Re: Standard Library Interest?

[Marin David Condic <nobody@noplace.com>]

Warren W. Gay VE3WWG wrote:
> 
> 
> And at the end of the fiscal year, the cost will be passed back
> to you and me. After all, nobody's just going to eat the charges
> "just because". So I think that is a given.
> 
Yes. But so what? You volunteer time and hence you pay with labor. You 
purchase support (and get the direct benefits thereof) and you pay for 
further development. In the former case, there is little to no control 
over quality or style or deliverables or schedule. In the latter case, 
you get some ability to direct the effort and make sure that things are 
done "right" - at least from the perspective of the consumer of the end 
product (That being the vendors and their immediate customers.)


> The point is how to get it all rolling. IMO, which is obviously
> a bit different than yours, you'll not get things rolling waiting
> for the vendor to initiate this effort. Especially if it involves
> in multiple vendors working together. Not impossible mind you, just
> unlikely. That is like trying to reach consensus in a meeting
> with 15 people in it, vs a small group of three.

I agree that the point is to get it all rolling. I'm agitating, aren't 
I? :-)

Keep in mind that I've served in efforts to get something like this 
going before and fould little to no results from the volunteer efforts. 
Hence, I'm agitating to see if a different approach might actually work 
better. I think if customers were to start asking their vendors to 
supply a library and that it be semi-standard between compilers, etc., 
they'd hear that message. I doubt that they have no idea I'm out here 
agitating for a library or suggesting that they get on board. 
*INITIALLY* it might even get somewhere as a volunteer effort - provided 
the vendors simply gave it a nod and a wink and a little guidance as to 
what they might want. I think long-term - much as with the Ada standard 
itself - they'd have to be "Owners" of it in some way. They fund the 
development of the standard by participating in the ARG, etc., and 
devoting staff time to looking over the changes, suggesting 
improvements, and so on. This is really just an extension of that same 
process. They'd be participating in a similar effort to get a 
Conventional Ada Library built - and getting what they wanted rather 
than something they'd likely turn their noses up at.

Ultimately, there are dozens or maybe even hundreds of ways to organize 
something that might produce and maintain a library. I think that if 
such a library were to thrive and gain acceptance in a wide way, it 
ought to get some kind of involvment of the vendors. It seems you want 
to go organize an effort that would build one without the vendor's 
involvement in the hope of getting that involvement later. It *could* 
work - we just have not seen that happen yet despite numerous other 
attempts to do it that way. I wouldn't try to stop you - I'd just wait 
to see where it got before I'd spend my time on it because I've seen 
similar efforts fall apart.

MDC




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Marin David Condic
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