Re: Ada Development Environments

Re: Ada Development Environments

[noc.near.net!inmet!inmet!ryer]

>/* Written 10:42 am  Sep 15, 1992 by M19481@mwvm.mitre.org 
>/* ---------- "Ada Development Environments" ---------- */
>I am trying to find information about Ada Development Environments.  If you
>know of any other than Rational (which I am already investigating), I would
>appreciate a lead.  Thanks...
> 
>David Hite - dhite@mitre.org

Is this a comercial for Rational?

Most every Ada compiler vendor and computer manufacturer markets an "Ada 
Development Environment".  There are many CASE vendors and government
agencies with ADE's too.

I'd say that Rational has the only commercial "Rational-like" Ada Development
Environment, at present.  There are several government/university programs
to build comparable systems.  

Rational-like is not a precise term, though it is certainly in parlance in
the Ada Development Environments biz.

I'd be interested in Mr. Hite's, and anyone else's, comments on what
makes an ada development environment an Ada Development Environment.
Is it:

- Lack of visible boundaries among compiling, editing, browsing, and 
library management tools?
- 

Ada development environments

[Bruce Petrick]

Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?

Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?

Re: Ada development environments

[Jerry Petrey]

Bruce Petrick wrote:
> 
> Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?
> 
> Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
> Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?

I doubt it.  They are introducing Apex 4.0 very shortly.  I just
attended
a Rational web seminar where they showed their plans for the new 4.0
releases
continuing into next year.  Apex is one of their major products - I'm
sure
it will be around for quite some time.  It is a pleasure to use, I might
add.

Jerry 

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Jerry Petrey                                                
-- Senior Principal Systems Engineer - Member Team Ada & Team Forth
-- Raytheon Missile Systems 
-- NOTE: please remove NOSPAM in email address to reply                  
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Ada development environments

[Ada2001]

In article <39BD3696.797AFE23@west.raytheon.com>,
  Jerry Petrey <jdpetreyNOSPAM@west.raytheon.com> wrote:
>
>
> Bruce Petrick wrote:
> >
> > Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?
> >
> > Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
> > Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?
>
> I doubt it.  They are introducing Apex 4.0 very shortly.  I just
> attended
> a Rational web seminar where they showed their plans for the new 4.0
> releases
> continuing into next year.  Apex is one of their major products - I'm
> sure
> it will be around for quite some time.  It is a pleasure to use, I
might
> add.

I agree that Apex on a Unix host is a *VERY* capable development
environment.  I like it very much.  However Rational's Apex for Windows
NT uses a very different Interactive Development Environment (IDE); it
seems to have been developed by a group that had never really used Apex
on Unix. Even the latest release (3.2.0b patch 2) is deficient in many
ways relative to Apex Unix.  I hope the 4.0 release of Apex NT will be
better.

I don't think that Rational will stop supporting or selling Apex but
(judging by their Web site) they are certainly more focused on other
product lines now. Maybe they should spin off their Ada products into a
separate company.  They could call it Verdix :-)


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Re: Ada development environments

[John McCabe]

Ada2001 <ada2001@my-deja.com> wrote:

>In article <39BD3696.797AFE23@west.raytheon.com>,
>  Jerry Petrey <jdpetreyNOSPAM@west.raytheon.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Bruce Petrick wrote:
>> >
>> > Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?
>> >
>> > Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
>> > Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?
>>
>> I doubt it.  They are introducing Apex 4.0 very shortly.  I just
>> attended
>> a Rational web seminar where they showed their plans for the new 4.0
>> releases
>> continuing into next year.  Apex is one of their major products - I'm
>> sure
>> it will be around for quite some time.  It is a pleasure to use, I
>might
>> add.

>I agree that Apex on a Unix host is a *VERY* capable development
>environment.  I like it very much.  However Rational's Apex for Windows
>NT uses a very different Interactive Development Environment (IDE); it
>seems to have been developed by a group that had never really used Apex
>on Unix. Even the latest release (3.2.0b patch 2) is deficient in many
>ways relative to Apex Unix.  I hope the 4.0 release of Apex NT will be
>better.

In case anyone isn't aware, it would appear that Rational's Rose
product (at least version 98i) for Unix (Solaris) actually uses a
Windows subsystem emulator to produce a GUI that is pretty much
identical to the NT version, so it would seem reasonable to assume
that, for Rose at least, they will be using the NT version as a
baseline. (Correct me if I'm wrong obviously :-)

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that is the way they will be going
with Apex.


PS - If you get a new release of Apex, check out whether the bug
related to the discriminant of a private extension is corrected:

type X (Disc : <sometype>) is tagged record with
   :
   :
end record;

type Y (Disc : <sometype>) is new X (Disc) with private;

(I think this is the basis of it) This is illegal but is compiled
without error on (what I believe is) the current version of Apex.
Unfortunately it is also a bug in Rose because Rose generates code
that matches this :-(

Best Regards
John McCabe <john@assen.demon.co.uk>

Re: Ada development environments

[Simon Wright]

john@assen.demon.co.uk.nospam (John McCabe) writes:

> PS - If you get a new release of Apex, check out whether the bug
> related to the discriminant of a private extension is corrected:
> 
> type X (Disc : <sometype>) is tagged record with
>    :
>    :
> end record;
> 
> type Y (Disc : <sometype>) is new X (Disc) with private;
> 
> (I think this is the basis of it) This is illegal but is compiled
> without error on (what I believe is) the current version of Apex.
> Unfortunately it is also a bug in Rose because Rose generates code
> that matches this :-(

ObjectAda 7.2 accepts this too:

package Mccabe is
  type X (D : Boolean) is tagged null record;
  type Y (D : Boolean) is new X (D) with private;
private
  type Y (D : Boolean) is new X (D) with null record;
end Mccabe;

(hope you don't mind my taking your name in vain)

whereas GNAT 3.13p says

mccabe.ads:3:31: Only static constraints allowed for parent discriminants in the partial view

A look at the AARM tells me I'm going to find this tough. Is there a
plain-language discussion? (eg, a hint on how I can achieve the intent
of the above) I failed to find anything via deja ..

-- 
Simon Wright                         Email: simon.j.wright@amsjv.com
Alenia Marconi Systems                     Voice: +44(0)23 9270 1778
Integrated Systems Division                  FAX: +44(0)23 9270 1800

Re: Ada development environments

[Lionel Draghi]

John McCabe wrote:

> In case anyone isn't aware, it would appear that Rational's Rose
> product (at least version 98i) for Unix (Solaris) actually uses a
> Windows subsystem emulator to produce a GUI that is pretty much
> identical to the NT version, so it would seem reasonable to assume
> that, for Rose at least, they will be using the NT version as a
> baseline. (Correct me if I'm wrong obviously :-)
>
> I wouldn't be at all surprised if that is the way they will be going
> with Apex.

This emulator makes Rose really slow on Unix platform (it can't compare
with NT). I hope for Apex users that Rational has done a different design
choice than for Rose :-)


________________________________________________________________________
Lionel Draghi                                 http://www.Ada-France.org/

Re: Ada development environments

[Chris Miller]

> I agree that Apex on a Unix host is a *VERY* capable development
> environment.  I like it very much.

So do I.

Rational though seem to have a problem in that there is no low cost entry
point for their product.

Hence more and more new developments are being done with Gnat. This becomes
self reinforcing.

Seems like a repeat of the DOS (cheap) vs VMS (technically brilliant)
situation a decade or so ago. Dos won.

Chris Miller

Re: Ada development environments

[Ada2001]

In article <39BD1FB6.1684694D@trw.com>,

> Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
> Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?

See http://adaic.org/docs/flyers/comp-tool.html and
    http://www.adaic.org/compilers/


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

Re: Ada development environments

[Greg Bek]

Bruce Petrick wrote in message <39BD1FB6.1684694D@trw.com>...
>Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?
>
>Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
>Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?
>
>

As one of the product managers for Rational Apex I can state
categorically that Rational have no plans to stop supporting
Apex.

As someone else pointed out, we will soon be introducing
version 4.0 of Apex. Which will continue our commitment to
providing the best Ada development environment with the
highest performance compiler available.

Rational is in the process of make end-of-life a number of
the VADS family variants.   For most of these variants
there is an equivalent variant of Apex available, although some
are on platforms that are no longer mainstream.

If you have questions about any of these issues, please work
with your local Rational account team, or feel free to contact
either my self (Greg Bek gab@rational.com) for questions
about Apex native and core environment issues or Eddie Glenn
(cav@rational.com) for Apex embedded variants.

Thanks,
Greg

Re: Ada development environments

[Michael S. Simpson]

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Maybe I'm wrong, but APEX is just a software configuration management
tool.  You have to buy the Ada compiler seperately, or you can buy APEX
Ada (two products bundled together).  You can also use APEX with
C++/C/JAVA.

Mike Simpson
speaking for myself only.

Bruce Petrick wrote:
> 
> Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?
> 
> Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
> Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?

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Re: Ada development environments

[Jerry Petrey]

"Michael S. Simpson" wrote:
> 
> Maybe I'm wrong, but APEX is just a software configuration management
> tool.  You have to buy the Ada compiler seperately, or you can buy APEX
> Ada (two products bundled together).  You can also use APEX with
> C++/C/JAVA.
> 
> Mike Simpson
> speaking for myself only.
> 
> Bruce Petrick wrote:
> >
> > Any truth to the rumors that Rational may stop supporting Apex?
> >
> > Does anyone know where to find a "current" list of vendors of
> > Ada95 development environments (for Sun Sparc)?


Rational APEX is an Integrated Development Environment for Ada (also C,
C++ and
Java).  It includes the native host compiler, CM tool (currently SUMMIT
- ver 4.0
will support CLEARCASE as well), editor, linker, various analysis tools,
etc.
You may be able to buy only pieces of it but it is normally used as a
complete IDE.
There are options such as the RCI to allow cross compiling for a target
that may
even be some other company's compiler. 
Unfortunately many companies (including mine) spend the considerable
amount it cost 
and then don't fully utilize its capabilities.

Jerry

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Jerry Petrey                                                
-- Senior Principal Systems Engineer - Member Team Ada & Team Forth
-- Raytheon Missile Systems 
-- NOTE: please remove NOSPAM in email address to reply                  
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Ada Development Environments

[munnari.oz.au!manuel!sserve!ccadfa.cc.adfa.oz.au!tomw]

US DoD have issued a RFP asking for an integrated CASE system for 
Ada development. This should produce some interesting results.

Re: Ada Development Environments

[agate!spool.mu.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohi]

Anyone seriously interested in Ada development environments (or in Ada
Development Environments) should surely attend TRI-Ada in Orlando FL
November 16-20.  Probably all and surely most vendors of such products
will be exhibiting their wares, and you can see what is available and
what it looks like, pick up lots of literature, and get on the vendors'
mailing lists.

Art Evans
----------------------------------------------
Arthur Evans, Jr, PhD           Ada Consultant
461 Fairview Road
Pittsburgh PA  15238-1933
412-963-0839
ae@sei.cmu.edu

Re: Ada Development Environments

[cis.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!c]

>>/* ---------- "Ada Development Environments" ---------- */
>>I am trying to find information about Ada Development Environments.  If you
>>know of any other than Rational (which I am already investigating), I would
>>appreciate a lead.  Thanks...
>>
>>David Hite - dhite@mitre.org
>
>Is this a comercial for Rational?
 
Nope, it's a genuine question.  It just happens that Rational is the only
I knew about, and I didn't want people wasting their time pointing me to it.
 
>I'd be interested in Mr. Hite's, and anyone else's, comments on what
>makes an ada development environment an Ada Development Environment.
>Is it:
>
>- Lack of visible boundaries among compiling, editing, browsing, and
>library management tools?
>-
 
Yes, and I guess I would add to that the ability to do automatic code
generation, CASE tools, and the ability to import existing code for use by all
the tools.
 
David - dhite@mitre.org

Re: Ada Development Environments

[Magnus Lindgren]

M19481@mwvm.mitre.org writes:
: I am trying to find information about Ada Development Environments.  If you
: know of any other than Rational (which I am already investigating), I would
: appreciate a lead.  Thanks...
:  
: David Hite - dhite@mitre.org


How about RISCAda from Telesoft Inc. currently running on Sun SPARCstations?
It's been a while since I had contact with this environment but is seems
good to me. (Hey, I did part of it!!! I'm not biased at all)

I don't know what other machines or targets it supports but contact the
people at Telesoft and find out.

Contact:	Phillipe Collard
		RISCAda Marketing Director (or something like that)
		(619) 457-2700



Magnus Lindgren        		Phone:    +46 920 75425
Telia Research			Telefax:  +46 920 75490
Aurorum 6			E-mail:   jml@lulea.trab.se
S-951 75 Lulea, Sweden	

Ada Development Environments

[agate!linus!linus.mitre.org!mwvm.mitre.org!M19481]

I am trying to find information about Ada Development Environments.  If you
know of any other than Rational (which I am already investigating), I would
appreciate a lead.  Thanks...
 
David Hite - dhite@mitre.org