From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 1108a1,59ec73856b699922 X-Google-Attributes: gid1108a1,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,583275b6950bf4e6 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: 11232c,59ec73856b699922 X-Google-Attributes: gid11232c,public X-Google-Thread: fdb77,5f529c91be2ac930 X-Google-Attributes: gidfdb77,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-05-09 01:30:36 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!news.teledanmark.no!zen.net.uk!lon1-news.nildram.net!195.149.20.147.MISMATCH!mercury.nildram.co.uk!not-for-mail Message-ID: Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 09:30:26 +0100 From: Tom Welsh Sender: Tom Welsh Newsgroups: comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.object,comp.lang.ada,misc.misc Subject: Re: Using Ada for device drivers? (Was: the Ada mandate, and why it collapsed and died) References: <9fa75d42.0304230424.10612b1a@posting.google.com> <9fa75d42.0305020516.bdba239@posting.google.com> <82347202.0305021418.4719da45@posting.google.com> <9fa75d42.0305060521.400f1d80@posting.google.com> <82347202.0305061103.2ddd98e4@posting.google.com> <9fa75d42.0305070504.6866e7a3@posting.google.com> <9fa75d42.0305070929.2d7a0d4c@posting.google.com> <9fa75d42.0305081222.623e0b31@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U NNTP-Posting-Host: 213.208.100.157 X-Trace: 1052469035 mercury.nildram.net 45176 213.208.100.157 Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.java.advocacy:63367 comp.object:63072 comp.lang.ada:37094 misc.misc:14034 Date: 2003-05-09T09:30:26+01:00 List-Id: In article <9fa75d42.0305081222.623e0b31@posting.google.com>, soft-eng writes > >Free compilers for other languages were available, too. >And Unix was never the only OS around (in its range), there >were OS's from DEC, DG etc. Many of these were >popular at unis. And I could be mistaken, but I >thought even Unix had an "f77" compiler included in >the distribution, there was no need to buy it separately. I can confirm that, when I was working at DEC in the 1980s, we saw Unix first of all as a nuisance, then a threat, and finally as a scourge. The reason was its low cost. As of about 1981-2, a few of our customer showed up using Unix. At the time I was working in the UK Remote Diagnosis Centre, where we could run automated tests on remote computers - basically letting our computers interrogate the diagnostic consoles. The leading edge of our efforts was in looking at the operating system and using it, as well as hardware registers, to diagnose problems that could be either hardware or software. I remember being able to tell a field service tech, when he arrived on site, which fuse to replace in which magtape drive to stop the whole system from hanging (bad design, I agree). All of this broke down with Unix, because we weren't trained on it and had no clue how it worked. (Also, its troubleshooting features at that time were rudimentary compared to VMS). It was annoying to us that more and more customers - starting with universities and other research organisations that couldn't afford our usual "corporate" rates - were taking up Unix. VMS was designed simultaneously with the VAX architecture, and they had a lot of synergy. Unix threw a lot of that away, from our point of view. What we didn't understand was that, from the users' point of view, Unix gave them 80 percent (at least) of the benefits for 20 percent (at most) of the cost. Later DEC executives (a remarkable number of whom now work for Microsoft) thought up a new line, which went something like this. Unix is OK if all you want is a basic LCD OS. But VMS will always have the really valuable extras that help give you competitive differentiation (Michael Porter came along just in time for them to grab that straw). So, for the extra cost, VMS keeps you 2-3 years ahead of the curve. Heard something similar to that lately? -- Tom Welsh