* Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? @ 2005-01-11 23:33 William J. Thomas 2005-01-11 23:48 ` Mark Lorenzen ` (3 more replies) 0 siblings, 4 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: William J. Thomas @ 2005-01-11 23:33 UTC (permalink / raw) What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now? It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by feeding them free dope and then start bleeding them. What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K, please!!!! Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. William J. Thomas ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-11 23:33 Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? William J. Thomas @ 2005-01-11 23:48 ` Mark Lorenzen 2005-01-12 0:05 ` William J. Thomas 2005-01-12 8:40 ` Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? Pascal Obry ` (2 subsequent siblings) 3 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Mark Lorenzen @ 2005-01-11 23:48 UTC (permalink / raw) "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now? > > It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by feeding > them free dope and then start bleeding them. > > What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K, > please!!!! > > Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. > > William J. Thomas What's wrong with gcc 3.4.3? - Mark Lorenzen ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-11 23:48 ` Mark Lorenzen @ 2005-01-12 0:05 ` William J. Thomas 2005-01-12 1:33 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) israel t 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: William J. Thomas @ 2005-01-12 0:05 UTC (permalink / raw) Is GCC 3.4.3 the new GNAT? In other words what is it and where do you download it from? "Mark Lorenzen" <mark.lorenzen@ofir.dk> wrote in message news:m3d5wbil25.fsf@0x53589c0c.boanxx18.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk... > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? >> >> ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now? >> >> It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by >> feeding >> them free dope and then start bleeding them. >> >> What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K, >> please!!!! >> >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. >> >> William J. Thomas > > What's wrong with gcc 3.4.3? > > - Mark Lorenzen ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) 2005-01-12 0:05 ` William J. Thomas @ 2005-01-12 1:33 ` israel t 2005-01-12 4:32 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something Larry Kilgallen 2005-01-13 17:24 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) Martin Krischik 0 siblings, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: israel t @ 2005-01-12 1:33 UTC (permalink / raw) "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > Is GCC 3.4.3 the new GNAT? > In other words what is it "GCC, the GNU Compiler Collection, includes front ends for C, C++, Objective-C, Fortran, Java, and Ada, as well as libraries for these languages (libstdc++, libgcj,...). " > and where do you > download it from? The usual places...... :-) Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install it for you. If you are on redhat download the rpm Otherwise download and compile the tarball. If all else fails go to: http://www.gnu.org/software/gcc/gcc.html ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something 2005-01-12 1:33 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) israel t @ 2005-01-12 4:32 ` Larry Kilgallen 2005-01-12 4:58 ` Bobby D. Bryant 2005-01-12 6:13 ` israel t 2005-01-13 17:24 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) Martin Krischik 1 sibling, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Larry Kilgallen @ 2005-01-12 4:32 UTC (permalink / raw) In article <87k6qjqvhq.fsf_-_@kafka.homenet>, israel t <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes: > Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install > it for you. You might want to mention the operating system to which that instruction pertains, because I am fairly certain it is not VMS. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something 2005-01-12 4:32 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something Larry Kilgallen @ 2005-01-12 4:58 ` Bobby D. Bryant 2005-01-12 6:13 ` israel t 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Bobby D. Bryant @ 2005-01-12 4:58 UTC (permalink / raw) On Wed, 12 Jan 2005, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote: > In article <87k6qjqvhq.fsf_-_@kafka.homenet>, israel t <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes: > >> Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install >> it for you. > > You might want to mention the operating system to which that instruction > pertains, because I am fairly certain it is not VMS. Gentoo is a Linux distribution. -- Bobby Bryant Austin, Texas ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something 2005-01-12 4:32 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something Larry Kilgallen 2005-01-12 4:58 ` Bobby D. Bryant @ 2005-01-12 6:13 ` israel t 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: israel t @ 2005-01-12 6:13 UTC (permalink / raw) Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: > In article <87k6qjqvhq.fsf_-_@kafka.homenet>, israel t <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes: > >> Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install >> it for you. > > You might want to mention the operating system to which that instruction > pertains, because I am fairly certain it is not VMS. Gentoo is a linux distribution. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) 2005-01-12 1:33 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) israel t 2005-01-12 4:32 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something Larry Kilgallen @ 2005-01-13 17:24 ` Martin Krischik 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-13 17:24 UTC (permalink / raw) To: israel t <verï¿œffentlicht & per Mail versendet> israel t wrote: > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > >> Is GCC 3.4.3 the new GNAT? >> In other words what is it > > > "GCC, the GNU Compiler Collection, includes front ends for C, C++, > Objective-C, Fortran, Java, and Ada, as well as libraries for these > languages (libstdc++, libgcj,...). " > >> and where do you >> download it from? > > The usual places...... :-) > > Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download > , compile and install it for you. Could you add gentoo to http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming:Ada:Installing just hit the edit button and write a few words about the gentoo release > If you are on redhat download the rpm > Otherwise download and compile the tarball. > > If all else fails go to: > http://www.gnu.org/software/gcc/gcc.html -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-11 23:33 Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? William J. Thomas 2005-01-11 23:48 ` Mark Lorenzen @ 2005-01-12 8:40 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-12 10:18 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-12 22:20 ` William J. Thomas 2005-01-13 17:17 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 16:37 ` Nick Roberts 3 siblings, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-12 8:40 UTC (permalink / raw) "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? > Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. See the GCC project. Pascal. -- --|------------------------------------------------------ --| Pascal Obry Team-Ada Member --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE --|------------------------------------------------------ --| http://www.obry.org --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination" --| --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 8:40 ` Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-12 10:18 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-12 14:52 ` Manuel Collado 2005-01-12 17:22 ` Luke A. Guest 2005-01-12 22:20 ` William J. Thomas 1 sibling, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-12 10:18 UTC (permalink / raw) Pascal Obry wrote: > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? > >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. > > See the GCC project. I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably for Windows) - as am I! :-) I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want to use the thing... Cheers -- Martin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 10:18 ` Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-12 14:52 ` Manuel Collado 2005-01-13 17:26 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-12 17:22 ` Luke A. Guest 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Manuel Collado @ 2005-01-12 14:52 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Dowie wrote: > Pascal Obry wrote: > >>"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: >> >>>What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? >> >>Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? >> >>>Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. >> >>See the GCC project. > > I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably > for Windows) - as am I! :-) > > I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want to > use the thing... So: Cygwin (for Windows) - http://cygwin.com/ - includes gcc-ada 3.3.1 Mingw (for Windows) - http://www.mingw.org/ - includes gcc-ada 3.4.2 DJGPP (for DOS/Windows) - http://www.delorie.com/djgpp/ - includes gcc-ada 3.4.3 All these distributions include binaries, sources and documentation. -- To reply by e-mail, please remove the extra dot in the given address: m.collado -> mcollado ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 14:52 ` Manuel Collado @ 2005-01-13 17:26 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 16:02 ` Manuel Collado 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-13 17:26 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Manuel Collado <verï¿œffentlicht & per Mail versendet> Manuel Collado wrote: > Martin Dowie wrote: > >> Pascal Obry wrote: >> >>>"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: >>> >>>>What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? >>> >>>Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? >>> >>>>Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. >>> >>>See the GCC project. >> >> I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and >> probably for Windows) - as am I! :-) >> >> I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want >> to use the thing... > > So: > > Cygwin (for Windows) - http://cygwin.com/ - includes gcc-ada 3.3.1 > > Mingw (for Windows) - http://www.mingw.org/ - includes gcc-ada 3.4.2 > > DJGPP (for DOS/Windows) - http://www.delorie.com/djgpp/ - includes > gcc-ada 3.4.3 Could you add DJGPP to http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming:Ada:Installing just hit the edit button and write a few words about it. > All these distributions include binaries, sources and documentation. > -- > To reply by e-mail, please remove the extra dot > in the given address: m.collado -> mcollado Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 17:26 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 16:02 ` Manuel Collado 0 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Manuel Collado @ 2005-01-14 16:02 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Krischik wrote: > Manuel Collado wrote: > ... >>DJGPP (for DOS/Windows) - http://www.delorie.com/djgpp/ - includes >>gcc-ada 3.4.3 > > Could you add DJGPP to > > http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming:Ada:Installing > > just hit the edit button and write a few words about it. Done. -- To reply by e-mail, please remove the extra dot in the given address: m.collado -> mcollado ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 10:18 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-12 14:52 ` Manuel Collado @ 2005-01-12 17:22 ` Luke A. Guest 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Luke A. Guest @ 2005-01-12 17:22 UTC (permalink / raw) On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:18:32 +0000, Martin Dowie wrote: > Pascal Obry wrote: >> "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: >> >>> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? >> >> Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? >> >>> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. >> >> See the GCC project. > > I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably > for Windows) - as am I! :-) > The state of GNAT for Win32 is better than the same for Linux. Mingw32 doesn't build on Linux, so cross compiler are out of the window, but it does build on Win32, and it includes the tools that aren't included in the equivalent GNAT under Linux, e.g. gnatmem, gnatprep. Luke. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 8:40 ` Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? Pascal Obry 2005-01-12 10:18 ` Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-12 22:20 ` William J. Thomas 2005-01-13 18:23 ` Pascal Obry 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: William J. Thomas @ 2005-01-12 22:20 UTC (permalink / raw) "Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message news:uwtujqbtw.fsf@obry.net... > > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? I've been doing what I've been doing since 1983, developing systems in Ada. The thing is I develop them for companies that don't have to compile their compilers, they buy them, for lots of money :) >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. > > See the GCC project. > > Pascal. > > -- > > --|------------------------------------------------------ > --| Pascal Obry Team-Ada Member > --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE > --|------------------------------------------------------ > --| http://www.obry.org > --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination" > --| > --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 22:20 ` William J. Thomas @ 2005-01-13 18:23 ` Pascal Obry 0 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-13 18:23 UTC (permalink / raw) "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > "Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message > news:uwtujqbtw.fsf@obry.net... > > > > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > > > >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > > > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? > > I've been doing what I've been doing since 1983, developing systems in Ada. > The thing is I develop them for companies that don't have to compile their > compilers, they buy them, for lots of money :) No problem, but in this case do not step in sayings "What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?" It is there, period. Maybe you should ask something like: Where can I download an Ada compiler for my system ? Your sentence above seemed to imply that something was really wrong :) Pascal. -- --|------------------------------------------------------ --| Pascal Obry Team-Ada Member --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE --|------------------------------------------------------ --| http://www.obry.org --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination" --| --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-11 23:33 Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? William J. Thomas 2005-01-11 23:48 ` Mark Lorenzen 2005-01-12 8:40 ` Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-13 17:17 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 16:37 ` Nick Roberts 3 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-13 17:17 UTC (permalink / raw) William J. Thomas wrote: > What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now? > > It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by > feeding them free dope and then start bleeding them. > > What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K, > please!!!! Last time I asked there was ony a 5 developer licences. Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-11 23:33 Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? William J. Thomas ` (2 preceding siblings ...) 2005-01-13 17:17 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 16:37 ` Nick Roberts 3 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Nick Roberts @ 2005-01-15 16:37 UTC (permalink / raw) "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> wrote: > What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > ... I am writing a new Ada compiler, called ECLAT, that will be released under the GPL. It will initially target the AdaOS native format (NEAI), but I hope to get around to making it target COFF at some point. But don't hold your breath; I'm afraid it will probably be many years before ECLAT is working. -- Nick Roberts ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? @ 2005-01-12 18:10 Robert C. Leif 2005-01-12 21:42 ` Bernd Specht 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Robert C. Leif @ 2005-01-12 18:10 UTC (permalink / raw) To: Comp. Lang. Ada Martin Dowie wrote. "I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want to use the thing..." As I stated before, I also wish to just use GNAT. Of greater significance, how will people new to Ada use GNAT without a simple way to download it? Does anything in the Ada Core license prevent any of the Ada experts from setting up a site to download the latest public version of GNAT? My suggestion is for one of the author's of an Ada textbook to have the latest free version of GNAT located at the same site as his or her book. We also have the problem that A# depends on GNAT. Bob Leif ---------------------------------------- Message: 2 Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:18:32 -0000 From: "Martin Dowie" <martin.dowie@baesystems.com> Subject: Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? To: comp.lang.ada@ada-france.org Message-ID: <41e4f7ef$1_1@baen1673807.greenlnk.net> Pascal Obry wrote: > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? > >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. > > See the GCC project. I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably for Windows) - as am I! :-) I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want to use the thing... Cheers -- Martin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 18:10 Robert C. Leif @ 2005-01-12 21:42 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 0:20 ` Jerry Petrey ` (2 more replies) 0 siblings, 3 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-12 21:42 UTC (permalink / raw) > Pascal Obry wrote: > > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes: > > > >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler? > > > > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ??? > > > >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust. > > > > See the GCC project. > > I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and > probably > for Windows) - as am I! :-) > > I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just > want > to use the thing... > > Cheers > > -- Martin > > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the sources", "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... (bla bla) And if you state that you work (e.g.) with C because there is no Ada compiler for your environmemt, then you get only replies "you are very stupid *not* to use Ada ..." (ha ha). Ada community seems full of advocats, but technicians are missing. Those wise guys always stating that you have to read thousands of documents and working years on things you are not interessted in, then build your own toolchains, are responsible for decreasing Ada-use. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 21:42 ` Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-13 0:20 ` Jerry Petrey 2005-01-13 10:46 ` Georg Bauhaus 2005-01-13 6:48 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-13 18:25 ` Pascal Obry 2 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Jerry Petrey @ 2005-01-13 0:20 UTC (permalink / raw) Bernd Specht wrote: > > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If > you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the sources", > "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... (bla bla) > > And if you state that you work (e.g.) with C because there is no Ada > compiler for your environmemt, then you get only replies "you are very > stupid *not* to use Ada ..." (ha ha). > > Ada community seems full of advocats, but technicians are missing. > > Those wise guys always stating that you have to read thousands of documents > and working years on things you are not interessted in, then build your own > toolchains, are responsible for decreasing Ada-use. Bernd, I�m afraid you are right. I think Ada is the best language for most applications today except for the lack of support and tools. I have been using it exclusively for the last 15 years and have been fortunate to find good paying jobs using it but the handwriting is definitely on the wall for this to come to an end. We have enough big programs at Raytheon using Ada to keep me busy until I retire in a few years but none of our new programs will even consider using Ada. Most of our new engineers either have never heard of it or consider it a relic from the past and want nothing to do with it. Like some of the other posters said � when you�re looking for a compiler for a certain language, you want to have some complete, well supported and easy to use choices � not have to build them yourself. GNAT was at least close to what was needed but ACT seems to have abandoned the public releases � which means even fewer new users will have an easily obtained, modern Ada compiler to try out and thus even fewer applications will use Ada. If the Ada vendors can�t make good, reasonably priced Ada toolsets available to individual engineers, where do they think their future customers are going to come from? I think the suggestion for some GNAT Pro users to make the latest release available would be step in the right direction but a lot of work is needed if we are going to save Ada. I saw the same thing happen to Forth, which I liked and used back in the 80�s. Jerry --------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Jerry Petrey - Senior Principal Systems Engineer -- Navigation (GPS/INS), Guidance, & Control -- Raytheon Missile Systems - Member Team Ada & Team Forth -- NOTE: please perform appendectomy on email address before replying --------------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 0:20 ` Jerry Petrey @ 2005-01-13 10:46 ` Georg Bauhaus 2005-01-13 19:51 ` Bernd Specht 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Georg Bauhaus @ 2005-01-13 10:46 UTC (permalink / raw) Jerry Petrey <jdpetreyAPPENDIX@raytheon.com> wrote: : : : Bernd Specht wrote: : :> Ada community seems full of advocats, but technicians are missing. Where would you place them when it comes to making the decision which compiler to supply for a hardware offering? :> Those wise guys always stating that you have to read thousands of documents :> and working years on things you are not interessted in, then build your own :> toolchains, are responsible for decreasing Ada-use. : I?m afraid you are right. I think Ada is the best language for most : applications today except for the lack of support and tools. I have been using : it exclusively for the last 15 years and have been fortunate to find good : paying jobs using it but the handwriting is definitely on the wall for this to : come to an end. We have enough big programs at Raytheon using Ada to keep me : busy until I retire in a few years but none of our new programs will even : consider using Ada. Most of our new engineers either have never heard of it or : consider it a relic from the past and want nothing to do with it. Like some of : the other posters said ? when you?re looking for a compiler for a certain : language, you want to have some complete, well supported and easy to use : choices ? not have to build them yourself. AFAICT, GPS is well supported, and part of the delivery in the academic program that has started recently. The situation with SPARK is similar, I believe. ObjectAda is supported as well, at various levels. I don't think that Ada's public visibility has a lot to do with supported toolsets. (Seems like there are similar stories of regret about Eiffel (and other languages). You can get a sufficiently impressive IDE for Eifel, you can get integration with the numerically most popular IDE on the numerically most popular OS. You get all this for free. Still...) You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which could be considered less popular :-) Like: "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005". There have been rumors that Ada for .NET is being interated into Visual Studio. Aonix is apparently integrating their compiler with Eclipse. Will this change anything? A recent discussion somewhere else that insisted on C-like syntax for language design makes me think otherwise. For example, if I look at the language D (available from digitalmars.com), I feel very much at home because almost all of the language D is already available in Ada. OTOH, all the programmers preferring curly braces appear to feel at home as well, because of the curly braces, and because of the cool new features they hadn't known before. No need for them to "go back" to languages of the past, no need to consider whether the pals will still like them if they did "go back" ;-) -- Georg ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 10:46 ` Georg Bauhaus @ 2005-01-13 19:51 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-14 9:40 ` Martin Krischik 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-13 19:51 UTC (permalink / raw) Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de: > You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write > a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which > could be considered less popular :-) Like: > "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005". Georg, this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be done", but - nobody *does*! I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must do ...", but never found one who *did*. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 19:51 ` Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-14 9:40 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 12:46 ` Jeff C 2005-01-15 21:41 ` Bernd Specht 0 siblings, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 9:40 UTC (permalink / raw) Bernd Specht wrote: > Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in > news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de: > >> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write >> a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which >> could be considered less popular :-) Like: >> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005". > > Georg, > > this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be done", > but - nobody *does*! > > I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must do > ...", but never found one who *did*. You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am doing! And I don't think you want me to either, do you? Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 9:40 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 12:46 ` Jeff C 2005-01-14 14:47 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 21:47 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-15 21:41 ` Bernd Specht 1 sibling, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Jeff C @ 2005-01-14 12:46 UTC (permalink / raw) "Martin Krischik" <martin@krischik.com> wrote in message news:4244894.mjszBdT2aV@linux1.krischik.com... > Bernd Specht wrote: > >> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in >> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de: >> >>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write >>> a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which >>> could be considered less popular :-) Like: >>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005". >> >> Georg, >> >> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be >> done", >> but - nobody *does*! >> >> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must do >> ...", but never found one who *did*. > > You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside > (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am > doing! > And I don't think you want me to either, do you? > > Martin > > -- > mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net > http://www.ada.krischik.com Now, now.. We don't want actual facts to cloud his argument. Isn't it better to just make unsubstantiated silly claims. I'll try one so we can all get the hang of it.... You know the problem with C programmers is they get so discouraged hunting down all the bugs in their programs that they give up for hours on end and go read newsgroups for languages that they can only dream about being smart enough to use. After all the nice thing about C is that if you fall asleep on the keyboard you are likely to create a program that compiles for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2); I have figured out one thing that I know "must be done" that I have not actually done yet and that is to add a new entry to my kill/ignore file in my newsreader. Of course the worst thing about this thread is that it proves that even after all of these years I still can't help but feed the trolls.. They are just so cute and cuddly. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 12:46 ` Jeff C @ 2005-01-14 14:47 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 23:10 ` Keith Thompson 2005-01-15 4:09 ` Steve 2005-01-15 21:47 ` Bernd Specht 1 sibling, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 14:47 UTC (permalink / raw) Jeff C wrote: > for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2); ;-) Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() does not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return value at all - but it must exist somewhere. Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 14:47 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 23:10 ` Keith Thompson 2005-01-15 12:14 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 4:09 ` Steve 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Keith Thompson @ 2005-01-14 23:10 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> writes: > Jeff C wrote: > > >> for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2); > > ;-) > > Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() does > not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return value at > all - but it must exist somewhere. It won't compile at all; it has two syntax errors. "R-" should be "R--", and "e-" should be "e--". It still won't compile without appropriate declarations for R, e, C, and U -- and in C99 it's illegal without a function declarations for P. -- Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst> San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst> We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 23:10 ` Keith Thompson @ 2005-01-15 12:14 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-16 10:41 ` Adrien Plisson 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 12:14 UTC (permalink / raw) Keith Thompson wrote: > Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> writes: >> Jeff C wrote: >> >> >>> for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2); >> >> ;-) >> >> Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() >> does not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return >> value at all - but it must exist somewhere. > > It won't compile at all; it has two syntax errors. "R-" should be > "R--", and "e-" should be "e--". > > It still won't compile without appropriate declarations for R, e, C, > and U -- and in C99 it's illegal without a function declarations for P. If only there was any C99 compiler. We have 2005 - name me one fully compliant C99 compiler! Actualy: Name me one company which is *truely* (no vaporware) commited to provide a C99 compiler! AFAIK only the Free Software Fondation is *truely* commited to provide a C99 compiler - but they are no where close. With Regards Martin PS: Maybe I should cross post to comp.lang.c - not for a flame war - but because I would be actualy interested to know if where a C99 compiler somewhere out there. -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-15 12:14 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-16 10:41 ` Adrien Plisson 2005-01-16 11:23 ` Martin Krischik 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Adrien Plisson @ 2005-01-16 10:41 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Krischik wrote: > If only there was any C99 compiler. We have 2005 - name me one fully > compliant C99 compiler! isn't digitalmars supposed to be C99 compliant ? i know this compiler is way better standard compliant than many other commercial compilers, but i don't know how much of the standard it complies to. (for more information we may have a look at www.digitalmars.com) -- rien ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-16 10:41 ` Adrien Plisson @ 2005-01-16 11:23 ` Martin Krischik 0 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-16 11:23 UTC (permalink / raw) Adrien Plisson wrote: > Martin Krischik wrote: >> If only there was any C99 compiler. We have 2005 - name me one fully >> compliant C99 compiler! > > isn't digitalmars supposed to be C99 compliant ? At least they have static and type-qualifier-list now supported for array dimension per C99 6.7.5.2. where gcc is still struggeling. I don't know where the problem is: Ada and ISO-Pascal have got that feature for decades now. > i know this compiler is way better standard compliant than many other > commercial compilers, but i don't know how much of the standard it > complies to. They unimlemented feature lists are indeed very short: C: New struct member initializer syntax tgmath.h _Pragma C++: Distinction between dependent and non-dependent name lookup. Template template parameters. export keyword. Enums larger than an int. But still they are not nil. Could it be that the former "slim" langugages C and C++ have gone the way of PL/1: Become so complex that implemting the *full* standart is impossible? With Regards Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 14:47 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 23:10 ` Keith Thompson @ 2005-01-15 4:09 ` Steve 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Steve @ 2005-01-15 4:09 UTC (permalink / raw) To find interesting C code, you need go no further than http://www0.us.ioccc.org/years.html. Here is an example of the source to anonymous.c: #include\ <stdio.h> #include <stdlib.h> #include <string.h> #define w "Hk~HdA=Jk|Jk~LSyL[{M[wMcxNksNss:" #define r"Ht@H|@=HdJHtJHdYHtY:HtFHtF=JDBIl"\ "DJTEJDFIlMIlM:HdMHdM=I|KIlMJTOJDOIlWITY:8Y" #define S"IT@I\\@=HdHHtGH|KILJJDIJDH:H|KID"\ "K=HdQHtPH|TIDRJDRJDQ:JC?JK?=JDRJLRI|UItU:8T" #define _(i,j)L[i=2*T[j,O[i=O[j-R[j,T[i=2*\ R[j-5*T[j+4*O[j-L[j,R[i=3*T[j-R[j-3*O[j+L[j, #define t"IS?I\\@=HdGHtGIDJILIJDIItHJTFJDF:8J" #define y yy(4),yy(5), yy(6),yy(7) #define yy( i)R[i]=T[i],T[i ] =O[i],O[i]=L [i] #define Y _(0 ], 4] )_ (1 ], 5] )_ (2 ], 6] )_ (3 ], 7] )_=1 #define v(i)( (( R[ i ] * _ + T [ i ]) * _ + O [ i ]) * _ + L [ i ]) *2 double b = 32 ,l ,k ,o ,B ,_ ; int Q , s , V , R [8 ], T[ 8] ,O [8 ], L[ 8] ; #define q( Q,R ) R= *X ++ % 64 *8 ,R |= *X /8 &7 ,Q=*X++%8,Q=Q*64+*X++%64-256, # define p "G\\QG\\P=GLPGTPGdMGdNGtOGlOG" "dSGdRGDPGLPG\\LG\\LHtGHtH:" # define W "Hs?H{?=HdGH|FI\\II\\GJlHJ" "lFL\\DLTCMlAM\\@Ns}Nk|:8G" # define U "EDGEDH=EtCElDH{~H|AJk}" "Jk?LSzL[|M[wMcxNksNst:" # define u "Hs?H|@=HdFHtEI" "\\HI\\FJLHJTD:8H" char * x ,*X , ( * i )[ 640],z[3]="4_", *Z = "4,8O4.8O4G" r U "4M"u S"4R"u t"4S8CHdDH|E=HtAIDAIt@IlAJTCJDCIlKI\\K:8K"U "4TDdWDdW=D\\UD\\VF\\FFdHGtCGtEIDBIDDIlBIdDJT@JLC:8D"t"4UGDNG\\L=GDJGLKHL\ FHLGHtEHtE:"p"4ZFDTFLT=G|EGlHITBH|DIlDIdE:HtMH|M=JDBJLDKLAKDALDFKtFKdMK\ \\LJTOJ\\NJTMJTM:8M4aGtFGlG=G|HG|H:G\\IG\\J=G|IG|I:GdKGlL=G|JG|J:4b"W S"4d"W t t"4g"r w"4iGlIGlK=G|JG|J:4kHl@Ht@=HdDHtCHdPH|P:HdDHdD=It\ BIlDJTEJDFIdNI\\N:8N"w"4lID@IL@=HlIH|FHlPH|NHt^H|^:H|MH|N=J\\D\ J\\GK\\OKTOKDXJtXItZI|YIlWI|V:8^4mHLGH\\G=HLVH\\V:4n" u t t "4p"W"IT@I\\@=HdHHtGIDKILIJLGJLG:JK?JK?=JDGJLGI|MJDL:8M4\ rHt@H|@=HtDH|BJdLJTH:ITEI\\E=ILPILNNtCNlB:8N4t"W t"4u" p"4zI[?Il@=HlHH|HIDLILIJDII|HKDAJ|A:JtCJtC=JdLJtJL\ THLdFNk|Nc|\ :8K"; main ( int C,char** A) {for(x=A[1],i=calloc(strlen(x)+2,163840); C-1;C<3?Q=_= 0,(z[1]=*x++)?((*x++==104?z[1]^=32:--x), X = strstr(Z,z)) &&(X+=C++):(printf("P2 %d 320 4 ",V=b/2+32), V*=2,s=Q=0,C =4):C<4?Q-->0?i[(int)((l+=o)+b)][(int)(k+=B) ]=1:_?_-=.5/ 256,o=(v(2)-(l=v(0)))/(Q=16),B=(v(3)-(k=v(1) ))/Q:*X>60?y ,q(L[4],L[5])q(L[6],L[7])*X-61||(++X,y,y,y), Y:*X>57?++X, y,Y:*X >54?++X,b+=*X++%64*4:--C:printf("%d " ,i[Q][s]+i[Q ][s+1]+i[Q+1][s]+i[Q+1][s+1])&&(Q+=2)<V||(Q= 0,s+=2)<640 ||(C=1));}Now wouldn't that be a lot more boring in Ada? Steve (The Duck) "Martin Krischik" <martin@krischik.com> wrote in message news:1308622.IPB2vGgG6q@linux1.krischik.com... > Jeff C wrote: > > >> for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2); > > ;-) > > Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() > does > not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return value at > all - but it must exist somewhere. > > Martin > -- > mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net > http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 12:46 ` Jeff C 2005-01-14 14:47 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 21:47 ` Bernd Specht 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-15 21:47 UTC (permalink / raw) "Jeff C" <jcreem@yahoo.com> wrote in news:2qGdnRHihtRhI3rcRVn-uA@comcast.com: > > > Now, now.. We don't want actual facts to cloud his argument. Isn't it > better to just make unsubstantiated silly claims. This is exactly what I said. You say "we make Ada, we are the greatest, all others shall piss off". This is not helpful, to get more people interessted in Ada. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 9:40 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 12:46 ` Jeff C @ 2005-01-15 21:41 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-16 8:56 ` Martin Krischik 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-15 21:41 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> wrote in news:4244894.mjszBdT2aV@linux1.krischik.com: > Bernd Specht wrote: > >> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in >> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de: >> >>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps >>> write a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, >>> which could be considered less popular :-) Like: >>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005". >> >> Georg, >> >> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be >> done", but - nobody *does*! >> >> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must >> do ...", but never found one who *did*. > > You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside > (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am > doing! Sure, thats correct. But, in fact, your software is not well know to a broad public, isn't it? Thats the problem. To make ada more popular, we would need more software that is known to the people (like the DB mentioned by George). > And I don't think you want me to either, do you? No, not really. BTW, as far as I see, your projects are all GNAT related, this will not make it interessting for people *outside* the Ada-community. > Martin Bernd ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-15 21:41 ` Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-16 8:56 ` Martin Krischik 0 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-16 8:56 UTC (permalink / raw) Bernd Specht wrote: > Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> wrote in > news:4244894.mjszBdT2aV@linux1.krischik.com: > >> Bernd Specht wrote: >> >>> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in >>> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de: >>> >>>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps >>>> write a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, >>>> which could be considered less popular :-) Like: >>>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005". >>> >>> Georg, >>> >>> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be >>> done", but - nobody *does*! >>> >>> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must >>> do ...", but never found one who *did*. >> >> You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside >> (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am >> doing! > > Sure, thats correct. But, in fact, your software is not well know to a > broad public, isn't it? True. Alltrue sarDO is a lot more usefull then sed. But then any commandline text editor is not for the broad public. > Thats the problem. To make ada more popular, we > would need more software that is known to the people (like the DB > mentioned by George). Yes. That is true. I belive that GNAVI would be good. You need the foundation (develoment tools) first. Of corse GNAVI with integrated DB would be even better. The first step of the Ada comunity should be to give up on our tiny pet project and intergrate them into something larger wich then has the power to create those great applications. >> And I don't think you want me to either, do you? > > No, not really. BTW, as far as I see, your projects are all GNAT related, > this will not make it interessting for people *outside* the Ada-community. I have done lots of work with "Export (C," as well. They are just not integated into main AdaCL. Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 21:42 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 0:20 ` Jerry Petrey @ 2005-01-13 6:48 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-13 16:51 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 1:02 ` Jeffrey Carter 2005-01-13 18:25 ` Pascal Obry 2 siblings, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-13 6:48 UTC (permalink / raw) Bernd Specht wrote: >> I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just >> want to use the thing... >> >> Cheers >> >> -- Martin >> > > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If > you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the sources", > "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... (bla bla) Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that? So now I have both gnat-3.15p and gcc-3.4.2 with GPS! If MinGW is only 3-4 months behind the GCC releases that's a period I can easily cope with. Cheers -- Martin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 6:48 ` Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-13 16:51 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 17:14 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-14 1:02 ` Jeffrey Carter 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-13 16:51 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Dowie wrote: > Bernd Specht wrote: >>> I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just >>> want to use the thing... >>> >>> Cheers >>> >>> -- Martin >>> >> >> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? >> If you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the >> sources", "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... >> (bla bla) > > Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just > downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it > doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that? Here me: http://gnat-asis.sourceforge.net/ Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 16:51 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 17:14 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-15 11:24 ` Martin Krischik 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-14 17:14 UTC (permalink / raw) >>Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just >>downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it >>doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that? > > > Here me: > > http://gnat-asis.sourceforge.net/ There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is the 3.4.0 branch suitable? Cheers -- Martin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 17:14 ` Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-15 11:24 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 12:25 ` Martin Dowie 0 siblings, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 11:24 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Dowie wrote: >>>Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just >>>downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it >>>doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that? >> >> >> Here me: >> >> http://gnat-asis.sourceforge.net/ > > There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is > the 3.4.0 branch suitable? The download packages are cummulative - newer version contain the old version as well - so use the newest. Sadly in the current package the /gnat-3.4.2/ is indeed empty. You may try to use gnat-3.4.1 instead. But for MinGW it would be better to use the sources from gcc-ada-3.4.2-20040916-1-src.tar.gz Copy the follwing sources from the src pack to the gnat directory: GNAT_Specs := \ ./alloc.ads \ ./atree.ads \ ./casing.ads \ ./csets.ads \ ./debug.ads \ ./einfo.ads \ ./elists.ads \ ./fname.ads \ ./gnatvsn.ads \ ./hostparm.ads \ ./krunch.ads \ ./lib.ads \ ./namet.ads \ ./nlists.ads \ ./opt.ads \ ./output.ads \ ./repinfo.ads \ ./scans.ads \ ./sinfo.ads \ ./sinput.ads \ ./snames.ads \ ./stand.ads \ ./stringt.ads \ ./table.ads \ ./tree_in.ads \ ./tree_io.ads \ ./types.ads \ ./uintp.ads \ ./uname.ads \ ./urealp.ads \ ./widechar.ads \ ./g-string.ads GNAT_Body := \ ./atree.adb \ ./casing.adb \ ./csets.adb \ ./debug.adb \ ./einfo.adb \ ./elists.adb \ ./fname.adb \ ./gnatvsn.adb \ ./krunch.adb \ ./lib.adb \ ./lib-list.adb \ ./lib-sort.adb \ ./namet.adb \ ./nlists.adb \ ./opt.adb \ ./output.adb \ ./repinfo.adb \ ./scans.adb \ ./sinfo.adb \ ./sinput.adb \ ./snames.adb \ ./stand.adb \ ./stringt.adb \ ./table.adb \ ./tree_in.adb \ ./tree_io.adb \ ./types.adb \ ./uintp.adb \ ./uname.adb \ ./urealp.adb \ ./widechar.adb \ ./g-string.adb GNAT_C := \ ./version.c \ ./version.h If you have a sourceforge user I give you write access to the cvs archive so you can make the change available to other users. Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-15 11:24 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 12:25 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-15 12:52 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 13:58 ` Jeff C 0 siblings, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-15 12:25 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Krischik wrote: > Martin Dowie wrote: >>There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is >>the 3.4.0 branch suitable? > > > The download packages are cummulative - newer version contain the old > version as well - so use the newest. Sadly in the current package > the /gnat-3.4.2/ is indeed empty. You may try to use gnat-3.4.1 instead. > > But for MinGW it would be better to use the sources from > gcc-ada-3.4.2-20040916-1-src.tar.gz > > Copy the follwing sources from the src pack to the gnat directory: > > GNAT_Specs := \ [snip] > > If you have a sourceforge user I give you write access to the cvs archive so > you can make the change available to other users. Yes, I am a sf user (userid "martindowie"). But I'm still missing something - I can't see a "3.4.1" pack in either the 'Files' sf page or as a branch within the "CVS" page. There is a "3.4.0"... Cheers -- Martin ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-15 12:25 ` Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-15 12:52 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 13:58 ` Jeff C 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 12:52 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Dowie wrote: > Martin Krischik wrote: >> Martin Dowie wrote: >>>There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is >>>the 3.4.0 branch suitable? >> >> >> The download packages are cummulative - newer version contain the old >> version as well - so use the newest. Sadly in the current package >> the /gnat-3.4.2/ is indeed empty. You may try to use gnat-3.4.1 instead. >> >> But for MinGW it would be better to use the sources from >> gcc-ada-3.4.2-20040916-1-src.tar.gz >> >> Copy the follwing sources from the src pack to the gnat directory: >> >> GNAT_Specs := \ > [snip] > >> >> If you have a sourceforge user I give you write access to the cvs archive >> so you can make the change available to other users. > > Yes, I am a sf user (userid "martindowie"). Welcome to the team! > But I'm still missing something - I can't see a "3.4.1" pack in either > the 'Files' sf page or as a branch within the "CVS" page. There is a > "3.4.0"... You missunderstood. The Version number only applies to the binary created. The source package also contains all other versions collected up until then. You find them in the ".../gnat/gnat-3.x.x/" directories. However I alse check the cvs archive right now and update it if needed. Also, if needed I make a release ready next week. Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-15 12:25 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-15 12:52 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-15 13:58 ` Jeff C 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Jeff C @ 2005-01-15 13:58 UTC (permalink / raw) If you are thinking about using the mingw version of Ada be aware that the debugger included in mingw is really not Ada aware and that the debugger the mingw project is currently releasing is a pretty old version of gdb (5.x series v.s. a 6.x series). I have both a mingw environment and a cygwin environment setup on my machine. I grabbed the latest 6.3 based ACT snapshot gdb from the libre site (you can view the CVS of it at http://libre.adacore.com/cvsweb/gdb-6.3/) And built this under cygwin (need --disable-nls and make sure you have thinks like flex and bison setup in your cygwin environment). Then, by putting the resulting gdb along with a cygwin.dll in the path you can run this resulting gdb on your mingw compiled Ada code without ever really firing up a cygwin shell. I have not used this debugger extensively but I can confirm it works better than the one currently shipping with mingw. I don't really have time to package this correctly and I really can't send the binary (without including the source, having the source or a written offer to provide it for some time). But if someone tries this and runs into any issues I can answer a few questions. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 6:48 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-13 16:51 ` Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 1:02 ` Jeffrey Carter 2005-01-14 7:24 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-14 9:36 ` Martin Krischik 1 sibling, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Jeffrey Carter @ 2005-01-14 1:02 UTC (permalink / raw) Martin Dowie wrote: > > Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just > downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it > doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that? Yeah, but 50 MB? All I want is the compiler. -- Jeff Carter "Help! Help! I'm being repressed!" Monty Python & the Holy Grail 67 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 1:02 ` Jeffrey Carter @ 2005-01-14 7:24 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-14 9:36 ` Martin Krischik 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-14 7:24 UTC (permalink / raw) Jeffrey Carter <spam@spam.com> writes: > Yeah, but 50 MB? All I want is the compiler. No. You want the at least Ada compiler, the binutils, GNU/make, the MingW runtime, the MingW includes, the MingW libraries ;) Pascal. -- --|------------------------------------------------------ --| Pascal Obry Team-Ada Member --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE --|------------------------------------------------------ --| http://www.obry.org --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination" --| --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-14 1:02 ` Jeffrey Carter 2005-01-14 7:24 ` Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-14 9:36 ` Martin Krischik 1 sibling, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Martin Krischik @ 2005-01-14 9:36 UTC (permalink / raw) Jeffrey Carter wrote: > Martin Dowie wrote: >> >> Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just >> downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it >> doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that? > > Yeah, but 50 MB? All I want is the compiler. Compiler alone does not realy help. And compared with the 4 CDs Visual Stutio takes its lightweigt. With Regards Martin -- mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net http://www.ada.krischik.com ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-12 21:42 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 0:20 ` Jerry Petrey 2005-01-13 6:48 ` Martin Dowie @ 2005-01-13 18:25 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-13 19:59 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 20:40 ` Randy Brukardt 2 siblings, 2 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-13 18:25 UTC (permalink / raw) Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes: > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If And you are proposing what to change that ? Pascal. -- --|------------------------------------------------------ --| Pascal Obry Team-Ada Member --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE --|------------------------------------------------------ --| http://www.obry.org --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination" --| --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 18:25 ` Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-13 19:59 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 21:31 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-13 20:40 ` Randy Brukardt 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-13 19:59 UTC (permalink / raw) Pascal Obry <pascal@obry.net> wrote in news:ullax2nlm.fsf@obry.net: > > Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes: > >> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never >> do? If > > And you are proposing what to change that ? > > Pascal. > *I* propose nothing. I made my decision. I use C. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 19:59 ` Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-13 21:31 ` Pascal Obry 0 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Pascal Obry @ 2005-01-13 21:31 UTC (permalink / raw) Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes: > *I* propose nothing. I made my decision. I use C. Good, do you know comp.lang.c then. Pascal. -- --|------------------------------------------------------ --| Pascal Obry Team-Ada Member --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE --|------------------------------------------------------ --| http://www.obry.org --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination" --| --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 18:25 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-13 19:59 ` Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-13 20:40 ` Randy Brukardt 2005-01-15 21:33 ` Bernd Specht 1 sibling, 1 reply; 49+ messages in thread From: Randy Brukardt @ 2005-01-13 20:40 UTC (permalink / raw) "Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message news:ullax2nlm.fsf@obry.net... > > Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes: > > > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If > > And you are proposing what to change that ? Talk some more, I'm sure. That's what news groups are about after all; they primarily suck up time that could be used to *do* something. For the people that are professional Ada developers, it probably sucks up most of their Ada time... Some of us have been *do*ing for years. It hasn't helped, as far as I can tell. Randy. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
* Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? 2005-01-13 20:40 ` Randy Brukardt @ 2005-01-15 21:33 ` Bernd Specht 0 siblings, 0 replies; 49+ messages in thread From: Bernd Specht @ 2005-01-15 21:33 UTC (permalink / raw) "Randy Brukardt" <randy@rrsoftware.com> wrote in news:SfednedI4sPvQXvcRVn-iQ@megapath.net: > "Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message > news:ullax2nlm.fsf@obry.net... >> >> Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes: >> >> > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never >> > do? If >> >> And you are proposing what to change that ? > > Talk some more, I'm sure. That's what news groups are about after all; > they primarily suck up time that could be used to *do* something. For > the people that are professional Ada developers, it probably sucks up > most of their Ada time... > > Some of us have been *do*ing for years. It hasn't helped, as far as I > can tell. > > Randy. > The problem is *not* to use Ada for daily work, because this will not make Ada more visible. Less people know how the software for boing, airbus, iss is written. But - many people know e.g. Apache, CDrecord, Gimp, Linux and so on and they know that they are *not* written in Ada. So *doing* means not do commercial work, doing means popular, public programs. If there were a photoshop-clone for Linux written in Ada, or some good (really good) video editing software, maybe then people would recognize Ada. Or if Boing puts a sticker on their planes "powered by Ada" ;-) ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 49+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2005-01-16 11:23 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 49+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2005-01-11 23:33 Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? William J. Thomas 2005-01-11 23:48 ` Mark Lorenzen 2005-01-12 0:05 ` William J. Thomas 2005-01-12 1:33 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) israel t 2005-01-12 4:32 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something Larry Kilgallen 2005-01-12 4:58 ` Bobby D. Bryant 2005-01-12 6:13 ` israel t 2005-01-13 17:24 ` Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?) Martin Krischik 2005-01-12 8:40 ` Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p? Pascal Obry 2005-01-12 10:18 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-12 14:52 ` Manuel Collado 2005-01-13 17:26 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 16:02 ` Manuel Collado 2005-01-12 17:22 ` Luke A. Guest 2005-01-12 22:20 ` William J. Thomas 2005-01-13 18:23 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-13 17:17 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 16:37 ` Nick Roberts -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below -- 2005-01-12 18:10 Robert C. Leif 2005-01-12 21:42 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 0:20 ` Jerry Petrey 2005-01-13 10:46 ` Georg Bauhaus 2005-01-13 19:51 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-14 9:40 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 12:46 ` Jeff C 2005-01-14 14:47 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 23:10 ` Keith Thompson 2005-01-15 12:14 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-16 10:41 ` Adrien Plisson 2005-01-16 11:23 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 4:09 ` Steve 2005-01-15 21:47 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-15 21:41 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-16 8:56 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-13 6:48 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-13 16:51 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-14 17:14 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-15 11:24 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 12:25 ` Martin Dowie 2005-01-15 12:52 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-15 13:58 ` Jeff C 2005-01-14 1:02 ` Jeffrey Carter 2005-01-14 7:24 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-14 9:36 ` Martin Krischik 2005-01-13 18:25 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-13 19:59 ` Bernd Specht 2005-01-13 21:31 ` Pascal Obry 2005-01-13 20:40 ` Randy Brukardt 2005-01-15 21:33 ` Bernd Specht
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