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From: Joachim Durchholz <joachim.durchholz@munich.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: The great Java showcase (re: 2nd historic mistake)
Date: 1997/09/16
Date: 1997-09-16T00:00:00+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <341EDE29.7475CEA2@munich.netsurf.de> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 341D7271.C55A4622@dave-world.net


Tim Ottinger wrote:
> I think this is a sad statement. Is the ability to generate revenue
> the
> only kind of superiority?

Sad or not, this is the way Reality works.
Nobody said that evolution will produce the nicest or most aesthetic
results. The survivors are the meanest, toughest, and most egoistical
traits, moderated only by the fact that cooperation can reap immense
benefits. This is so in biology, and this is so in economy.

> It leads us to think that there is nothing valuable about products
> which
> did not win market share because of poor packaging or marketing.

Commercial success and inherent value have no intrinsic connection. The
only connection that exists is that inherent value can help (and often
does help) for commercial success.
So doing your work well does help in the success of the products you're
working on, but you shouldn't be so megalomaniac to assume that this is
the single criterion for the product to succeed. If that were the case,
all those marketing guys could quit working right now, just as you
proposed to quit testing... the truth is in the middle. All have to do
their work, and your success depends on the efforts of the marketing
guys as well as their success depends on your effort. (I've heard
salesmen complaining about the rubbish they have to force on the
customers... I guess they routinely curse all those software developers
who produce rotten, difficult to use, buggy, and unfit software they
have to sell. And so software engineers and sales people can curse each
other until hell freezes over, and nobody thinks about *improving* the
situation at his shop.)

> In
> fact, it seems to "prove" that all research projects are inferior, and
> therefore invalid, because they're not focused on generating revenue,
> but on developing technically-superior solutions. But research is very
> valuable. It leads to new generations of revenue-producing products.

Yes. But don't expect companies to do much research other than research
resulting in immediate improvements of a product. This company research
can even be harmful to public welfare; I remember having read that the
tobacco companies did something with the acidity of the smoke of their
"light" cigarettes to make them more addictive. I was not surprised to
read about this - it's the sort of thing companies do to improve their
income.
This tendency for egoistical acts is a very common trait in capitalistic
companies (and I think in any other organized endeavour). The only
countermeasure are laws and a culture that puts guilt on such behaviour.
This doesn't totally prevent amoralic behaviour, but it helps.

Sorry, life ain't easy or nice... there were no promises when you
started life, or?

Regards,
Joachim
-- 
Please don't send unsolicited ads.






  reply	other threads:[~1997-09-16  0:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 112+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
1997-08-29  0:00 The great Java showcase (re: 2nd historic mistake) Ell
1997-08-29  0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-29  0:00   ` Jay Martin
1997-08-30  0:00   ` Patrick Doyle
1997-08-30  0:00     ` Jay Martin
1997-08-30  0:00   ` Joachim Durchholz
1997-09-01  0:00   ` Paul Johnson
1997-09-01  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-02  0:00       ` Veli-Pekka Nousiainen
1997-09-02  0:00       ` Martin Tom Brown
1997-09-02  0:00       ` Matthew S. Whiting
1997-09-03  0:00         ` Robert Munck
1997-09-05  0:00         ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-02  0:00       ` Jeff Kotula
1997-09-08  0:00       ` Richard A. O'Keefe
1997-09-13  0:00         ` Mark S. Hathaway
1997-09-16  0:00           ` Des  Kenny
1997-10-28  0:00           ` John English
1997-09-16  0:00         ` Des  Kenny
1997-09-16  0:00           ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-05  0:00     ` Darren New
1997-09-02  0:00   ` W. Wesley Groleau x4923
1997-09-05  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-05  0:00       ` happens too often to call it historic W. Wesley Groleau x4923
1997-09-15  0:00   ` The great Java showcase (re: 2nd historic mistake) Tim Ottinger
1997-09-16  0:00     ` Joachim Durchholz [this message]
1997-09-18  0:00       ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-16  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-29  0:00 ` Brett J. Stonier
1997-08-29  0:00 ` Jon S Anthony
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
1997-09-17  0:00 Ell
1997-09-17  0:00 Ell
1997-09-16  0:00 ` Mark Wilden
1997-09-17  0:00 ` Robert B. Love 
1997-09-17  0:00 ` Joachim Durchholz
1997-09-17  0:00 Ell
1997-09-15  0:00 Ell
1997-09-16  0:00 ` Tim Ottinger
1997-09-17  0:00 ` Doc
     [not found] <97090916235363@psavax.pwfl.com>
1997-09-11  0:00 ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-04  0:00 Marin David Condic, 561.796.8997, M/S 731-96
1997-08-30  0:00 BruceMount
1997-08-29  0:00 Ell
     [not found] <5tvvsj$lh2$1@news2.digex.net>
1997-08-27  0:00 ` Jeff Brown
1997-08-28  0:00   ` Patrick Doyle
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-27  0:00 ` W. Wesley Groleau x4923
1997-08-27  0:00   ` W. Wesley Groleau x4923
1997-08-28  0:00 ` Brett J. Stonier
1997-08-28  0:00   ` Jon S Anthony
1997-08-29  0:00     ` James P. White
1997-08-29  0:00   ` Paul Johnson
1997-08-29  0:00     ` Dennis Weldy
1997-08-29  0:00     ` Brett J. Stonier
     [not found]     ` <5u6ovi$5kb$1@news2.digex.net>
1997-09-01  0:00       ` Paul Johnson
1997-08-25  0:00 Bertrand Meyer
1997-08-26  0:00 ` BruceMount
     [not found]   ` <5u0nil$atg@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU>
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Richard A. O'Keefe
     [not found]       ` <5u3o1n$hu5@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU>
1997-08-28  0:00         ` Nick Leaton
1997-09-15  0:00       ` Tim Ottinger
1997-09-16  0:00         ` W. Wesley Groleau x4923
1997-08-28  0:00     ` not
1997-08-28  0:00   ` Brett J. Stonier
     [not found]     ` <JSA.97Aug28182029@alexandria.organon.com>
     [not found]       ` <3406C150.3EE5EE0E@stratasys.com>
1997-08-29  0:00         ` Jon S Anthony
1997-08-29  0:00           ` Jay Martin
1997-08-29  0:00             ` Jon S Anthony
1997-09-02  0:00             ` W. Wesley Groleau x4923
1997-09-15  0:00       ` Tim Ottinger
1997-08-26  0:00 ` Flavius.Vespasianus
     [not found] ` <JSA.97Aug26153546@alexandria.organon.com>
     [not found]   ` <34034658.7DE14518@eiffel.com>
1997-08-27  0:00     ` Jon S Anthony
1997-08-27  0:00 ` James P. White
1997-08-27  0:00   ` Robert Dewar
     [not found]   ` <34047A7D.62319AC4@eiffel.com>
1997-08-27  0:00     ` Bertrand Meyer
1997-08-27  0:00       ` Matthew S. Whiting
1997-08-28  0:00         ` Flavius.Vespasianus
1997-08-28  0:00       ` Mike Coffin
1997-08-29  0:00         ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-30  0:00           ` James P. White
1997-08-31  0:00           ` Jon S Anthony
1997-08-28  0:00       ` James P. White
1997-08-29  0:00       ` Dennis Weldy
1997-09-03  0:00         ` Charles Ditzel
     [not found]   ` <01bcb38a$8ddc1200$1c10d30a@ntwneil>
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-28  0:00       ` James P. White
1997-08-30  0:00         ` Bert Bril
1997-08-31  0:00           ` Jay Martin
1997-08-29  0:00       ` Lee Webber
     [not found]       ` <EFn8CI.D9p@ecf.toronto.edu>
1997-08-29  0:00         ` Peter Hermann
1997-08-29  0:00         ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-30  0:00           ` Patrick Doyle
1997-08-31  0:00           ` Jon S Anthony
1997-09-01  0:00             ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-02  0:00               ` Jon S Anthony
1997-09-05  0:00                 ` Robert Dewar
1997-09-06  0:00                   ` Jon S Anthony
1997-08-29  0:00         ` Laurent Guerby
     [not found]           ` <EFonoz.AFC@ecf.toronto.edu>
1997-08-29  0:00             ` Samuel Mize
1997-08-29  0:00         ` Arthur Nelson
1997-08-29  0:00           ` Patrick Doyle
1997-09-01  0:00             ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-29  0:00       ` Mike Charlton
     [not found]         ` <N.19970829.uput@sisyphus.demon.co.uk>
1997-09-02  0:00           ` Mike Charlton
1997-09-03  0:00             ` Dave Sparks
1997-08-28  0:00     ` James P. White
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-29  0:00       ` Lee Webber
     [not found] ` <3402FD4D.C196785B@brightwood.com>
1997-08-27  0:00   ` Patrick Doyle
1997-08-28  0:00   ` Paul Johnson
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Brett J. Stonier
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Robert Dewar
1997-08-29  0:00       ` Paul Johnson
1997-08-28  0:00     ` Jeff Brown
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