Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

[Gregory Aharonian]

    I recently received the following complaint by a startup Ada vendor who
has been DENIED access to the non-confidential, publicly funded data that
has been collected as part of the Ada Dual Use campaign.  DENIED access. If
this is not corruption plaguing Ada9X, I give up:

    "A survey was done for the Ada Campaign to find out the awareness of
    Ada and "hot" software interests of major commercial software markets,
    data which is invaluable to our marketing campaign.  We were told that
    the survey was finished in June 1994, but to date, the Ada9X Program
    Office and Telos, the support contractor, refuse to release the details
    of the survey, for example the raw data that they collected.  This is
    information paid for by taxpayer money, and shouldn't have any secrecy
    concerns preventing distribution, and yet Chris Anderson and Telos 
    won't release the data.  What gives you think?

    Even worse is that while we could live without that data (though it would
    be nice) what we really want is sales leads, in particular names and
    addresses of people calling the 1-800 number in response to the ads.
    It is easier to sell to someone who has expressed an interest than to
    a cold call.  Once again Chris Anderson and Telos are sitting on the
    info, and refuse to release the data.

    We considered filing a Freedom of Information Act request to force the
    issue, but heard that someone did so last July and still hasn't received
    an answer."


What the hell is going on inside the Ada9X office?  If all of this is true,
it is just one more piece of evidence of the gross mismangement of Ada policies
by DISA.  Why isn't this data being released, and why isn't anyone talking
about this betrayal of the taxpayer's trust?  Funny that there is no item on
the Tri-Ada agenda to discuss the survey and response to the 800-number, with
data being passed out.  Why?

The day that survey was completed, the results should have been posted to
comp.lang.ada immediately, since you all disparage my statistics so much.
Why wasn't this data posted to comp.lang.ada and made available?  Why are
other reports (like IDA's study of the economics of the DoD reuse centers)
also being suppressed?  These aren't matters of deep national security.
The information should be widely distributed, unless as many suspect, these
studies are definitive proof of the current mismanagement of Ada policies.

I hope at Tri-Ada that Paige, Edmonds, Reifer and Anderson are asked point
blank why the Ada9X office is refusing to release these reports, especially
the Ada market survey data, and why they were allowed to suppress the Ada
market data for the last four months.  Ask, ask, ask, ask throughout Tri-Ada
and maybe by the end of the conference the data can be made available.  And
if no one at Tri-Ada asks these questions, you are all bigger hypocrites than
I thought.

And as long as bullshit like this is going on, don't expect anyone in the
private sector to invest into Ada commercialization.  It is hard enough to
for Ada startups to fight detractors pushing other languages, but to have to
fight supposed Ada supporters is utterly idiotic.


Greg Aharonian

Re: Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

[Robert Firth]

In article <Cyuy7M.M6@world.std.com> srctran@world.std.com (Gregory Aharonian) writes:

>    Even worse is that while we could live without that data (though it would
>    be nice) what we really want is sales leads, in particular names and
>    addresses of people calling the 1-800 number in response to the ads.

And I firmly hope Chris Anderson and Telos told these people that
no way would they get individual names and addresses, and they can
go jump in the lake.

If I volunteered to take part in a survey, and then found that my
name and telephone number were being peddled to every salescritter
who wanted to make my life a misery with unsolicited junk telemarketing
calls, I'd be very, very angry.  Congratulations to the Ada people for
their resolute defence of individual privacy and of the honesty of
their survey.

In most other countries - the UK, Germany, and Sweden for example - it
is illegal for any government agency to collect data for one ostensible
purpose and then use it for any other purpose.  Fat chance of such laws
being passed in this country, but until then, it is good to have people
of integrity like Chris Anderson to do the right thing.

Re: Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

[James Hopper]

.... Lots of virulent crap deleted...

In article <Cyuy7M.M6@world.std.com> Gregory Aharonian,
srctran@world.std.com writes:
>And as long as bullshit like this is going on, don't expect anyone in the
>private sector to invest into Ada commercialization.  It is hard enough
to
>for Ada startups to fight detractors pushing other languages, but to
have to
>fight supposed Ada supporters is utterly idiotic.
>
>
>Greg Aharonian
Greg, ok so you are going to give up, please do!  I'm tired and cranky
right
now, its late, but still i have had enough of your posts!!  I know that
if i called 
such a hotline i might have a concern about someone selling [or giving
away]
my name and number to a vendor, i personally don't mind such mail
but i know a lot of people who do, and the answer may have been as
simple as that.  your constant harping on these subjects is more than
annoying!  why don't you ask Chris Anderson why the data is not being
released before firing off with your editorial comment! Its a valid
question, but you presented nothing in your note that indicates you 
or your correspondent did this. If one of you did how about posting
the result of that.  But i would not personally take it bad if the 9x
people refuse to speak to you on anything but a formal basis. perhaps
someone who knows someone could ask the question without Gregs usaul
hostile spin on it!

Re: Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

[SrA Tim Miller]

On Sun, 6 Nov 1994 18:04:34 GMT, srctran@world.std.com (Gregory Aharonian) said:

G>     I recently received the following complaint by a startup Ada
G> vendor who has been DENIED access to the non-confidential, publicly
G> funded data that has been collected as part of the Ada Dual Use
G> campaign.  DENIED access. If this is not corruption plaguing Ada9X, I
G> give up:

G>     " [...]
G>     Even worse is that while we could live without that data (though
G> it would be nice) what we really want is sales leads, in particular
G> names and addresses of people calling the 1-800 number in response to
G> the ads.  

G>     [...] "

G> What the hell is going on inside the Ada9X office?  If all of this is
G> true, it is just one more piece of evidence of the gross mismangement
G> of Ada policies by DISA.  Why isn't this data being released, and why
G> isn't anyone talking about this betrayal of the taxpayer's trust?

	Have you *ever*, even *once*, heard of the 1974 Privacy Act?
You might care to look it up.  The US Government, as well as contractors
working under government hire, are prevented from releasing certain
information outlined in the 1974 Privacy Act.  

	This *certainly* covers names and addresses of respondants to
government or government contractor surveys.  It also covers other
personal information such as Social Security numbers, et.al.  I can get
a copy from the secretary and transcribe it for you if you can't be
bothered to look it up yourself.  

	We have conducted surveys and collected data in similar fashion
to the AJPO for research conducted in this office.  I myself have
participated in its collection.  I know *for a fact* that the names and
addresses of the participants are *confidential information protected by
the 1974 Privacy Act.*

	In other words, Mr. Aharonian, you are grossly, grieviously, and
obviously *wrong*.  Now go away.

-- Cerebus <tjm@hrlib.brooks.af.mil>
"You get really familiar with the 1974 Privacy Act in the military.
 It's most of the forms you fill out, and you fill out a lot of forms."

SrA Timothy J. Miller, AL/HRTI, Brooks AFB, TX.
Disclaimer:  This posting in no way constitutes an official statement
             by the USAF, DoD, or US Government.

Re: Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

[Ted Dennison]

In article <Cyuy7M.M6@world.std.com>, srctran@world.std.com (Gregory Aharonian) writes:
|>     I recently received the following complaint by a startup Ada vendor who
|> has been DENIED access to the non-confidential, publicly funded data that
|> has been collected as part of the Ada Dual Use campaign.  DENIED access. If
|> this is not corruption plaguing Ada9X, I give up:
|> 
|>     Even worse is that while we could live without that data (though it would
|>     be nice) what we really want is sales leads, in particular names and
|>     addresses of people calling the 1-800 number in response to the ads.
|>     It is easier to sell to someone who has expressed an interest than to
|>     a cold call.  Once again Chris Anderson and Telos are sitting on the
|>     info, and refuse to release the data.
|> 

I suppose these people are going to file a similar complaint against the IRS
for not supplying them with the tax records of prosepctive clients. After all
this information was gathered with public funds as well! Wouldn't income 
and cash flow information be useful?

Try again, slick.

T.E.D.

Re: Corruption in Ada9x office - suppression of Ada survey results

[Michael Feldman]

In article <1994Nov7.134022.12961@sei.cmu.edu>,
Robert Firth <firth@sei.cmu.edu> wrote:

>If I volunteered to take part in a survey, and then found that my
>name and telephone number were being peddled to every salescritter
>who wanted to make my life a misery with unsolicited junk telemarketing
>calls, I'd be very, very angry.  Congratulations to the Ada people for
>their resolute defence of individual privacy and of the honesty of
>their survey.

When I spoke to some folks about this, they said that a _trade association_
would normally commission such a marketing survey. Also, they said that
from their experience with trade associations, a _marketing_ survey
produces trends, opinions, perceptions, etc., NOT sales leads, and that
the raw data would, in general, NOT be released, even to members of
the association, for exactly the reasons Robert outlined above. The
idea in a survey like this is to get decision makers in companies to
give their perceptions and feelings and thoughts in confidence, with
assurance that only aggregated data will be released.

The irony of the Ada business is that the _business_ part of the community
should not be depending on Uncle Sam to do its marketing.

The Ada Resource Association was launched at TRI-Ada as a trade association
intended to encompass more than just the compiler vendors. Robert Mathis
was announced as the Executive Director. Let's all hope that ARA gets
lots of dues-paying members - even individuals can sign up for a few
bucks - and enough money to start doing the kind of industry-wide
marketing a good trade association should do.

IMHO, Uncle Sam should get out of the marketing business. DoD's job is to
provide for the common defense, not play the role of a trade association
or venture capitalist.

Mike Feldman
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael B. Feldman -  chair, SIGAda Education Working Group
Professor, Dept. of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science
The George Washington University -  Washington, DC 20052 USA
202-994-5919 (voice) - 202-994-0227 (fax) - mfeldman@seas.gwu.edu (Internet)
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