Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

I created a logo for Gnoga, Critiques? Alternate ideas?

http://www.gnoga.com

So a few things to help put the logo in to perspective:

1 Gnoga is pronounced like No and Gah
2. The word in hebrew means Saturn or "glow"
3. The 8 pointed star is called the "Star of Saturn" used to represent Saturn in old Babylonia
4. Gnoga stands for - The GNU Omnificent GUI for Ada

Some marketing summaries:

What is Gnoga? A Secure Mission-Critical Cloud, Desktop and Mobile Application Framework

Gnoga offers real-time server, desktop, mobile and web apps with push capability written across the application stack in Ada, the time-tested, safe and secure programming language designed for large scale long lived maintainable systems.

Gnoga has the simple ability to write and push data like Node.JS, the stability of compiled Ada applications, the full spectrum use of the browsers rendering capabilities without the need to use JavaScript or HTML, the database simplicity of Ruby on Rails and the ability to target any platform Ada can run or through the cloud to any modern device with a web browser.

Getting there... if this is going to get Ada to be "seen" it has to attract and be attractive enough for the application developers to use and the see how Ada will offer them advantages beyond their current tool chains.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Anh Vo]

On Tuesday, October 7, 2014 8:12:57 PM UTC-7, David Botton wrote:
> I created a logo for Gnoga, Critiques? Alternate ideas?
> 
 
I am currently studying it when I have free time after full time of work. My current comment is that there is a small typo, patform for platform, on http://www.gnoga.com.

I attempted to build AWS from source using MinGW along with GNAT-GPL-2014. But, it failed with lots of compilation errors. I did not have to look at all of them yet.

It would be nice if there is a speaker icon on the website when pressed the will play the sound of No Gah. 

Once again, I am very thankful for your work and willing to share with others.

A. Vo

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Markus Schöpflin]

What I'm missing on that page is some licensing info. That's usually the very 
first thing I'm interested in: can I use it for my daily work without 
infecting my code with GPL?

Also most corporate users will not see anything of your game on the front 
page, as the application uses port 8080 which is not allowed for HTTP by most 
company firewalls and/or proxies. Firefox e.g. just shows a communication 
error with http://www.gnoga.com:8080 in this case.

Markus

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Thomas Løcke]

On 10/08/2014 05:12 AM, David Botton wrote:
> I created a logo for Gnoga, Critiques? Alternate ideas?


There's too much going on in the logo. If you size it down, it will
become increasingly difficult to make out what it is you're looking at.

Simplify is the keyword when it comes to logos.  :o)


-- 
Thomas Løcke | thomas@12boo.net | http://12boo.net

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[jsquirek]

I agree with Thomas. I made a mock up that uses a more simple design. 

http://i.imgur.com/jpgtkyp.png
http://i.imgur.com/gcu7tGf.png

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[tonyg]

On Wednesday, 8 October 2014 04:12:57 UTC+1, David Botton  wrote:
> I created a logo for Gnoga, Critiques? Alternate ideas?
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.gnoga.com
> 
> 
> 
> So a few things to help put the logo in to perspective:
> 
> 
> 
> 1 Gnoga is pronounced like No and Gah
> 
> 2. The word in hebrew means Saturn or "glow"
> 
> 3. The 8 pointed star is called the "Star of Saturn" used to represent Saturn in old Babylonia
> 
> 4. Gnoga stands for - The GNU Omnificent GUI for Ada
> 
> 
> 
> Some marketing summaries:
> 
> 
> 
> What is Gnoga? A Secure Mission-Critical Cloud, Desktop and Mobile Application Framework
> 
> 
> 
> Gnoga offers real-time server, desktop, mobile and web apps with push capability written across the application stack in Ada, the time-tested, safe and secure programming language designed for large scale long lived maintainable systems.
> 
> 
> 
> Gnoga has the simple ability to write and push data like Node.JS, the stability of compiled Ada applications, the full spectrum use of the browsers rendering capabilities without the need to use JavaScript or HTML, the database simplicity of Ruby on Rails and the ability to target any platform Ada can run or through the cloud to any modern device with a web browser.
> 
> 
> 
> Getting there... if this is going to get Ada to be "seen" it has to attract and be attractive enough for the application developers to use and the see how Ada will offer them advantages beyond their current tool chains.
> 
> 
> 
> David Botton

I glad the pronounciation was cleared up, I was being very careful when mentioning it.

Are you planning on starting some form of business around this ? Its a winner. 

Suggestions :-
How about attaching Dimitry's Kazanov's 500 times faster (than SQL Lite) persistence model for data.

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[dptrash]

I did not check the code by now, but do you use Adas Lists/Maps/Vectors?

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> I did not check the code by now, but do you use Adas Lists/Maps/Vectors?

Yes in a number of places.

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

tonyg, been meaning to tell you, on usenet groups is better to delete quotes of text you are responding to that are not relevant to your discussion :)

In the "old days" you would have had a fire breathing Robert Dewar telling you that :)

> Suggestions :-
> 
> How about attaching Dimitry's Kazanov's 500 times faster (than SQL Lite) persistence model for data.

I would certainly consider it, I'm more focused on the GUI side at the moment, but I plan on adding PostgreSQL and ODBC to the already bound MySQL and Sqlite3. If it fits I would very much consider adding his project. I'd love an all Ada replacement for Sqlite3

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> Simplify is the keyword when it comes to logos.  :o)

I replaced on the page the black and white version at an icon size, do you think still doesn't work? http://www.gnoga.com

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> What I'm missing on that page is some licensing info. That's usually the very 
> first thing I'm interested in: can I use it for my daily work without 
> infecting my code with GPL?

What is Gnoga? An Open-Source Secure Mission-Critical Cloud, Desktop and Mobile Application Development Framework

And I adde a blurb on GMGPL


> Also most corporate users will not see anything of your game on the front 
> page, as the application uses port 8080 which is not allowed for HTTP by most 
> company firewalls and/or proxies. Firefox e.g. just shows a communication 
> error with http://www.gnoga.com:8080 in this case.

This is only a temporary site, when I have time will redo the site in Gnoga and all examples will be proxied through port 80.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> Are you planning on starting some form of business around this ? Its a winner. 

As I mentioned, I have a business model for it that would benefit all programmers interested in being part of it and will share when Gnoga and the (real) website is ready.

Personally I need this for some applications in my own business (I am a doctor of Chinese medicine and have three offices currently and a staff of additional doctors, billers, etc.) that will require HIPAA compliance and with Gnoga it is simple to set up secure encrypted local servers for patient information at my central office, etc.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> I am currently studying it when I have free time after full time of work. My current comment is that there is a small typo, patform for platform, on http://www.gnoga.com.

Fixed, appreciated. As all know spelling is not my strong point :) Thank God for compilers!

> It would be nice if there is a speaker icon on the website when pressed the will play the sound of No Gah. 

Good idea.

> Once again, I am very thankful for your work and willing to share with others.

My pleasure. I recently  gave out a reference to one of your contributes on AdaPower, Memory Management with Storage Pools. So we all do our part :)

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> http://i.imgur.com/gcu7tGf.png

I like it, I may play a bit with that idea a bit, but adjust it to an 8 pedal star, i.e. Star of Venus.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> I attempted to build AWS from source using MinGW along with GNAT-GPL-2014. But, it failed with lots of compilation errors. I did not have to look at all of them yet.

The AWS install issues for Windows are very sad. I assume that it was an AdaCore decision to not make an installer or simply binary zip of AWS that could install. Perhaps Pascal Obry would consider fixing that ;)

Simple enough, "make setup build" on a win32 machine (with an environment that works, mine still does not) then just make a new script that adjusted where to copy the AWS compiled files and re-tar ball.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Thomas Løcke]

On 10/08/2014 04:09 PM, David Botton wrote:
>> http://i.imgur.com/gcu7tGf.png
>
> I like it, I may play a bit with that idea a bit, but adjust it to an 8 pedal star, i.e. Star of Venus.


Much better. The whole vector-style look usually scale very well.  :o)


-- 
Thomas Løcke | thomas@12boo.net | http://12boo.net

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Pascal Obry]

Le mercredi 08 octobre 2014 à 07:23 -0700, David Botton a écrit : 
> > I attempted to build AWS from source using MinGW along with GNAT-GPL-2014. But, it failed with lots of compilation errors. I did not have to look at all of them yet.
> 
> The AWS install issues for Windows are very sad. I assume that it was
> an AdaCore decision to not make an installer or simply binary zip of
> AWS that could install. Perhaps Pascal Obry would consider fixing
> that ;)

There is an experimental script in the repo under win32/build.cmd.

Just do:

   c:> win32\build.cmd c:\path\to\gnat\2014

Should work, but keep in mind that it is experimental. Please report and
better provide patches :)

-- 
  Pascal Obry /  Magny Les Hameaux (78)

  The best way to travel is by means of imagination

  http://v2p.fr.eu.org
  http://www.obry.net

  gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[dptrash]

> Yes in a number of places.

Any planes to change that as Ada Lists/Maps/Vectors are not that performant? 

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> There is an experimental script in the repo under win32/build.cmd.

Will do! Thanks

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> Any planes to change that as Ada Lists/Maps/Vectors are not that performant?

I believe that in most places they are found they are more than adequate performance wise.

However...

I have not yet optimized the websocket protocol, when I get to that, I'll see if the few places where they are used there make senses to be replaced.

I do find it funny that for a language that is built from scratch with the idea of concurrency the container libraries are one of the main places I've seen large apps come to pieces from race conditions...

At Singo where I worked with Jeff Carter he had a nice set of protected versions we used frequently. I need to ask if he has those available some place for the public.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

>    c:> win32\build.cmd c:\path\to\gnat\2014

Worked like a charm!

I was now able to build Gnoga on Win32 and works perfect!

Thanks!
David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Jeffrey Carter]

On 10/08/2014 09:10 AM, David Botton wrote:
> 
> At Singo where I worked with Jeff Carter he had a nice set of protected
> versions we used frequently. I need to ask if he has those available some
> place for the public.

http://pragmada.x10hosting.com/pragmarc.htm

-- 
Jeff Carter
"I would never want to belong to any club that
would have someone like me for a member."
Annie Hall
41

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[jsquirek]

On Wednesday, October 8, 2014 10:09:10 AM UTC-4, David Botton wrote:
> > http://i.imgur.com/gcu7tGf.png
> 
> 
> 
> I like it, I may play a bit with that idea a bit, but adjust it to an 8 pedal star, i.e. Star of Venus.
> 
> 
> 
> David Botton

Here is the PSD
http://www.filedropper.com/logo_14

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Shark8]

On 10/8/2014 8:58 AM, Pascal Obry wrote:
> Le mercredi 08 octobre 2014 à 07:23 -0700, David Botton a écrit :
>>> I attempted to build AWS from source using MinGW along with
>>> GNAT-GPL-2014. But, it failed with lots of compilation errors.
>>>
>>> I did not have to look at all of them yet.
>>
>> The AWS install issues for Windows are very sad. I assume that it was
>> an AdaCore decision to not make an installer or simply binary zip of
>> AWS that could install. Perhaps Pascal Obry would consider fixing
>> that ;)
>
> There is an experimental script in the repo under win32/build.cmd.
>
> Just do:
>
>     c:> win32\build.cmd c:\path\to\gnat\2014
>
> Should work, but keep in mind that it is experimental. Please report and
> better provide patches :)
>

Note:
  - GNAT (bin directory) is on C:\Programming\GNAT\2014
  - AWS (aws.gpr) is on C:\Programming\Libraries\aws

On failure the build-script should delete the .build directory it 
creates, otherwise the following error message is displayed on re-running:
"A subdirectory or file .build\win\setup\src already exists."

I think the following will do that:
RMDIR /S /Q .build

Another apparent error (off-a-level) is the COPY on line 17:
copy ..\config\setup\aws-os_lib-tmplt.c .build\win\setup\src
and again on line 18 (in the -P parameter). -- Or perhaps this is due to 
two .build directories existing one in aws, the other in aws\win32.

After all that the process fails w/
'..\xoscons' is not recognized as an internal or external command,
operable program or batch file.
Couldn't build or install AWS

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[tonyg]

> In the "old days" you would have had a fire breathing Robert Dewar telling you that :)
> 

In my younger years I frequently felt the flames, for quite a few well deserved reasons :)

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> This is only a temporary site, when I have time will redo the site in Gnoga and all examples will be proxied through port 80.

I setup Apache to proxy the snake example through port 80 using Apache. I also added an FAQ entry on it with links to info for Apache and nginx

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Markus Schöpflin]

Am 12.10.2014 06:54, schrieb David Botton:
>> This is only a temporary site, when I have time will redo the site in
>> Gnoga and all examples will be proxied through port 80.
>
> I setup Apache to proxy the snake example through port 80 using Apache. I
> also added an FAQ entry on it with links to info for Apache and nginx

Doesn't seem to help much with my proxy.

And reading the Wikipedia article on web sockets isn't very encouraging, too: 
"If unencrypted WebSocket traffic flows through an explicit or a transparent 
proxy server on its way to the WebSocket server, then, whether or not the 
proxy server behaves as it should, the connection is almost certainly bound to 
fail today."

Markus

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> Doesn't seem to help much with my proxy.

What do you mean by "your proxy"?

> And reading the Wikipedia article on web sockets isn't very encouraging, too: 
> "If unencrypted WebSocket traffic flows through an explicit or a transparent 
> proxy server on its way to the WebSocket server, then, whether or not the 
> proxy server behaves as it should, the connection is almost certainly bound to 
> fail today."

I have not had issues with proxies so far, has worked well.  This could be old info.

David Botton

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[Markus Schöpflin]

Am 13.10.2014 15:23, schrieb David Botton:
>> Doesn't seem to help much with my proxy.
>
> What do you mean by "your proxy"?

At work I'm sitting behind a proxy. (I have no further details on the software
used, it could even be an application level firewall doing deep packet
inspection.)

>> And reading the Wikipedia article on web sockets isn't very encouraging,
>> too: "If unencrypted WebSocket traffic flows through an explicit or a
>> transparent proxy server on its way to the WebSocket server, then,
>> whether or not the proxy server behaves as it should, the connection is
>> almost certainly bound to fail today."
>
> I have not had issues with proxies so far, has worked well.  This could be
> old info.

Well, this is my first ever encounter with Web sockets, therefore I have no
idea of what to expect. Do you know of any other service using Web sockets?

Markus

Re: Gnoga Logo and marketing info, Critique please

[David Botton]

> At work I'm sitting behind a proxy. (I have no further details on the software 
> used, it could even be an application level firewall doing deep packet
> inspection.)

possible

> Well, this is my first ever encounter with Web sockets, therefore I have no 
> idea of what to expect. Do you know of any other service using Web sockets?

A lot of google, but they have  some fallback methods that I should probably also implement using older techniques. I'll look in to it.

David Botton