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From: "Randy Brukardt" <randy@rrsoftware.com>
Subject: Re: Standard Ada Preprocessor
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 14:58:44 -0600
Date: 2004-01-27T14:58:44-06:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <101dk9p201i2d45@corp.supernews.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: pan.2004.01.27.18.56.15.347278@email.ro


"David Starner" <dvdeug@email.ro> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.01.27.18.56.15.347278@email.ro...
> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:00:31 -0500, Warren W. Gay VE3WWG wrote:
> ... 15 years ago, someone made a killing by releasing a
> Turbo Pascal for under a hundred bucks, and made Pascal a major language.

About the same time, RRS offers Janus/Ada for $99. It certainly didn't make
Ada more popular... (And it should be remembered that Turbo Pascal was the
third such low priced Pascal. Anybody remember the $29 JRT Pascal that
preceded it? There's more to it than the price...)

> Free software has helped drop the off-the-shelf price of a complete Un*x
> system with C, C++, Pascal and Lisp compilers to under a hundred bucks.
> But I still get quoted a price of $700 for an Ada compiler.

For the record, you can buy Janus/Ada for as little as $195 (with only 90
days of support, and no GUI tools).

> Maybe that's
> fine for ye system engineers, but programmers, especially we student
> programmers, don't have a wealth of money to drop on compilers. Perhaps I
> need to find a new hammer.

Ada doesn't have the sort of sugar daddies that a lot of these other
languages to. So far as I know, all existing Ada compilers are produced by
companies that make substantial portions of their revenue from their Ada
development systems. Giving them away isn't going to improve the bottom
line.

For instance, here at RRS, virtually all of our revenue is from Ada
development tools. If we started to give them away for free, there would be
a number of effects: (1) Support costs would jump dramatically. With far
more users, there would be far more questions to answer and bugs to track
down. We'd have to implement a "triage" system - which is precisely what you
don't like about ACT. (2) Revenue would drop to zero - we have no other
products. We've never sold much support, probably because we answer
questions from anyone with one of our products, supported or not. (3)
Because of (1) and (2), we'd need to find another revenue source. What ever
that is, it would remove most of the resources from the Ada compiler. So the
net effect would be to completely stall development of the Ada compiler.
That's unlikely to help you or anyone else.

Your complaint really seems to boil down to not liking the policies of the
maintainer of GNAT. The obvious solution in the Open Source world is to find
another maintainer. All you have to do is figure how those people will be
funded (or convinced to do a full-time job for free).

                               Randy.






  parent reply	other threads:[~2004-01-27 20:58 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 294+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-01-17 11:15 why ada is so unpopular ? Szymon Guz
2004-01-17 13:53 ` Martin Dowie
2004-01-17 14:27 ` Dmytry Lavrov
2004-01-17 21:02   ` Szymon Guz
2004-01-17 22:36     ` Adrian Knoth
2004-01-18  9:21       ` Szymon Guz
2004-01-18 12:18         ` Luke A. Guest
2004-01-18 13:09           ` Ronald Dauster
2004-01-18 12:59         ` Ronald Dauster
2004-01-18 13:25           ` Stephane Richard
2004-01-18 14:17           ` Szymon Guz
2004-01-18 14:42             ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-18 15:23               ` Szymon Guz
2004-01-18 17:53                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-18 16:34               ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-19 12:59                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-19 13:06                   ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-19 13:28                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-19 13:37                       ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-20 12:38                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-20 17:31                           ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-20 18:50                             ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-26  4:00                               ` Peter Richtmyer
2004-01-26  5:01                                 ` tmoran
2004-01-26 12:01                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-02-01 15:09                               ` Mark
2004-02-01 19:10                                 ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-02-02 16:48                                   ` Martin Krischik
2004-02-02 18:22                                     ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-01-21 12:39                             ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Marin David Condic
2004-01-21 13:12                               ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-22  0:05                               ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-22  5:59                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-22 12:58                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-22 17:25                                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-23 12:24                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-23 13:46                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-01-23 17:16                                           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-23 17:52                                             ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-23 21:57                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-24  0:52                                                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-26 17:19                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 12:24                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-27 19:03                                                       ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-24  1:34                                                 ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Marin David Condic
2004-01-26 17:27                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 12:30                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24  8:20                                                 ` Pascal Obry
2004-01-26 17:29                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-23 17:56                                             ` Larry Hazel
2004-01-24  1:36                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-23 22:14                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-23 22:42                                               ` tmoran
2004-01-26 17:50                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-26 18:54                                                 ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-26 21:53                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  0:00                                                     ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-27 17:30                                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 20:55                                                         ` Robert A Duff
2004-01-27 22:03                                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-28 12:28                                                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-28 20:55                                                             ` Simon Wright
2004-01-29 12:40                                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-29 18:08                                                                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-30 12:30                                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-29 20:45                                                                 ` Simon Wright
2004-01-29 23:12                                                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-30 13:09                                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-30 18:06                                                                       ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-31  8:11                                                                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-30 12:36                                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-30 16:52                                                             ` Pascal Obry
2004-01-31  8:25                                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-27 21:04                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-28 12:42                                                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-27 12:48                                                 ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Marin David Condic
2004-01-26  9:34                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-01-26 19:23                                               ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-23  2:47                                     ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-23 12:38                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24  5:23                                         ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 12:28                                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24 15:32                                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 15:43                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-25  4:24                                                 ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-25 16:24                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-29 11:17                                                 ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-01-29 12:52                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-26 18:03                                           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-26 19:14                                             ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-26 22:04                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  1:00                                                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-27  8:35                                                   ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-01-27 11:09                                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-27 15:22                                                       ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-01-27 15:54                                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-27 18:00                                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 19:19                                                           ` David Starner
2004-01-27 20:08                                                             ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-01-27 20:19                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-27 20:58                                                             ` Randy Brukardt [this message]
2004-01-27 22:13                                                             ` Simon Wright
2004-01-27 23:04                                                               ` David Starner
2004-01-28  1:41                                                                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-28  2:26                                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-28  2:50                                                                 ` Stephen Leake
2004-01-28  3:21                                                                   ` Jeff C,
2004-01-28  3:57                                                                   ` David Starner
2004-01-29  3:03                                                                     ` Stephen Leake
2004-01-29  7:20                                                                       ` David Starner
2004-01-29 11:14                                                                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-29 18:56                                                                           ` David Starner
2004-01-29 19:41                                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-29 12:57                                                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-29 13:51                                                                         ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-30  2:46                                                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-28 20:34                                                                   ` Michael Bode
2004-01-29  3:06                                                                     ` Stephen Leake
2004-01-28 12:50                                                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-27 20:44                                                           ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-27 22:15                                                           ` Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-29 17:31                                                             ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (conclusions) Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-29 19:44                                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-30 13:25                                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-30 13:29                                                                 ` Lutz Donnerhacke
2004-01-30 13:53                                                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-30 14:14                                                                     ` Lutz Donnerhacke
2004-01-27 19:11                                                         ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-27 21:48                                                         ` Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-28 16:26                                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-29  2:51                                                             ` Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-29 11:19                                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-29 22:02                                                                 ` Nature of XML (was: Re: Standard Ada Preprocessor) Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-30  8:53                                                                   ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-30 17:35                                                                     ` Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-30 19:13                                                                       ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-31 16:04                                                                         ` Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-31 16:45                                                                           ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-30 18:49                                                                   ` Nature of XML Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-30 19:16                                                                     ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-01-30 22:59                                                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-31  1:26                                                                         ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-31 13:08                                                                           ` Nature of XML (ramblings) Marius Amado Alves
2004-01-31 18:14                                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-02-03  1:35                                                                           ` Nature of XML Robert C. Leif
2004-02-03 14:23                                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-27 17:50                                                     ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 20:42                                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-27 21:41                                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28  9:10                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-01-29 17:39                                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28 23:21                                                           ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-29 17:46                                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-30  3:20                                                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-28 12:27                                                       ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-01-29 17:53                                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 17:33                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27 19:07                                                     ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-27 21:42                                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  2:35                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-27 21:47                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28  1:19                                                     ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-28 12:30                                                       ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-01-28 23:35                                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-29 10:16                                                       ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-01-29 17:58                                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-29 23:19                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-27  3:54                                                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-27 21:53                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28  1:27                                                     ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-29 18:02                                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28 20:35                                                     ` Pascal Obry
2004-01-29  0:53                                                       ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-28 23:41                                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-29 18:04                                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-30  2:33                                                       ` Chad R. Meiners
2004-01-30 18:00                                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-30 22:52                                                           ` Blinking text Chad R. Meiners
2004-02-06 17:14                                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  7:41                                                 ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Pascal Obry
2004-01-27 21:53                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  0:06                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-27 21:55                                                 ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28  1:34                                                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-30 17:19                                                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-30 19:06                                                       ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-02-10 11:18                                                         ` stephen.freeman9
2004-02-10 17:45                                                           ` Language Design (was Standard Ada Preprocessor) Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  0:17                                               ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-26 23:44                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-27 22:04                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-28  2:47                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-30 17:29                                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-30 19:06                                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-31  8:42                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-02-02 17:28                                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  0:15                                             ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-27 22:05                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-24  8:17                                         ` Pascal Obry
2004-01-24 12:44                                           ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24 15:39                                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 16:06                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-26 11:28                                             ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-01-26 12:07                                               ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-23 16:38                                       ` Alexandre E. Kopilovitch
2004-01-23 17:54                                         ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-23 17:24                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-23 22:30                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-26 22:11                                           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  0:28                                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-27 22:13                                               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-27  1:02                                             ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-01-22 14:13                                   ` Robert A Duff
2004-01-22 17:27                                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-23 12:54                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-23 17:26                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-23 12:52                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24  5:52                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 12:56                                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24 15:53                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-30 17:39                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-31  1:58                                               ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-02-02 17:55                                                 ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-02-04 18:36                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-02-06 17:27                                                     ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-02-07 13:18                                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-02-09 17:37                                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-02-10 14:59                                                       ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-02-10 17:57                                                         ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-02-10 21:49                                                           ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-02-11  8:34                                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-02-13 17:27                                                             ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-30 17:34                                           ` Standard Ada Preprocessor (Was: why ada is so unpopular ?) Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-22 12:47                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-22 13:24                                   ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-01-22 18:20                                     ` Robert A Duff
2004-01-23  9:18                                       ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-01-23 12:59                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-23 14:21                                       ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-01-24  6:02                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 13:09                                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24 19:32                                           ` tmoran
2004-01-24 20:34                                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-22 17:29                                   ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-22 13:19                                 ` Standard Ada Preprocessor Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-22 13:49                                   ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-22 15:03                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-22 17:33                                       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-22 19:02                                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-01-23 17:35                                           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-01-24  1:50                                             ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24  5:33                                               ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-24 13:28                                                 ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24 15:58                                                   ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 16:11                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-24 19:32                                                   ` tmoran
2004-01-24 20:44                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-25  5:02                                                       ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-25 16:38                                                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-26 16:03                                                           ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-24 23:39                                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-25 13:47                                                     ` Stephane Richard
2004-01-26 19:19                                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2004-01-24  6:08                                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-23 13:11                                       ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-22 14:12                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
     [not found]                           ` <ldlq00hmnm7ofaqem3kkrt7qhf6o7kjfmj@4ax.com>
2004-01-21 12:20                             ` why ada is so unpopular ? Marin David Condic
2004-01-19 13:09                   ` Jeff C,
2004-01-19 23:03                     ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-20  1:10                       ` cl1
2004-01-20  5:34                         ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-20  7:37                           ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-20 16:41                             ` Robert I. Eachus
2004-01-20 23:59                             ` Stephen Leake
2004-01-21 10:29                               ` Preben Randhol
2004-01-17 23:01     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-18  0:30       ` Hyman Rosen
2004-01-18  2:06         ` cl1
2004-01-18  3:12           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-01-18  3:28             ` cl1
2004-01-18 14:34         ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-19 23:46     ` chris
2004-01-18 18:41 ` Jano
2004-01-21  2:01 ` Luke A. Guest
2004-01-21 14:23   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-01-21 14:31   ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-01-21 15:15     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-01-21 18:40       ` Robert A Duff
2004-01-21 18:31   ` chris
2004-01-22 13:11     ` Marin David Condic
2004-01-22 23:33       ` Stephen Leake
2004-01-23 13:25         ` Marin David Condic
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2004-01-26 13:30 Standard Ada Preprocessor Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-01-26 16:10 ` Robert I. Eachus
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