Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

[John *NOSPAM* Bunk]

Hello,
Has anyone used the Rational Apex Ada compiler on a NT host platform for a
Win32 target?  If so, I was wondering what support does this compiler have
for the Win32 API.  Does it generate Win32 EXEs?  Does it have Ada bindings
for the Win32 API?  Tools?  Documentation?  Performance?

Thanks in advance,
John

Re: Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

[Tom Moran]

I haven't used Apex myself, but Randy Brukardt of RR Software has
ported CLAW to it, so it clearly supports the usual Windows APIs.

Re: Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

[Roga Danar]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1670 bytes --]

Hi John,

  I am amoung the unfortunate that use Rational Apex Ada.

John *NOSPAM* Bunk wrote:

> Hello,
> Has anyone used the Rational Apex Ada compiler on a NT host platform for a
> Win32 target?

    Yes.

> If so, I was wondering what support does this compiler have
> for the Win32 API.

    Yes. For our v.2.0.1 it's in the winapi.ss

> Does it generate Win32 EXEs?

    Yes.

> Does it have Ada bindings
> for the Win32 API?

    Yes.

>  Tools?

    Not really that great.

> Documentation?

    NONE!! This is my biggest complaint.  If the WIN API were documented I
would have little problem w/ it.  But there is little to none in any of the
sub-systems that came with the version I am using.

> Performance?

    Well, the Apex environment for NT is an entirely different animal than the
one they have for Unix.  They make like it isn't but believe me it is.

    My experience w/ it includes:

Crashes.  Once in a while it fails to get permissions to write one file or
another and just crashes. BANG, you have to it up again.

Terrible GUI.  It take getting use to but even then it really uncomfortable to
work with.  if one is use to the Unix version be prepared to be disappointed in
the funcationality that you are losing.

Cannot write to PRN or LPT1:  I have yet to find a way to write to a port with
this version of Apex Ada.  There is code in the predefined.ss that look like it
could help but only crashes on elaboration.  I have written for help on this
very ng but to no avail.  I as well as others have been able to do this simple
task on other compilers (GNAT, Alsys) for NT.

>

    Hope this helps.

    Michael

>
>
> Thanks in advance,
> John

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Re: Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

[Dave Wood]

I certainly can't speak for Rational, but regarding
the documentation issue, wouldn't any Win32 book
suffice?  Presuming the binding is thin, any of
the dozens of books at your local Barnes&Noble
ought to be usable for Win32 programming even if
Apex itself doesn't include Win32 API docs.

-- Dave Wood, Aonix
-- Product Manager, ObjectAda for Windows
-- http://www.aonix.com


Roga Danar wrote:
> 
> Hi John,
> 
>   I am amoung the unfortunate that use Rational Apex Ada.
> 
> John *NOSPAM* Bunk wrote:
> 
> > Hello,
> > Has anyone used the Rational Apex Ada compiler on a NT host platform for a
> > Win32 target?
> 

[snip]

> 
> > Documentation?
> 
>     NONE!! This is my biggest complaint.  If the WIN API were documented I
> would have little problem w/ it.  But there is little to none in any of the
> sub-systems that came with the version I am using.
> 
> > Performance?
> 
>     Well, the Apex environment for NT is an entirely different animal than the
> one they have for Unix.  They make like it isn't but believe me it is.
> 
>     My experience w/ it includes:
> 
> Crashes.  Once in a while it fails to get permissions to write one file or
> another and just crashes. BANG, you have to it up again.
> 
> Terrible GUI.  It take getting use to but even then it really uncomfortable to
> work with.  if one is use to the Unix version be prepared to be disappointed in
> the funcationality that you are losing.
> 
> Cannot write to PRN or LPT1:  I have yet to find a way to write to a port with
> this version of Apex Ada.  There is code in the predefined.ss that look like it
> could help but only crashes on elaboration.  I have written for help on this
> very ng but to no avail.  I as well as others have been able to do this simple
> task on other compilers (GNAT, Alsys) for NT.
> 
> >
> 
>     Hope this helps.
> 
>     Michael
> 
> >
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> > John
> 
>   ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
>   Roga Danar <nospam_smithm@nospam_stelnj.com>
>   Senior Software Eng. Consultant
>   AlphaSoft, Inc.
> 
>   Roga Danar
>   Senior Software Eng. Consultant  <nospam_smithm@nospam_stelnj.com>
>   AlphaSoft, Inc.
>                                    Netscape Conference Address
>                                    Netscape Conference DLS Server
>   Remove the "_nospam" in the email address to reply
>   Additional Information:
>   Last Name      Danar
>   First Name     Roga
>   Version        2.1

Re: Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

[John *NOSPAM* Bunk]

Well, I can tell you from personal experience when I had to do this for
Turbo Pascal for Windows that this was a pain in the ___.  Because the
binding wasn't C and wasn't written by the same people who developed the MS
Win32 SDK, there were some subtle differences between the SDK interface and
thin bindings (callbacks and data types anyone?).  The SDK will only
describe the operation of the function and what you pass into it, but it
doesn't describe the specifics of the native code interface (what data
types, enumerations, blah blah blah).

By the way, last time I went to Opamp technical bookstore, I had to wade
through tons of MFC, Java, and Delphi books to find one or two pure Win32
SDK books (which basically was just a copy of the MS SDK).  The best
solution, obviously, is to get MSDN CDs, but now I have to pay even more to
get the same thing I get for free when I buy Visual C++, Delphi, C++
Builder, etc...  At least the compiler SHOULD bundle the SDK with the
compiler if it's going to advertise itself as a Win32 compiler!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

John

Dave Wood wrote in message <364BDD4D.BF17B5BE@cts.com>...
>I certainly can't speak for Rational, but regarding
>the documentation issue, wouldn't any Win32 book
>suffice?  Presuming the binding is thin, any of
>the dozens of books at your local Barnes&Noble
>ought to be usable for Win32 programming even if
>Apex itself doesn't include Win32 API docs.
>
>-- Dave Wood, Aonix
>-- Product Manager, ObjectAda for Windows
>-- http://www.aonix.com
>
>
>Roga Danar wrote:
>>
>> Hi John,
>>
>>   I am amoung the unfortunate that use Rational Apex Ada.
>>
>> John *NOSPAM* Bunk wrote:
>>
>> > Hello,
>> > Has anyone used the Rational Apex Ada compiler on a NT host platform
for a
>> > Win32 target?
>>
>
>[snip]
>
>>
>> > Documentation?
>>
>>     NONE!! This is my biggest complaint.  If the WIN API were documented
I
>> would have little problem w/ it.  But there is little to none in any of
the
>> sub-systems that came with the version I am using.
>>
>> > Performance?
>>
>>     Well, the Apex environment for NT is an entirely different animal
than the
>> one they have for Unix.  They make like it isn't but believe me it is.
>>
>>     My experience w/ it includes:
>>
>> Crashes.  Once in a while it fails to get permissions to write one file
or
>> another and just crashes. BANG, you have to it up again.
>>
>> Terrible GUI.  It take getting use to but even then it really
uncomfortable to
>> work with.  if one is use to the Unix version be prepared to be
disappointed in
>> the funcationality that you are losing.
>>
>> Cannot write to PRN or LPT1:  I have yet to find a way to write to a port
with
>> this version of Apex Ada.  There is code in the predefined.ss that look
like it
>> could help but only crashes on elaboration.  I have written for help on
this
>> very ng but to no avail.  I as well as others have been able to do this
simple
>> task on other compilers (GNAT, Alsys) for NT.
>>
>> >
>>
>>     Hope this helps.
>>
>>     Michael
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks in advance,
>> > John
>>
>>   -----------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>>
>>   Roga Danar <nospam_smithm@nospam_stelnj.com>
>>   Senior Software Eng. Consultant
>>   AlphaSoft, Inc.
>>
>>   Roga Danar
>>   Senior Software Eng. Consultant  <nospam_smithm@nospam_stelnj.com>
>>   AlphaSoft, Inc.
>>                                    Netscape Conference Address
>>                                    Netscape Conference DLS Server
>>   Remove the "_nospam" in the email address to reply
>>   Additional Information:
>>   Last Name      Danar
>>   First Name     Roga
>>   Version        2.1

Re: Anyone use Rational Apex on a WinNT platform?

[Dave Wood]

I haven't done any (significant) Win32 programming myself,
but I remember a similar experience doing Mac programming
using C++ (or some rough equivalent that Symantec was
passing off as an OO version of C).  It was a big
nightmare, but I remember having the distinct impression
that the problem was not the binding (MacOS interface was 
Pascal) but rather the underlying API.  Some functions 
just didn't work, and some worked but not as advertised 
in the doc set (trial and error required to figure it out).  
The docs were huge, sometimes ambiguous, often terse, and 
really difficult to navigate because of the size of the API.  
Win32 seems to be much the same sort of beast.  This is
where abstraction technologies (thick bindings, object
libraries, pre-built components, GUI builders, etc.) can
really help out.  In short, let some other sucker figure
it out for you whenever possible.

-- Dave Wood, Aonix
-- Product Manager, ObjectAda for Windows
-- http://www.aonix.com


John *NOSPAM* Bunk wrote:
> 
> Well, I can tell you from personal experience when I had to do this for
> Turbo Pascal for Windows that this was a pain in the ___.  Because the
> binding wasn't C and wasn't written by the same people who developed the MS
> Win32 SDK, there were some subtle differences between the SDK interface and
> thin bindings (callbacks and data types anyone?).  The SDK will only
> describe the operation of the function and what you pass into it, but it
> doesn't describe the specifics of the native code interface (what data
> types, enumerations, blah blah blah).
> 
> By the way, last time I went to Opamp technical bookstore, I had to wade
> through tons of MFC, Java, and Delphi books to find one or two pure Win32
> SDK books (which basically was just a copy of the MS SDK).  The best
> solution, obviously, is to get MSDN CDs, but now I have to pay even more to
> get the same thing I get for free when I buy Visual C++, Delphi, C++
> Builder, etc...  At least the compiler SHOULD bundle the SDK with the
> compiler if it's going to advertise itself as a Win32 compiler!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> John
> 
> Dave Wood wrote in message <364BDD4D.BF17B5BE@cts.com>...
> >I certainly can't speak for Rational, but regarding
> >the documentation issue, wouldn't any Win32 book
> >suffice?  Presuming the binding is thin, any of
> >the dozens of books at your local Barnes&Noble
> >ought to be usable for Win32 programming even if
> >Apex itself doesn't include Win32 API docs.
> >
> >-- Dave Wood, Aonix
> >-- Product Manager, ObjectAda for Windows
> >-- http://www.aonix.com
> >
> >
> >Roga Danar wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi John,
> >>
> >>   I am amoung the unfortunate that use Rational Apex Ada.
> >>
> >> John *NOSPAM* Bunk wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hello,
> >> > Has anyone used the Rational Apex Ada compiler on a NT host platform
> for a
> >> > Win32 target?
> >>
> >
> >[snip]
> >
> >>
> >> > Documentation?
> >>
> >>     NONE!! This is my biggest complaint.  If the WIN API were documented
> I
> >> would have little problem w/ it.  But there is little to none in any of
> the
> >> sub-systems that came with the version I am using.
> >>
> >> > Performance?
> >>
> >>     Well, the Apex environment for NT is an entirely different animal
> than the
> >> one they have for Unix.  They make like it isn't but believe me it is.
> >>
> >>     My experience w/ it includes:
> >>
> >> Crashes.  Once in a while it fails to get permissions to write one file
> or
> >> another and just crashes. BANG, you have to it up again.
> >>
> >> Terrible GUI.  It take getting use to but even then it really
> uncomfortable to
> >> work with.  if one is use to the Unix version be prepared to be
> disappointed in
> >> the funcationality that you are losing.
> >>
> >> Cannot write to PRN or LPT1:  I have yet to find a way to write to a port
> with
> >> this version of Apex Ada.  There is code in the predefined.ss that look
> like it
> >> could help but only crashes on elaboration.  I have written for help on
> this
> >> very ng but to no avail.  I as well as others have been able to do this
> simple
> >> task on other compilers (GNAT, Alsys) for NT.
> >>
> >> >
> >>
> >>     Hope this helps.
> >>
> >>     Michael
> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Thanks in advance,
> >> > John
> >>
> >>   -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> >>
> >>   Roga Danar <nospam_smithm@nospam_stelnj.com>
> >>   Senior Software Eng. Consultant
> >>   AlphaSoft, Inc.
> >>
> >>   Roga Danar
> >>   Senior Software Eng. Consultant  <nospam_smithm@nospam_stelnj.com>
> >>   AlphaSoft, Inc.
> >>                                    Netscape Conference Address
> >>                                    Netscape Conference DLS Server
> >>   Remove the "_nospam" in the email address to reply
> >>   Additional Information:
> >>   Last Name      Danar
> >>   First Name     Roga
> >>   Version        2.1