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From: Richard Riehle <richard@adaworks.com>
Subject: Re: Portable GUI (was Re: Future with Ada)
Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:37:09 -0800
Date: 2001-12-20T19:31:40+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <3C223DE4.9A50C1B2@adaworks.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 9vqk0f$cp9$1@nh.pace.co.uk

I am now reading the language comparison papers from my
NPS class, "Ada As A Second Language."    Nearly all of the
students in this class have at least two other languages:
C++ and Java.   Some have Fortran from their undergraduate
engineering but have forgotten much of it.   Others have a
smattering of other languages.

One of the last assignments for this class was to write a paper
comparing Ada to one of their "first" languages.    Some
compared Ada to C++.  Most compared it to Java.   A few
compared it to multiple languages, usually C++ and Ada. One
even included a comparison to PL/I.

Almost all of them prefer Ada to C++.    Some don't like Ada
very much due to difficulties they had completing some of their
assignments.   Most expressed a newfound appreciation for Ada,
even as they expected it to be dull, dead, and a waste of time.

In nearly every paper, especially those comparing Ada to Java,
the students said they would be more inclined to use Java because
of the easy-to-use development environment.    Even those who
really took to Ada noted their disappointment with the available
tools for creating, testing, and debugging programs when comparing
their Java experience with their Ada experience.

The conclusion:   Ada is attractive, as a language.   It is not attractive
when one examines the associated development tools and libraries. We
have a long way to go.

That being said, some of the compiler developers do have good development
environments available.  I need to see whether I can get access to the
Rational Apex environment or some of the other really good commercial
tools (DDC-I, Wind River, etc.)  for future NPS classes.   One problem with
that is that students put the compiler and development tools on their laptops
for the quarter and practice at home, in the library, and in the lunch area.  I
fear I would have trouble getting permission from a commercial compiler
publisher to distribute their product so freely.   ObjectAda is an option,
because of its GUI environment.  Some students use it.   Too bad ObjectAda
does not decouple from its compiler so we could use any compiler we
wanted with it.

Meanwhile,  we will continue to use the tools that are freely available and
encourage students with glimpses of other environments when possible.  Still,
it is difficult when they see the tools available for Java compared to what they

have for Ada.

Some of you are old enough to remember Eddie Cantor singing, "How you
gonna keep'em down on the farm after they've seen Pareeeeee?"

Richard Riehle






  reply	other threads:[~2001-12-20 19:37 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 245+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2001-11-09 17:59 Future with Ada Michal Nowak
2001-11-10  0:44 ` Adrian Hoe
2001-11-10 13:28 ` Frode Tennebø
2001-11-10 23:09   ` Michal Nowak
2001-11-11 15:10     ` Preben Randhol
2001-11-11 22:31       ` Michal Nowak
2001-11-10 17:31 ` Ted Dennison
2001-11-10 23:09   ` Michal Nowak
2001-11-25  9:50   ` ben
2001-11-26 15:21     ` Marin David Condic
2001-11-26 19:48       ` Larry Kilgallen
2001-11-26 20:59         ` Marin David Condic
2001-11-26 23:33           ` Jerry Petrey
2001-11-27 14:24             ` Marin David Condic
2001-11-26 22:56         ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-01 18:43     ` Richard Riehle
2001-12-01 21:29       ` Suzie Cube
2001-12-10 16:25         ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-10 17:03           ` Larry Hazel
2001-12-10 17:19             ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-10 17:34               ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-10 18:10                 ` Larry Kilgallen
2001-12-10 18:25                   ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-02  0:19       ` IsraelRT
2001-12-02  0:46       ` Brian Rogoff
2001-12-02 19:58         ` Richard Riehle
2001-12-03 17:25           ` Wes Groleau
2001-12-10 16:39             ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-10 20:30               ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-11 15:15                 ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-11 16:56                   ` Darren New
2001-12-11 17:14                     ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-12  1:47                       ` Richard Riehle
2001-12-12  2:47                         ` Larry Kilgallen
2001-12-12  6:38                           ` Mark Biggar
2001-12-12 10:53                             ` Larry Kilgallen
2001-12-12 14:35                               ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-12 17:45                                 ` Peter Hend�n
2001-12-12 19:35                                 ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-12 20:55                                   ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-16 13:34                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2001-12-12 14:55                         ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-12 18:02                           ` tmoran
2001-12-22 19:58                           ` Gerhard Häring
2001-12-28 21:12                             ` Containers package Eric Merritt
2001-12-29 14:11                               ` Michael Erdmann
2001-12-29 23:03                                 ` Eric Merritt
2001-12-31  2:58                                   ` Nick Roberts
2001-12-31 15:09                                     ` Eric Merritt
2001-12-31 23:19                                       ` Containers package (Tenet) Nick Roberts
2002-01-01  5:45                                     ` Containers package Ted Dennison
2002-01-01 23:30                                       ` Nick Roberts
2002-01-02  0:26                                         ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-29 22:13                               ` Marc A. Criley
2001-12-12 21:49                       ` Future with Ada Darren New
2001-12-14 20:22                         ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-11 20:36                     ` XML and Ada was " Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-12  8:33                   ` rob
2001-12-12 15:03                     ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-16 13:48                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2001-12-16 16:17                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2001-12-16 16:21                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2001-12-17 15:10                         ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-17 22:32                           ` Ian S. Nelson
2001-12-17 23:11                             ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-18 15:49                             ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-18 16:41                               ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-19 16:33                                 ` Mr. Caffiene
2001-12-19 17:57                                   ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-19 21:07                                     ` Ian S. Nelson
2001-12-19 21:20                                       ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-19 18:36                                   ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-19 19:49                                     ` tmoran
2001-12-19 20:16                                       ` Eric Merritt
2001-12-19 21:11                                         ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-21 14:15                                           ` Eric Merritt
2001-12-20 19:50                                       ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-20 21:37                                         ` Hyman Rosen
2001-12-21 15:42                                           ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-19 20:37                                     ` Ian S. Nelson
2001-12-19 23:36                                   ` Michal Nowak
2001-12-19 23:36                                 ` Michal Nowak
2002-01-21 22:28                                   ` Harri J Haataja
2001-12-18 12:56                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2001-12-12 17:03                     ` Ian S. Nelson
2001-12-13 17:43                     ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-13 20:13                       ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-14 19:49                         ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-14 19:59                           ` Pat Rogers
2001-12-14 21:00                             ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-14 23:02                               ` Pat Rogers
2001-12-17  8:15                                 ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-17 15:27                                   ` Pat Rogers
2001-12-17 16:29                                     ` Brian Rogoff
2001-12-17 17:05                                       ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-17 15:43                                 ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-17  8:15                               ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-17 16:03                                 ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-17  8:15                             ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-14 20:31                           ` James Rogers
2001-12-15  1:33                             ` Richard Riehle
2001-12-15 16:35                               ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-16 14:09                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2001-12-16 15:32                                 ` Eric Merritt
2001-12-17 16:31                               ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-15  2:44                             ` Eric Merritt
2001-12-14 20:39                           ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-18 23:01                             ` Mark Lundquist
2001-12-19 15:00                               ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-20  7:23                                 ` tmoran
2001-12-20 22:30                                 ` tmoran
2001-12-20 22:43                                   ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-19 20:50                               ` Wes Groleau
2001-12-19  0:12                             ` Portable GUI (was Re: Future with Ada) Mark Lundquist
2001-12-19  7:36                               ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-20  5:00                                 ` Steve Doiel
2001-12-20  6:19                                   ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-20 14:33                                   ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-20 20:53                                 ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-20 21:14                                   ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-21 14:53                                     ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-21 15:08                                       ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-21 16:40                                         ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-21 16:26                                   ` Robert C. Leif, Ph.D.
2001-12-19 15:07                               ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-19 15:14                               ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-19 16:53                               ` Darren New
2001-12-19 17:50                                 ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-20 19:37                                   ` Richard Riehle [this message]
2001-12-20 20:05                                     ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-20 20:07                                     ` Marin David Condic
2001-12-20 20:28                                     ` Stephen Leake
2001-12-21 17:18                                       ` Richard Riehle
2001-12-22 18:16                                     ` Michal Nowak
2001-12-02 20:26         ` Future with Ada Michal Nowak
2001-12-02 19:55       ` Michal Nowak
2001-12-03 14:53         ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-07 16:54         ` Richard Riehle
2001-12-07 17:14           ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-09 10:56           ` Thomas Mueller
2001-12-09 13:57             ` David C. Hoos, Sr.
2001-12-11 17:45           ` Michal Nowak
2001-12-03 14:52       ` Ted Dennison
2001-12-12 21:56       ` John Kern
2002-02-26  2:22       ` Michael Card
2002-02-26  4:12         ` Jim Rogers
2002-02-27  1:23           ` Adrian Hoe
2002-02-27 17:51           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2002-02-28 17:00             ` Richard Riehle
2002-02-28 21:24               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2002-02-28 17:45             ` Michal Nowak
2002-02-28 18:53               ` Hyman Rosen
2002-02-28 19:24                 ` Ed Falis
2002-03-01  0:52                   ` Adrian Hoe
2002-03-01 18:11                     ` Pascal Obry
2002-03-02  1:20                       ` Adrian Hoe
2002-02-28 21:43                 ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-01  5:18                 ` Richard Riehle
2002-03-01  5:23                   ` Dave Poirier
2002-03-01 16:45                   ` Michal Nowak
2002-03-01 11:10                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2002-03-03  8:28                   ` Hyman Rosen
2002-03-05 18:40                   ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2002-03-01 16:48                 ` Michal Nowak
2002-03-01 17:26                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2002-03-03  8:26                   ` Hyman Rosen
2002-03-03 13:28                     ` Larry Kilgallen
2002-03-03 17:47                     ` Chad R. Meiners
2002-03-04 16:30                       ` Hyman Rosen
2002-03-04 19:28                         ` Chad R. Meiners
2002-03-05 17:03                           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2002-03-05  1:41                         ` Richard Riehle
2002-03-05 21:35                           ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-05 22:04                             ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-06  8:33                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2002-03-06 11:46                               ` Frank J. Lhota
2002-03-06 15:03                                 ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-07 16:08                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2002-03-07 16:25                                     ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-09 14:51                                   ` Gary Scott
2002-03-09 15:13                                     ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-09 15:54                                     ` named control statements (was: Future with Ada) Wes Groleau
2002-03-09 16:40                                       ` Gary Scott
2002-03-09 20:53                                       ` Jeffrey Carter
2002-03-06 16:36                               ` Future with Ada Georg Bauhaus
2002-03-06 17:27                                 ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-07 16:04                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2002-03-07 16:42                                     ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-11 13:52                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2002-03-11 20:02                                       ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-11 23:56                                         ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-12 16:47                                           ` code partitioning (was: Future with Ada) Wes Groleau
2002-03-12 17:56                                             ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-13 13:42                                               ` labeling (was: partitioning (was: Future)) Wes Groleau
2002-03-14 12:46                                                 ` Michal Nowak
2002-03-14 17:27                                                   ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-14 20:27                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-15  8:00                                                 ` Tarjei T. Jensen
2002-03-15 15:10                                                   ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-14 15:27                                               ` code partitioning (was: Future with Ada) John R. Strohm
2002-03-15 14:15                                                 ` Ted Dennison
2002-03-16 10:37                                                   ` Kevin Cline
2002-03-13 12:26                                           ` Future with Ada John English
2002-03-13 14:15                                             ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-14  3:34                                               ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-14 15:36                                                 ` John R. Strohm
2002-03-14 17:43                                                   ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-14 11:59                                               ` John English
2002-03-13 15:16                                           ` Kevin Cline
2002-03-13 17:55                                             ` Marin David Condic
2002-03-14 15:21                                           ` John R. Strohm
2002-03-07 20:52                                   ` Kevin Cline
2002-03-07 22:12                                     ` Chad R. Meiners
2002-03-11 18:43                                       ` Kevin Cline
2002-03-11 22:53                                         ` Chad R. Meiners
2002-03-06 17:07                               ` Wes Groleau
2002-03-05  3:45                         ` Brian Rogoff
2002-03-04  1:45                     ` Eric Merritt
2002-03-04  6:03                       ` Hyman Rosen
2002-03-04 13:44                         ` Eric Merritt
2002-03-04 16:01                           ` Hyman Rosen
2002-03-04 18:14                             ` Eric Merritt
2002-03-04 16:46                           ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2002-03-04 17:08                             ` Hyman Rosen
2002-03-04 18:15                             ` Eric Merritt
2002-03-05 16:54                             ` Pascal Obry
2002-03-05 17:26                               ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2002-03-04 20:06                     ` Jeffrey Carter
2002-02-27  1:30         ` Adrian Hoe
2002-02-27 20:09         ` Ken Pinard
2002-03-09 20:19         ` Richard Riehle
2001-11-11 20:13 ` Ehud Lamm
2001-11-11 22:32   ` Michal Nowak
2001-11-13 21:43     ` Maciej Sobczak
2001-11-14 16:26       ` Don
2001-11-14 19:32       ` Mark Lundquist
2001-11-14 19:46         ` David C. Hoos
2001-11-15  0:02           ` Mark Lundquist
2001-11-24 23:21           ` Florian Weimer
2001-11-14 21:22         ` Ted Dennison
2001-11-14 21:50       ` Michal Nowak
2001-11-15  7:39         ` Preben Randhol
2001-11-15 14:59           ` Marin David Condic
2001-11-15 15:44             ` Preben Randhol
2001-11-15 16:00         ` John English
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