at the bottom
I am in the aerospace business. In almost all american scientific
publications you will find all sorts of stupid units. Mixtures of
nautical miles, feet, inches ... sometimes to be used in a single
formula.

Sorry but I could not resist because I have to fight with these units
almost every day.

--
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|Dipl.-Ing. Michael Paus   (Member: Team Ada)                          |
|University of Stuttgart, Inst. of Flight Mechanics and Flight Control |
|Forststrasse 86, 70176 Stuttgart, Germany                             |
|Phone: (+49) 711-121-1434  FAX: (+49) 711-634856                      |
|Email: Michael.Paus@ifr.luftfahrt.uni-stuttgart.de (NeXT-Mail welcome)|

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[David Weller]

In article <3gdhj5$1gbk@info4.rus.uni-stuttgart.de>,
 <paus@ifr.luftfahrt.uni-stuttgart.de> wrote:
>In article <3gbs98$47f@network.ucsd.edu> mbk@inls1.ucsd.edu (Matt Kennel) writes:
>> David Weller (dweller@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM) wrote:
>> All science (which demands international collaboration),
>> and most higher-tech engineering is metric.
>
>That's complete nonsense! As you can see in my signature at the bottom
>I am in the aerospace business. In almost all american scientific
>publications you will find all sorts of stupid units. Mixtures of
>nautical miles, feet, inches ... sometimes to be used in a single
>formula.
>
I can certainly second Michael's comments, also being in the
aerospace biz.  In fact, in the NASA community, I'd say we have an
AWFUL mishmash of different units.

Finally, I'd also like to point out that Michaael misattributed the
quoted sentence to me -- I was not responsible for it (especially
considering I hold the near-opposite opinion! :-)


>Sorry but I could not resist because I have to fight with these units
>almost every day.
>
Ditto!


-- 
      Frustrated with C, C++, Pascal, Fortran?  Ada95 _might_ be for you!
	  For all sorts of interesting Ada95 tidbits, run the command:
"finger dweller@starbase.neosoft.com | more" (or e-mail with "finger" as subj.)
	

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Robert Dewar]

Matt, if you find it such a fight to deal with non-metric units, maybe it's
just that they don't teach how in schools in Germany :-)

My favorite units story comes from my uncle who used to work for the
marine warfare department of Plessey's. THey were showing an admiral
around a mockup of a new submarine control center.

There was a large meter, calibrated in knots per hour. The admiral noticed
it, and reacted amused "I am surprised that Plessey's would make a mistake
like that, knots is a unit of speed already"

The answer: "but it's an acceleration meter" :-)

And Mats, if metric units are so wonderful, how come there are still
60 minutes in an hour, even in Germany? I guess it's pretty hard to
really bury those Babalonians!

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Peter Hermann]

paus@ifr.luftfahrt.uni-stuttgart.de wrote:
: nautical miles, feet, inches ... sometimes to be used in a single
: formula.

Serious question: how to convert miles <=> feet <=> inches ?

--
Peter Hermann  Tel:+49-711-685-3611 Fax:3758 ph@csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de
Pfaffenwaldring 27, 70569 Stuttgart Uni Computeranwendungen
Team Ada: "C'mon people let the world begin" (Paul McCartney)

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[celier]

Robert Dewar wrote:
>And Mats, if metric units are so wonderful, how come there are still
>60 minutes in an hour, even in Germany? I guess it's pretty hard to
>really bury those Babalonians!

Actually Robert, the sexagesimal stuff (60 minutes in an hour, 6 x 60
degrees
in one revolution, 60" in one degree) comes from the Sumerians. The
Babylonians inherited it from them, but they invented the digit zero.

The grade (100 grade in one right angle instead of 90 degrees) was an
attempt to be more "decimal" in angles but it failed miserably. It had
the advantage that one centigrade of latitude was exactly oe kilometre
(well, on the average).

Trying to get rid of the values of the degree, the hour or the minute
is as difficult as to get rid of the base 10, which in fact is not a
"rational" base.

The "rational" base should be 11 or 12: 11 if you want to minimize the
divisors of the base, 12 if you want to maximize them. 8 is too small
and 16 is too high. Of course, we will never change the number base 10.

Peter Hermann wrote:
> Serious question: how to convert miles <=> feet <=> inches ?

One inch = 25.4 mm (exactly)
One foot = 0.3048 m = 12 inches (exactly)
One yard = 0.9144 m = 3 feet (exactly)
One mile = 1609.344 m = 1760 yards (exactly)
One Nautical Mile = 1852 m (exactly) = 2025.3718285 yards

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[R_Tim_Coslet]

>And Mats, if metric units are so wonderful, how come there are still
>60 minutes in an hour, even in Germany? I guess it's pretty hard to
>really bury those Babalonians!

Maybe we should be using Kilo-seconds... lets see, 86.4 Ks per day...

Or would milli-days be an easier unit :-)

                                        R. Tim Coslet

Usenet: R_Tim_Coslet@cup.portal.com
        technology, n.  domesticated natural phenomena

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Michel Gauthier]

In article <3gk7tl$d7h@infomatch.com>, celier@infomatch.com (celier) wrote:

> [...]
> 
> The "rational" base should be 11 or 12: 11 if you want to minimize the
> divisors of the base, 12 if you want to maximize them. 8 is too small
> and 16 is too high. Of course, we will never change the number base 10.

So that year 2000 becomes something else that has no mystical contents.
Please broadcast widely this idea. I am fed up with year 2000 and 21st
century.

-- 
Michel Gauthier - Laboratoire d'informatique - 123 avenue Albert Thomas
F-87060 Limoges - fax +33()55457315
----- Are the messages that objects exchange also objects ? -----

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Norman H. Cohen]

In article <3gk7tl$d7h@infomatch.com>, celier@infomatch.com (celier) writes: 

|> The grade (100 grade in one right angle instead of 90 degrees) was an
|> attempt to be more "decimal" in angles but it failed miserably. It had
|> the advantage that one centigrade of latitude was exactly oe kilometre
|> (well, on the average).
|>
|> Trying to get rid of the values of the degree, the hour or the minute
|> is as difficult as to get rid of the base 10, which in fact is not a
|> "rational" base.

Shortly after the French Revolution, France did try to decimalize time: 
20 "decimal hours" in a day (ten a.m. hours and ten p.m. hours, each
equal to 1.2 conventional hours), 100 "decimal minutes" (each equal to
0.72 conventional minutes, or 43.2 seconds) in a decimal hour, 100 parts
(each equal to 0.432 seconds) in a decimal minute.  There were even
clocks built for this system.

|> The "rational" base should be 11 or 12: 11 if you want to minimize the
|> divisors of the base, 12 if you want to maximize them. 8 is too small
|> and 16 is too high. Of course, we will never change the number base 10.

The English system of liquid measures is based on powers of two:  Eight
ounces in a cup, two cups in a pint, two pints in a quart, four quarts in
a gallon.

(I guess this was so that the Brewer Royal could implement conversion
between units as left and right shifts. :-) )

--
Norman H. Cohen    ncohen@watson.ibm.com

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[paus]

In article <3gh4v3$eq2@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM> dweller@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM (David Weller)  
writes:
> 
> Finally, I'd also like to point out that Michaael misattributed the
> quoted sentence to me -- I was not responsible for it (especially
> considering I hold the near-opposite opinion! :-)
> 
Sorry, I beg your pardon. I must have deleted the wrong line in my
news reader.

Michael

Decimal time - a correct proposal (Was Ada Doc .... )

[David Moore]

R_Tim_Coslet@cup.portal.com writes:

>>And Mats, if metric units are so wonderful, how come there are still
>>60 minutes in an hour, even in Germany? I guess it's pretty hard to
>>really bury those Babalonians!

>Maybe we should be using Kilo-seconds... lets see, 86.4 Ks per day...

>Or would milli-days be an easier unit :-)

>                                        R. Tim Coslet

Lets get real here. A rational system of measurement of time would be
planet independent.

1 New Sec = 0.126 old sec (approx)
1 New Day = 1 Megasecond  =  1.46 old days (approx)
1 New Year= 1 Gigasecond. =  4 old years (ie 1461 old days)

Look at the advantages of this new system:

i) No need for time zones. Once the anachronism of relating time to
the position of the sun is eliminated, there is no need for different
times in different places. Modern watches are much better time-keepers
than the solar position in any case, so this relationship is obsolete.

No more missing someone on the East coast because they have left already
or being woken up in the middle of the night because they are at work
and their compiler won't run.

No more jet lag. (although turbines will now need around 48 sec to spool up)

ii) No need for leap years.  

iii) We can all feel a lot younger. 40 will be really really old.
     Drinking, driving and smoking will vanish almost over-(new)-night.

Given the huge number of old programs that cannot handle the century
roll-over, we should start working to get this introduced now - we can
then relax as we will have another 75 or so new years (300 old years)
before we have to fix our software.

Many of the un-enlightened, whose intellect has never been sharpened
by writing software, although they may be able to get sentences to 
agree in number, will undoubtably oppose this fine new initiative,
despite its clearcut advantages over the archaic system currently
in use, so the sooner we start lobbying the better. 

Politicians, I am sure, will immediately grasp the advantages of 
this new system, especially at a time when term limits have become 
so popular.

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Michael Feldman]

In article <3gj91d$10g2@info4.rus.uni-stuttgart.de>,
Peter Hermann <ucaa2385@iris2.csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de> wrote:

>Serious question: how to convert miles <=> feet <=> inches ?

Serious answer: 1 foot = 12 inches. 1 mile = 5280 feet.
(I forget how many feet in a nautical mile.)

Mike Feldman

PS - in undergraduate engineering school, we used to kid around, both
students and professors, by expressing velocities in furlongs/fortnight.

Those are _really_ English units. Robert, do the English ever still
(informally) express their body weight in stones?

Re: Decimal time - a correct proposal (Was Ada Doc .... )

[Peter Hermann]

David Moore (davidm@rational.com) wrote:

: Lets get real here. A rational system of measurement of time would be
: planet independent.

: 1 New Sec = 0.126 old sec (approx)
[snip]
... all numbers be based on the octal system   :-|
--
Peter Hermann  Tel:+49-711-685-3611 Fax:3758 ph@csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de
Pfaffenwaldring 27, 70569 Stuttgart Uni Computeranwendungen
Team Ada: "C'mon people let the world begin" (Paul McCartney)

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Peter Hermann]

Michael Feldman (mfeldman@seas.gwu.edu) wrote:
: Those are _really_ English units. Robert, do the English ever still
: (informally) express their body weight in stones?
               ... and their brain weight in straw   :-)
thank you, too, Mike.

ps.: Nichts fuer ungut!  (<= another indication of the
                             internationality of comp.lang.ada  ;-)

--
Peter Hermann  Tel:+49-711-685-3611 Fax:3758 ph@csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de
Pfaffenwaldring 27, 70569 Stuttgart Uni Computeranwendungen
a proud member of the international
Team Ada: "C'mon people let the world begin" (Paul McCartney)

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Robert Firth]

In article <3gmv5r$mba@felix.seas.gwu.edu> mfeldman@seas.gwu.edu (Michael Feldman) writes:

>Those are _really_ English units. Robert, do the English ever still
>(informally) express their body weight in stones?

Yes, we do - though in my case perhaps with a certain
amount of embarassment that the number is about 2 bigger
than I'd like.

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Matt Kennel]

Norman H. Cohen (ncohen@watson.ibm.com) wrote:

: The English system of liquid measures is based on powers of two:  Eight
: ounces in a cup, two cups in a pint, two pints in a quart, four quarts in
: a gallon.

: (I guess this was so that the Brewer Royal could implement conversion
: between units as left and right shifts. :-) )

Actually this sounds pretty smart.  It means you could measure out an
arbitrary amount of liquid for mixing with a minimum number of full
measuring cups in the same way that a binary search is smart.

: --
: Norman H. Cohen    ncohen@watson.ibm.com

--
-Matt Kennel  		mbk@inls1.ucsd.edu
-Institute for Nonlinear Science, University of California, San Diego
-*** AD: Archive for nonlinear dynamics papers & programs: FTP to
-***     lyapunov.ucsd.edu, username "anonymous".

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[paus]

In article <3gmv5r$mba@felix.seas.gwu.edu> mfeldman@seas.gwu.edu (Michael Feldman)  
writes:
> In article <3gj91d$10g2@info4.rus.uni-stuttgart.de>,
> Peter Hermann <ucaa2385@iris2.csv.ica.uni-stuttgart.de> wrote:
> 
> >Serious question: how to convert miles <=> feet <=> inches ?
> 
> Serious answer: 1 foot = 12 inches. 1 mile = 5280 feet.
> (I forget how many feet in a nautical mile.)

Maybe I can help with this: 1 nm = 6076.1 ft. (Sorry, no more decimal
places available :-)

--
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|Dipl.-Ing. Michael Paus   (Member: Team Ada)                          |
|University of Stuttgart, Inst. of Flight Mechanics and Flight Control |
|Forststrasse 86, 70176 Stuttgart, Germany                             |
|Phone: (+49) 711-121-1434  FAX: (+49) 711-634856                      |
|Email: Michael.Paus@ifr.luftfahrt.uni-stuttgart.de (NeXT-Mail welcome)|

Re: Ada 9X Doc v5.99

[Richard A. O'Keefe]

mfeldman@seas.gwu.edu (Michael Feldman) writes:
>Those are _really_ English units. Robert, do the English ever still
>(informally) express their body weight in stones?

Can't speak for the British, but I was in hospital here in Melbourne last
month and the scales provided for the use of patients were calibrated
both in kilos and in stones.  The stone is actually a very good unit of
measurement for human beings; an adult woman is typically about 10 stone,
so it's easy to comprehend how big a stone is and not too hard to make a
good estimate of a weight to the nearest stone.

-- 
"The complex-type shall be a simple-type."  ISO 10206:1991 (Extended Pascal)
Richard A. O'Keefe; http://www.cs.rmit.edu.au/~ok; RMIT Comp.Sci.