From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: fdb77,5f529c91be2ac930 X-Google-Attributes: gidfdb77,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,583275b6950bf4e6 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: 1108a1,59ec73856b699922 X-Google-Attributes: gid1108a1,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-05-11 16:51:58 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!news.compaq.com!nntp-relay.ihug.net!ihug.co.nz!west.cox.net!east.cox.net!cox.net!cyclone1.gnilink.net!spamkiller2.gnilink.net!nwrdny01.gnilink.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail From: Hyman Rosen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4b) Gecko/20030419 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.object,comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) References: <9fa75d42.0304230424.10612b1a@posting.google.com> <9fa75d42.0304240446.493ca906@posting.google.com> <3EA7E0E3.8020407@crs4.it> <9fa75d42.0304240950.45114a39@posting.google.com> <4a885870.0304291909.300765f@posting.google.com> <416273D61ACF7FEF.82C1D1AC17296926.FF0BFD4934A03813@lp.airnews.net> <9fa75d42.0305010621.55e99deb@posting.google.com> <0-WcnWfafqsNpiyjXTWcqw@gbronline.com> <1051804573.732603@master.nyc.kbcfp.com> <3EBE9BD4.1050008@attbi.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 23:51:58 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 162.84.205.197 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verizon.net X-Trace: nwrdny01.gnilink.net 1052697118 162.84.205.197 (Sun, 11 May 2003 19:51:58 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 19:51:58 EDT Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.java.advocacy:63538 comp.object:63217 comp.lang.ada:37209 Date: 2003-05-11T23:51:58+00:00 List-Id: Wesley Groleau wrote: > so there is NO WAY you could have either > tested it or analyzed it to justify your > claim that it is not random. I was speaking to the general Ada programmer, not to Robert specifically. And it's well known that subtle errors can lurk in dealing with random numbers, and those are the kinds of errors that have nothing to do with the automatic checks that Ada and type safety gives you, so I found it pertinent that that part of the code was left out. > On top of that, a shuffle by human hands > probably does not produce each possible > permutation with uniform probability! And there are people who believe they can take advantage of that. On the other hand, a shuffle by human hands takes place far less often than a shuffle by computer, and a shuffle by human hands is not algorithmic, so there are compensatory effects.