From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,1ea92c0e5255811d X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-03-04 11:04:59 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!fr.usenet-edu.net!usenet-edu.net!enst.fr!not-for-mail From: "Robert C. Leif" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: RE: Way OT: Adam Smith and Software Markets Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 11:02:12 -0800 Organization: ENST, France Message-ID: Reply-To: "comp.lang.ada mail to news gateway" NNTP-Posting-Host: marvin.enst.fr Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: avanie.enst.fr 1046804698 30638 137.194.161.2 (4 Mar 2003 19:04:58 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@enst.fr NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 19:04:58 +0000 (UTC) To: "'comp.lang.ada mail to news gateway'" Return-Path: X-Envelope-From: rleif@rleif.com X-Envelope-To: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1 Precedence: list List-Id: comp.lang.ada mail to news gateway List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:34870 Date: 2003-03-04T11:02:12-08:00 For instance, none of Microsoft's competitors have had the brains to use Ada. Microsoft cannot be held responsible for the stupidity of its competitors, such as their use of Java. In fact, IBM did more to assure Microsoft's monopoly than Microsoft. IBM spread the impression that only Microchannel based PCs were suitable for OS2. Bob Leif -----Original Message----- From: Marin David Condic [mailto:mcondic.auntie.spam@acm.org]=20 Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 5:00 AM To: comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org Subject: Re: Way OT: Adam Smith and Software Markets Preben Randhol wrote in message news:slrnb678l5.2g1.randhol+news@kiuk0152.chembio.ntnu.no... > > Or they might not prefer it but be force into using it because allmost > everybody else uses it (or feels forced to...). > Nobody is "forced" into using Word - or any other word processor for = that matter. If people use it for reasons of compatibility, then (as I = observed) compatibility might be a major factor in "quality" and it is the thing = that the market appears to want over other factors (such as "efficiency" or "reliability") > > Well I read an article once that showed that the efficiency of writing > had not improved since 1980s despite the changes in the word = processors. > However, I cannot recall where I read it so this so this cannot be > submitted as evidence ;-) > Evidence of what? Efficiency of writing is a whole different thing. How = long does it take Shakespear to write "Hamlet" and why does that figure into = word processors? Word processors - as with lots of other software - may have "topped out" in terms of adding new and interesting features or = improving the way we work. Microsoft is discovering that people don't want or need lots of spiffy new features just to write their term papers or letters = to grandma. People are coming to the conclusion that Good Enough is not = nearly so wonderful a thing as Perfect, but that it is Good enough. :-) As a result, it changes the market equation. > However, try writing a paper with some 20 equations and figures and > tables and you'll soon see how frustrating Word is. Top it of with = that > the paper has to be in Letter format (or A4 for those who use Letter) > and you'll go nuts. Word works for two page memos, but not much more = IMHO. > You have needs that don't line up with the needs of a large majority of = word processor users. Maybe you need something special. Choices are = available. If you select Word and sacrifice the ability to write equations easily, = then perhaps there are other factors in your decision. > I don't know about TECO (probably before my time), but I don't think > WP5.1 was much poorer than the Word of today. But give me LaTeX and = I'll > be happy. ;-) > TECO was a pot-shot at a friend of mine who reads this newsgroup. He's a = bit of a luddite and a big fan of Tops-20. If LaTeX does your job for you, great. The market worked and got you something you needed at a price you wanted to pay. If you can dream up a concept for a better word processor, perhaps you've got a potential product - one that might be written in Ada (just to bring it back = on-topic. :-) > > The market works poorly in the desktop business as there is a monopoly > situation. The competition seem to be eaten by the monopolist. = However, > there seem to be evidence that things may change in the future, > hopefully. The only reason why Microsoft hasn't been able to remove > Linux etc.. as a threat is that they cannot buy it. > Monopolies aren't a good thing because someone can use the enormous = power to unfairly stiffle competition. But just remember that a monopoly didn't = get there by putting a gun to your head. (Unless it is a government monopoly = - then they *did* put a gun to your head.) Microsoft got to be as big as = it did by offering free men a voluntary transaction and they accepted it. Microsoft is also in the process of losing its monopoly because others = are offering free men a voluntary transaction and they are starting to = accept that deal instead. (Linux being that case, but there are other OS's out there as well.) Markets may occasionally work poorly - but from my education in = economics, the folks who study this stuff tend to agree that it is a spectrum = between totally free markets versus total command economies. If markets work = poorly, the only apparent alternative is to move along that spectrum towards a = more command-oriented economy. In every instance where that has been tried, = it has worked even more poorly than a market economy. We live in an = imperfect world. You can have a market economy where there are inequities, inefficiencies and injustices. Or you can have a command economy where = the inequities, inefficiencies and injustices abound in far greater numbers. I'll take markets over orders since it respects my free will. If one sees Microsoft as making poor quality crap and using heavy-handed tactics to harm their competitors, the long term answer isn't to seek government interference. That may be a necessary step, but it doesn't = create a long term solution. The long term solution is to come up with *better* products and market them successfully. Microsoft can't stop you from producing a *better* office suite or OS and making it available to the consumer. You have to figure out what "better" means to the consumer and = try to deliver it. Doing so means the consumer wins. MDC -- =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Marin David Condic I work for: http://www.belcan.com/ My project is: http://www.jsf.mil/ Send Replies To: m c o n d i c @ a c m . o r g "Going cold turkey isn't as delicious as it sounds." -- H. Simpson =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D