From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Thread: 103376,78e482034cf71a6e X-Google-NewGroupId: yes X-Google-Attributes: gida07f3367d7,domainid0,public,usenet X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,UTF8 Received: by 10.66.90.37 with SMTP id bt5mr2793307pab.40.1350507156470; Wed, 17 Oct 2012 13:52:36 -0700 (PDT) Path: s9ni17777pbb.0!nntp.google.com!npeer03.iad.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!news2.euro.net!news.mixmin.net!aioe.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Yannick_Duch=C3=AAne_=28Hibou57?= =?utf-8?Q?=29?= Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Promoting Ada via facebook/google+ .... Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2012 22:52:31 +0200 Organization: Ada @ Home Message-ID: References: <397057cf-1aa5-4dbb-820a-79d8aeee4134@googlegroups.com> <1f1fe619-0478-4a75-acef-6f3234265a9b@googlegroups.com> <507c0b98$0$6630$9b4e6d93@newsspool2.arcor-online.net> <119c7543-b671-477e-bede-0e71a78a7dd2@googlegroups.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: jtK5eUuR2M98bZTat/eg6A.user.speranza.aioe.org Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org User-Agent: Opera Mail/12.02 (Linux) X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.8.2 X-Received-Bytes: 3546 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable Date: 2012-10-17T22:52:31+02:00 List-Id: Le Wed, 17 Oct 2012 21:14:40 +0200, Bill Findlay = a =C3=A9crit: > It surprises me that soemone who appreciates Ada also subscribes to th= e = > cult > of 'concision', which is so antithetical to the view of programming as= a > human activity. 8-) > Clearly identified foundations, formal definitions and specification, = trustability of what you see/read, provision for formal analysis, and so= = on, may indeed make some people be both interested in Ada in one hand, a= nd = Haskell, SML (and others) in an other. Ada is not only about verbosity = (which would not be that much interesting alone), it's also about = trustability and provision for analysis. Don't be fooled by the = conciseness of functional language like Haskell and SML. Formal proofs = languages typically are concise in some way (and that's even what make = them usable, if they were not, there would simply be unpracticable), jus= t = to say concise is not necessarily a synonym of unsafe or untrustable. = There are time or task where verbosity is welcome, there are time and ta= sk = where it would prevents things from being done. Conciseness is mainly wi= th = implicit types, which does not mean =E2=80=9Cuntyped=E2=80=9D nor =E2=80= =9Cdynamically typed=E2=80=9D, = even the opposite (and even more than simple types with formal proofs). = = Where you have other way to do thing than verbosity, you do with these = other ways. Because some things are provable or are mainly manipulated b= y = mathematicians, there is SML and Haskel, and because some things would = need years to be proven, there is Ada and it's verbosity which helps = reliability its own way. Not surprisingly, some people live in both worlds. -- = =E2=80=9CSyntactic sugar causes cancer of the semi-colons.=E2=80=9D [1] =E2=80=9CStructured Programming supports the law of the excluded muddle.= =E2=80=9D [1] [1]: Epigrams on Programming =E2=80=94 Alan J. =E2=80=94 P. Yale Univers= ity