* Re: off-topic ...
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Peter Milliken
@ 1999-11-18 0:00 ` Nobat
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Marin Condic
` (2 subsequent siblings)
3 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Nobat @ 1999-11-18 0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
Hi Peter,
Thank you for you comments;
Please note I am not criticizing anyone. I only found this business model
very different from other compiler Vendors. (I am not neither expert in
Business nor in Ada95). I think aggressive presentation of Ada compiler in
vendor websites and other high-traffic websites (Developer.com, Planet IT,
CNET, ZDNET,..look at JAVE companies), as well as advertising in
professional journals (talking about advantages of using Ada95, advertising
some of success stories), talking with proud about new implemented features
and benchmark results (developing and distributing some home-made
benchmarks),etc. would probably help the Ada vendors and community ...
IMHO, you cannot sell an excellent product without aggressively presenting
it...(maybe I am wrong)
Regards;
Nobat
news:38336E5A.D744214E@australia.boeing.com...
> I don't find in all that strange. Such information regarding Fortran and
C++
> compilers is (presumably) generally because they have just implemented
some
> (new/existing) feature of the language i.e. their product has "grown" in
some
> dimension etc Whereas, Ada has a well recognised standard, the compiler
either
> comforms (in which case it is released and sold) or it doesn't conform (in
> which case it is not yet on the market :-)). The only thing Ada vendors
can
> "brag" about is either additions wrt the Annexes (which you do see as
> announcements) or bug fixes (which no-one really wants to noise about
anyway
> :-)).
>
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread* Re: off-topic ...
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Peter Milliken
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Nobat
@ 1999-11-18 0:00 ` Marin Condic
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Ted Dennison
1999-11-19 0:00 ` off-topic Robert Dewar
3 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Marin Condic @ 1999-11-18 0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
Peter Milliken wrote:
> I don't find in all that strange. Such information regarding Fortran and C++
> compilers is (presumably) generally because they have just implemented some
> (new/existing) feature of the language i.e. their product has "grown" in some
> dimension etc Whereas, Ada has a well recognised standard, the compiler either
> comforms (in which case it is released and sold) or it doesn't conform (in
> which case it is not yet on the market :-)). The only thing Ada vendors can
> "brag" about is either additions wrt the Annexes (which you do see as
> announcements) or bug fixes (which no-one really wants to noise about anyway
> :-)).
>
Well, couldn't they possibly brag about additional support tools or compiler
specific libraries? I notice that GNAT typically comes with a few new tools
bundled in with a new release. It quite often comes with some new capabilities -
cross reference listing, better integration with AdaGIDE, etc. Or there are
libraries like the Win32Ada stuff or new GNAT.Something files. Other vendors must
have similar stuff to brag about, eh?
I've had older Ada compilers where the company had some form of formal change
control process & they would list closed out change requests that were included in
a new release. Many were bug fixes, but a lot were improvements (various
optimizations in generated code, etc.). Maybe the vendor of your choice has some
similar process - just not advertised on the web page. There often is no
substitute for calling some sales associate in the company and asking a few
questions.
MDC
--
Marin David Condic
If you hurry you can, for a short time only, still find me at:
Real Time & Embedded Systems, Propulsion Systems Analysis
United Technologies, Pratt & Whitney, Large Military Engines
M/S 731-95, P.O.B. 109600, West Palm Beach, FL, 33410-9600
***To reply, remove "bogon" from the domain name.***
Visit my web page at: http://www.mcondic.com/
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: off-topic ...
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Peter Milliken
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Nobat
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Marin Condic
@ 1999-11-18 0:00 ` Ted Dennison
1999-11-19 0:00 ` off-topic Robert Dewar
1999-11-19 0:00 ` off-topic Robert Dewar
3 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Ted Dennison @ 1999-11-18 0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
In article <38336E5A.D744214E@australia.boeing.com>,
Peter Milliken <peter.milliken@australia.boeing.com> wrote:
> which case it is not yet on the market :-)). The only thing Ada
> vendors can "brag" about is either additions wrt the Annexes (which
> you do see as announcements) or bug fixes (which no-one really wants
> to noise about anyway :-)).
...or perhaps actually implementing the implementation advice. :-)
--
T.E.D.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread
* Re: off-topic ...
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Peter Milliken
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
1999-11-18 0:00 ` off-topic Ted Dennison
@ 1999-11-19 0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1999-11-19 0:00 ` off-topic Vladimir Olensky
3 siblings, 1 reply; 11+ messages in thread
From: Robert Dewar @ 1999-11-19 0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
In article <38336E5A.D744214E@australia.boeing.com>,
Peter Milliken <peter.milliken@australia.boeing.com> wrote:
> The only thing Ada vendors can
> "brag" about is either additions wrt the Annexes (which you do
> see as announcements) or bug fixes (which no-one really wants
> to noise about anyway
That's really quite wrong! We have literally hundreds of ideas
for enhancements that come from us and our customers. Each
new version of GNAT has many valuable new features. Here
is a little preview of some new features in the next version
of GNAT for example:
It is now permissible to specify the non-default Bit_Order
for record subtypes. Component clauses for such types must
either specify an integral number of bytes, or the component
must lie entirely within one byte. Note that, in accordance
with the RM, no reordering of bytes is done, the only effect
is to renumber bits. This feature is therefore only of
limited use in dealing with big/little-endian interfacing.
The listing generated by the -gnatR switch now includes
alignment values for array and record types.
The NT version of GNAT now generates object files that are
fully compatible with the standard Microsoft linker, so this
linker can be used instead of the GNU ld program to build NT
executables.
New restrictions No_Implicit_Conditionals and
No_Implicit_Loops have been added for greater control over
generated code. This is particularly useful in a
safety-critical/certification environment using GNORT (GNAT
with no run time)
A new package GNAT.Calendar.Time_IO is provided. This
package implements formatted output of Ada.Calendar.Time.
The format string uses a format similar to the one used by
the date UNIX command.
This is just a small random selection, the list is
already about 50 items long, and we are not yet
at the release point.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread* Re: off-topic ...
1999-11-19 0:00 ` off-topic Robert Dewar
@ 1999-11-19 0:00 ` Vladimir Olensky
0 siblings, 0 replies; 11+ messages in thread
From: Vladimir Olensky @ 1999-11-19 0:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
Robert Dewar wrote in message <812o0p$1n7$1@nnrp1.deja.com>...
> Each new version of GNAT has many valuable new features.
> Here is a little preview of some new features in the next version
>of GNAT for example:
>
> The NT version of GNAT now generates object files that are
> fully compatible with the standard Microsoft linker, so this
> linker can be used instead of the GNU ld program to build NT
> executables.
This would be a great leap forward on the NT platform !!!
Ability to work with the platform native linker would give a
lot of advantages.
I understand that this also would make it much simpler to
build DLLs.
Will there be an option to tell GNAT which linker to use ?
One of the very important advantages would also be the ability to
remove unreferenced code in the executable, provided that
GNAT compiler would have the option that allows the compiler
to package individual functions in the form of packaged
functions (COMDATs). MS linker requires that functions be
packaged separately as COMDATs to exclude or order individual
functions in a DLL or .EXE file.
Then we will be able to use the MS linker's /OPT:REF option to exclude
unreferenced packaged functions from the .EXE file.
After that GNAT will be highly competitive with other software development
tools for WinNT ( including MSVC itself).
Another great feature would be direct support of Pentium II and above
streaming SIMD extensions and MMXT technology which is extremely
important in signal processing.
Now one need to use assembler to be able to use that in Ada.
Regards,
Vladimir Olensky
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 11+ messages in thread