* Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? @ 2007-04-27 13:34 PnkFlyd 2007-04-27 15:07 ` pakman 2007-05-02 23:47 ` Lucretia 0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: PnkFlyd @ 2007-04-27 13:34 UTC (permalink / raw) In a previous thread many people mentioned that they use Cohen's book, as do our staff here at my work (15 Ada programmers). Cohen's website http://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_people.nsf/pages/ncohen.index.html does not mention any recent activity in the area writing a 3rd edition to incorporate Ada05. Have any of you heard from Cohen any interest in doing so? Do you think there is enough of an interest to make it a financially viable option that we could possibly champion? I would hate to see Cohen's excellent book not be picked up by new Ada programmers just because the book is "out of date". ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-04-27 13:34 Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? PnkFlyd @ 2007-04-27 15:07 ` pakman 2007-04-28 17:55 ` adaworks 2007-05-02 23:47 ` Lucretia 1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: pakman @ 2007-04-27 15:07 UTC (permalink / raw) Greetings, As a reviewer of Cohen's Ada as a 2nd Language, 2nd ed, I had contacted Mr. Cohen and asked him if he had any plans of updating his excellent text for Ada 2005. He replied that he did not have any plans to revise the text. I suspect his work has taken him away from keeping up with Ada 2005. Most unfortunate, as I've considered Mr. Cohen's text the be the most complete and nearly perfect of all the Ada texts. Perhaps if we petition IBM and Mr. Cohen he might reconsider. I would be willing to review the text again. John Cupak "PnkFlyd" <pnkflyd831@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1177680878.226297.151180@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > In a previous thread many people mentioned that they use Cohen's book, > as do our staff here at my work (15 Ada programmers). > > Cohen's website > http://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_people.nsf/pages/ncohen.index.html > does not mention any recent activity in the area writing a 3rd edition > to incorporate Ada05. > > Have any of you heard from Cohen any interest in doing so? Do you > think there is enough of an interest to make it a financially viable > option that we could possibly champion? I would hate to see Cohen's > excellent book not be picked up by new Ada programmers just because > the book is "out of date". > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-04-27 15:07 ` pakman @ 2007-04-28 17:55 ` adaworks 2007-04-28 21:59 ` Chip and Allie Orange 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: adaworks @ 2007-04-28 17:55 UTC (permalink / raw) Dr. Cohen works for IBM and IBM has very little interest in Ada. Even Rational, a company now owned by IBM and originally founded to build Ada compilers and tools, has pretty much lost its way with regard to Ada. It is an economic issue, as well. Since the compiler publishers can no longer charge inflated prices for Ada compilers for a captive customer, as they could during the years of the mandate, the economic incentive has diminished. That fact, coupled with the fact that IBM, for the most part, has never demonstrated any interest in nor competence in, Ada, rules out any liklihood that Dr. Cohen will given the resources he needs to update his book. I originally intended to update my own book, Ada Distilled. I had hoped to be able to do so by this Spring. However, economics again prevails. The school where I teach has abandoned any interest in Ada, and I am required to focus my attention on other topics. The text of Ada Distilled is in the public domain, pretty much as open source, so anyone who might want to update it, as a consortium, or as an individual, is free to do so. I would only hope that such an effort would be carried out in the spririt of the original work with an emphasis on clarity tempered with brevity. Richard Riehle "pakman" <pakman744@nospam.com> wrote in message news:YImdnaBvGOMUjK_bnZ2dnUVZ_ualnZ2d@comcast.com... > Greetings, > > As a reviewer of Cohen's Ada as a 2nd Language, 2nd ed, I had contacted Mr. > Cohen and asked him if he had any plans of updating his excellent text for Ada > 2005. > > He replied that he did not have any plans to revise the text. I suspect his > work has taken him away from keeping up with Ada 2005. > > Most unfortunate, as I've considered Mr. Cohen's text the be the most complete > and nearly perfect of all the Ada texts. > > Perhaps if we petition IBM and Mr. Cohen he might reconsider. > > I would be willing to review the text again. > > John Cupak > > "PnkFlyd" <pnkflyd831@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:1177680878.226297.151180@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com... >> In a previous thread many people mentioned that they use Cohen's book, >> as do our staff here at my work (15 Ada programmers). >> >> Cohen's website >> http://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_people.nsf/pages/ncohen.index.html >> does not mention any recent activity in the area writing a 3rd edition >> to incorporate Ada05. >> >> Have any of you heard from Cohen any interest in doing so? Do you >> think there is enough of an interest to make it a financially viable >> option that we could possibly champion? I would hate to see Cohen's >> excellent book not be picked up by new Ada programmers just because >> the book is "out of date". >> > > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-04-28 17:55 ` adaworks @ 2007-04-28 21:59 ` Chip and Allie Orange 2007-04-29 18:03 ` adaworks 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Chip and Allie Orange @ 2007-04-28 21:59 UTC (permalink / raw) Hi Richard, Just one note: my brother-in-law worked for Rational, and now for IBM, and is their lead programmer on the run-time for Apex. They have reduced their staff, and aren't making much effort in marketing it, but they are still supporting and developing Apex. As far as I can tell, it's the lack of marketing, not support, that gives the impression that they've "lost their way" in regards to Ada. I also understand that Apex is still considered the market leader in Ada cross-compilers for embedded systems. BTW, I am especially appreciative of your book being made available in electronic form, and not just paper. I do wish more e-books were available for Ada. Chip <adaworks@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message news:Y%KYh.1684$tp5.1456@newssvr23.news.prodigy.net... > Dr. Cohen works for IBM and IBM has very little interest in > Ada. > > Even Rational, a company now owned by IBM and originally founded > to build Ada compilers and tools, has pretty much lost its way with > regard to Ada. > > It is an economic issue, as well. Since the compiler publishers can no > longer charge inflated prices for Ada compilers for a captive customer, > as they could during the years of the mandate, the economic incentive > has diminished. That fact, coupled with the fact that IBM, for the > most part, has never demonstrated any interest in nor competence > in, Ada, rules out any liklihood that Dr. Cohen will given the resources > he needs to update his book. > > I originally intended to update my own book, Ada Distilled. I had hoped > to be able to do so by this Spring. However, economics again prevails. > The school where I teach has abandoned any interest in Ada, and I am > required to focus my attention on other topics. The text of Ada > Distilled > is in the public domain, pretty much as open source, so anyone who might > want to update it, as a consortium, or as an individual, is free to do so. > I > would only hope that such an effort would be carried out in the spririt of > the original work with an emphasis on clarity tempered with brevity. > > Richard Riehle > > "pakman" <pakman744@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:YImdnaBvGOMUjK_bnZ2dnUVZ_ualnZ2d@comcast.com... >> Greetings, >> >> As a reviewer of Cohen's Ada as a 2nd Language, 2nd ed, I had contacted >> Mr. Cohen and asked him if he had any plans of updating his excellent >> text for Ada 2005. >> >> He replied that he did not have any plans to revise the text. I suspect >> his work has taken him away from keeping up with Ada 2005. >> >> Most unfortunate, as I've considered Mr. Cohen's text the be the most >> complete and nearly perfect of all the Ada texts. >> >> Perhaps if we petition IBM and Mr. Cohen he might reconsider. >> >> I would be willing to review the text again. >> >> John Cupak >> >> "PnkFlyd" <pnkflyd831@gmail.com> wrote in message >> news:1177680878.226297.151180@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com... >>> In a previous thread many people mentioned that they use Cohen's book, >>> as do our staff here at my work (15 Ada programmers). >>> >>> Cohen's website >>> http://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_people.nsf/pages/ncohen.index.html >>> does not mention any recent activity in the area writing a 3rd edition >>> to incorporate Ada05. >>> >>> Have any of you heard from Cohen any interest in doing so? Do you >>> think there is enough of an interest to make it a financially viable >>> option that we could possibly champion? I would hate to see Cohen's >>> excellent book not be picked up by new Ada programmers just because >>> the book is "out of date". >>> >> >> > > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-04-28 21:59 ` Chip and Allie Orange @ 2007-04-29 18:03 ` adaworks 0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: adaworks @ 2007-04-29 18:03 UTC (permalink / raw) "Chip and Allie Orange" <acorange@comcast.net> wrote in message news:Vs2dnYEMs4vRWa7bnZ2dnUVZ_g-dnZ2d@comcast.com... > Hi Richard, > > They [Rational] have reduced their staff, and aren't making much effort in > marketing it, but they are still supporting and developing Apex. > I have enormous respect for the technical staff at Rational and their efforts with Ada. The product continues to be one of the best available and, until I retired AdaWorks a few years ago, I had clients who were using Apex and related Ada tools from Rational successfully. > > As far as I can tell, it's the lack of marketing, not support, that gives the > impression that they've "lost their way" in regards to Ada. I also understand > that Apex is still considered the market leader in Ada cross-compilers for > embedded systems. > I am a little out-of-date with my knowledge of who the market leaders are. However, I do see a sad lack of leadership in the marketing, promotion or agressive selling of Ada from a company that was originally founded to do just that. Rational was created as an Ada company, right from the beginning. Now they seem to be making an attempt to hide that information from their more Ada-ignorant customers. Instead of taking a courageous position with regard to Ada, they have positioned it as a "Oh. Since you asked, we do have an Ada compiler, but we don't want to talk about it unless you insist," product. Rational was one of the companies that made sure, not malicious intent, but by inept marketing decisions, that Ada would not find its way into the commercial marketplace. They bought Meridian, one of the affordable Ada compilers that had a built-in library for developing PC applications, and promptly killed it. They hired some of the best Ada marketing people available such as Jerry Rudisin and Lori Heyman, and failed to use them effectively in the promotion of their Ada products. And a former luminary of the Ada community ( a former DoD Ada official) told me that he advised Rational to subdue its visibility as an Ada company and focus on the non-Ada marketplace. This was, from an economic perspective, good advice since they have risen to a powerful position of prominence in the world of software development tools. But the decision appears to have been taken at the expense of Ada, the very technology that helped them acquire the resources necessary to achieve their current, and well-deserved success. After the end of the mandate, a lot of Ada compiler publishers, no longer able to depend on the sale of overpriced products, fell into hard times. I am not very smart about the marketing side of things, but I think that some of those companies could have turned this into an advantage instead of a [to use a popular, but silly phrase] "cut and run" decision. When one considers the current collection of available programming languages and compares each against the current Ada standard, it is clear that Ada stands out as a far better choice, in most cases, than those now in favor. C++ is a hideous choice. Java falls short. C#, while a little better than Java, is not what it could have been. Python and Ruby are excellent for some kind of applications. Eiffel, while also an excellent language design from which future Ada language revisions could continue to learn, is a little short of what we get from Ada, especially for large-scale, safety-critical software. But the very name, Ada, is met with dersision within the misinformed software community. Do we really want software development decisions made on the basis of bad information. Do we really want software built with languages such as C++ that are inherently error-prone? Do we really want our DoD software deployed in languages that are as inefficient and full of maintainability concerns as a language such as Java? Courage is the missing element. I would love to see the management at Rational become courageous enough to begin promoting Ada once again. That would not require them to hide their other excellent products (I like most of them). It would simply be a way for them to reinvigorate both their own Ada products, raise the level of awareness for Ada, and actively acknowledge that they have one of the most powerful tools for the creation of both military and commercial software available anywhere. Why would anyone with products as good as theirs want to "hide their light under a bushel?" Richard Riehle > BTW, I am especially appreciative of your book being made available in > electronic form, and not just paper. I do wish more e-books were available > for Ada. > > Chip > > > <adaworks@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message > news:Y%KYh.1684$tp5.1456@newssvr23.news.prodigy.net... >> Dr. Cohen works for IBM and IBM has very little interest in >> Ada. >> >> Even Rational, a company now owned by IBM and originally founded >> to build Ada compilers and tools, has pretty much lost its way with >> regard to Ada. >> >> It is an economic issue, as well. Since the compiler publishers can no >> longer charge inflated prices for Ada compilers for a captive customer, >> as they could during the years of the mandate, the economic incentive >> has diminished. That fact, coupled with the fact that IBM, for the >> most part, has never demonstrated any interest in nor competence >> in, Ada, rules out any liklihood that Dr. Cohen will given the resources >> he needs to update his book. >> >> I originally intended to update my own book, Ada Distilled. I had hoped >> to be able to do so by this Spring. However, economics again prevails. >> The school where I teach has abandoned any interest in Ada, and I am >> required to focus my attention on other topics. The text of Ada Distilled >> is in the public domain, pretty much as open source, so anyone who might >> want to update it, as a consortium, or as an individual, is free to do so. I >> would only hope that such an effort would be carried out in the spririt of >> the original work with an emphasis on clarity tempered with brevity. >> >> Richard Riehle >> >> "pakman" <pakman744@nospam.com> wrote in message >> news:YImdnaBvGOMUjK_bnZ2dnUVZ_ualnZ2d@comcast.com... >>> Greetings, >>> >>> As a reviewer of Cohen's Ada as a 2nd Language, 2nd ed, I had contacted Mr. >>> Cohen and asked him if he had any plans of updating his excellent text for >>> Ada 2005. >>> >>> He replied that he did not have any plans to revise the text. I suspect his >>> work has taken him away from keeping up with Ada 2005. >>> >>> Most unfortunate, as I've considered Mr. Cohen's text the be the most >>> complete and nearly perfect of all the Ada texts. >>> >>> Perhaps if we petition IBM and Mr. Cohen he might reconsider. >>> >>> I would be willing to review the text again. >>> >>> John Cupak >>> >>> "PnkFlyd" <pnkflyd831@gmail.com> wrote in message >>> news:1177680878.226297.151180@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com... >>>> In a previous thread many people mentioned that they use Cohen's book, >>>> as do our staff here at my work (15 Ada programmers). >>>> >>>> Cohen's website >>>> http://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_people.nsf/pages/ncohen.index.html >>>> does not mention any recent activity in the area writing a 3rd edition >>>> to incorporate Ada05. >>>> >>>> Have any of you heard from Cohen any interest in doing so? Do you >>>> think there is enough of an interest to make it a financially viable >>>> option that we could possibly champion? I would hate to see Cohen's >>>> excellent book not be picked up by new Ada programmers just because >>>> the book is "out of date". >>>> >>> >>> >> >> > > ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-04-27 13:34 Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? PnkFlyd 2007-04-27 15:07 ` pakman @ 2007-05-02 23:47 ` Lucretia 2007-05-04 2:33 ` adaworks 1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Lucretia @ 2007-05-02 23:47 UTC (permalink / raw) On Apr 27, 2:34 pm, PnkFlyd <pnkflyd...@gmail.com> wrote: > In a previous thread many people mentioned that they use Cohen's book, > as do our staff here at my work (15 Ada programmers). > > Cohen's websitehttp://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_people.nsf/pages/ncohen.... > does not mention any recent activity in the area writing a 3rd edition > to incorporate Ada05. > > Have any of you heard from Cohen any interest in doing so? Do you > think there is enough of an interest to make it a financially viable > option that we could possibly champion? I would hate to see Cohen's > excellent book not be picked up by new Ada programmers just because > the book is "out of date". I sent an email to Norman Cohen a while back about an update to the book, here's his reply: "No, I have no plans to update the book. I've moved on to other pursuits." I then replied to ask if the source to the book will be released (as it's well out of print now), I received no reply ;) Oh well. Luke. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-05-02 23:47 ` Lucretia @ 2007-05-04 2:33 ` adaworks 2007-05-04 15:01 ` Lucretia 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: adaworks @ 2007-05-04 2:33 UTC (permalink / raw) "Lucretia" <lucretia9@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message news:1178149620.087751.309640@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... > On Apr 27, 2:34 pm, PnkFlyd <pnkflyd...@gmail.com> wrote: > > I sent an email to Norman Cohen a while back about an update to the > book, here's his reply: > 1) Cohen's book is not really "out-of-date." While it does not cover some of the new features of the latest version of Ada, it does cover the features of the largest revision of the language, to date. Everything in the Cohen book will still work. 2) John Barnes has written a book on Ada 2005. That book is quite comprehensive. It is published by Addison-Wesley, and anything you need to update your knowledge of Ada is in that book. The criticism of Barnes' book has sometimes been that the examples are not as fully coded as in the Cohen book. Dr. Barnes has addressed that criticism and you will find some fully coded examples. 3) I will make the electronically modifiable source code and text for my own book, Ada Distilled, available to someone who is serious about updating it for Ada 2005. So far, no one has taken me up on that. At present, I don't have the time to do it myself. That was my original intent, but too much time is passing without that update occurring. Ada Distilled comes with a lot of small source file programs, all fully coded and most of them tested, that one can play with and use for experiments. Whoever updates Ada Distilled will have to add to the collection of working Ada programs to keep the spirit of that book alive. Richard Riehle ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-05-04 2:33 ` adaworks @ 2007-05-04 15:01 ` Lucretia 2007-05-04 16:36 ` adaworks 2007-05-05 1:49 ` Christopher J. Henrich 0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Lucretia @ 2007-05-04 15:01 UTC (permalink / raw) On May 4, 3:33 am, <adawo...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > "Lucretia" <lucret...@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message > > news:1178149620.087751.309640@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...> On Apr 27, 2:34 pm, PnkFlyd <pnkflyd...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I sent an email to Norman Cohen a while back about an update to the > > book, here's his reply: > > 1) Cohen's book is not really "out-of-date." While it does not > cover some of the new features of the latest version of Ada, > it does cover the features of the largest revision of the language, > to date. Everything in the Cohen book will still work. I never said it was out of date, I said it was out of print. Big difference! Also, with it being out of print, the cost of the book is hugely inflated, over here it's at least £70, not necessarily for a new copy! > 2) John Barnes has written a book on Ada 2005. That book is quite > comprehensive. It is published by Addison-Wesley, and anything > you need to update your knowledge of Ada is in that book. The > criticism of Barnes' book has sometimes been that the examples > are not as fully coded as in the Cohen book. Dr. Barnes has > addressed that criticism and you will find some fully coded examples. The thing I've heard about the Cohen book is that is supposedly covers in detail how a runtime could be written for an Ada compiler. I doubt that this can be said about the Barnes book. Luke. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-05-04 15:01 ` Lucretia @ 2007-05-04 16:36 ` adaworks 2007-05-04 18:56 ` Sloan.Kohler 2007-05-05 1:49 ` Christopher J. Henrich 1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: adaworks @ 2007-05-04 16:36 UTC (permalink / raw) [-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --] [-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 567 bytes --] "Lucretia" <lucretia9@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message news:1178290919.801968.176460@n76g2000hsh.googlegroups.com... On May 4, 3:33 am, <adawo...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: >I never said it was out of date, I said it was out of print. Big >difference! > >Also, with it being out of print, the cost of the book is hugely >inflated, over here it's at least �70, not necessarily for a new copy! Sorry I misunderstood. For inexpensive copies of the Cohen book try, http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0070115893/ref=lp_g_1/104-5198524-8868747 Richard Riehle ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-05-04 16:36 ` adaworks @ 2007-05-04 18:56 ` Sloan.Kohler 2007-05-04 21:31 ` adaworks 0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread From: Sloan.Kohler @ 2007-05-04 18:56 UTC (permalink / raw) On May 4, 11:36 am, <adawo...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > > Sorry I misunderstood. For inexpensive copies of the Cohen book > try, > > http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0070115893/ref=lp_g_1/104-5198... > Buyer beware that all the inxpensive copies are the Ada 83 based first edition that was published in 1986. The Ada 95 based second edition tends to sell for $80 USD and up. New copies are typically $130. I wish the author & publisher would sell it as a PDF file. I'd pay for that because it it would be much easier to search. -- Sloan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-05-04 18:56 ` Sloan.Kohler @ 2007-05-04 21:31 ` adaworks 0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: adaworks @ 2007-05-04 21:31 UTC (permalink / raw) <Sloan.Kohler@gmail.com> wrote in message news:1178304999.625739.46650@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups.com... > On May 4, 11:36 am, <adawo...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: >> >> Sorry I misunderstood. For inexpensive copies of the Cohen book >> try, >> >> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0070115893/ref=lp_g_1/104-5198... >> > Buyer beware that all the inxpensive copies are the Ada 83 based first > edition that was published in 1986. The Ada 95 based second edition > tends to sell for $80 USD and up. New copies are typically $130. > I sometimes encounter a copy of the Second Edition of Cohen in a used book store for a much lower price. If I find any of these in the future, I'll buy them and make them available at whatever price I pay, plus postage. I used to have quite a few copies in my own company's inventory, but since I am no longer in the Ada consulting business, I have only one copy left. Hmmmm. I wonder if I could scan it? Well, it is 1133 pages. That would be a lot of work. More than one weekend, I think. Richard Riehle ================================================== ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? 2007-05-04 15:01 ` Lucretia 2007-05-04 16:36 ` adaworks @ 2007-05-05 1:49 ` Christopher J. Henrich 1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread From: Christopher J. Henrich @ 2007-05-05 1:49 UTC (permalink / raw) In article <1178290919.801968.176460@n76g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>, Lucretia <lucretia9@lycos.co.uk> wrote: > > "Lucretia" <lucret...@lycos.co.uk> wrote in message > > > > news:1178149620.087751.309640@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...> On Apr 27, > > 2:34 pm, PnkFlyd <pnkflyd...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > I sent an email to Norman Cohen a while back about an update to the > > > book, here's his reply: > > > > 1) Cohen's book is not really "out-of-date." While it does not > > cover some of the new features of the latest version of Ada, > > it does cover the features of the largest revision of the language, > > to date. Everything in the Cohen book will still work. > > I never said it was out of date, I said it was out of print. Big > difference! > > Also, with it being out of print, the cost of the book is hugely > inflated, over here it's at least ÔøΩ70, not necessarily for a new copy! Can you buy from Abebooks <http://www.abebooks.com/> ? If so, you can find several copies at much less that 70 pounds. It's also true that you can find some copies at more than 200 pounds, but they must be, well, special. -- Chris Henrich http://www.mathinteract.com God just doesn't fit inside a single religion. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2007-05-05 1:49 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2007-04-27 13:34 Cohen: "Ada As A Second Language" - 05 Update? PnkFlyd 2007-04-27 15:07 ` pakman 2007-04-28 17:55 ` adaworks 2007-04-28 21:59 ` Chip and Allie Orange 2007-04-29 18:03 ` adaworks 2007-05-02 23:47 ` Lucretia 2007-05-04 2:33 ` adaworks 2007-05-04 15:01 ` Lucretia 2007-05-04 16:36 ` adaworks 2007-05-04 18:56 ` Sloan.Kohler 2007-05-04 21:31 ` adaworks 2007-05-05 1:49 ` Christopher J. Henrich
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