From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_20,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,1ea92c0e5255811d X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-03-07 15:45:21 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!bloom-beacon.mit.edu!nycmny1-snh1.gtei.net!nycmny1-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!colt.net!peernews3.colt.net!fr.colt.net!deine.net!freenix!enst.fr!not-for-mail From: "Robert C. Leif" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: RE: Way OT: Adam Smith and Software Markets Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 15:44:48 -0800 Organization: ENST, France Message-ID: Reply-To: "comp.lang.ada mail to news gateway" NNTP-Posting-Host: marvin.enst.fr Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: avanie.enst.fr 1047080715 44743 137.194.161.2 (7 Mar 2003 23:45:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@enst.fr NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 23:45:15 +0000 (UTC) To: "'comp.lang.ada mail to news gateway'" Return-Path: X-Envelope-From: rleif@rleif.com X-Envelope-To: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1 Precedence: list List-Id: comp.lang.ada mail to news gateway List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:35058 Date: 2003-03-07T15:44:48-08:00 Ada is much a better language than Java. Java succeeded in the commercial market because of Sun's excellent marketing including advertising. End of argument. Bob Leif -----Original Message----- From: Jason [mailto:pmorrison@4lpi.com] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:35 AM To: comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org Subject: Re: Way OT: Adam Smith and Software Markets Hyman Rosen wrote in message news:<1047052877.215272@master.nyc.kbcfp.com>... > Stanley R. Allen wrote: > > Cf, "The Hidden Persuaders" by Vance Packard. > > Wasn't he the "naked woman in the ice cubes" guy? > Amusingly, a liquor company is now using this in their ads - > "Some people see a naked woman in these ice cubes - others > just see [some variation on 'our wonderful beverage']". > > Subliminal advertising works about as well as hypnosis > and telepathy, which is to say, not at all. I don't know about telepathy, but hypnosis really does "work". Granted, it doesn't really work the way they show in the movies, but pick up a psych 101 textbook if you don't believe me. As for advertising... let me pose a hypothetical question. Let's say, hypothetically, that there is a company that has its product, say a soft drink, in every country on the planet. Now let's suppose that the 6 billion humans on this planet already consume 1 billion drinks of their each day. If advertising does not influence the choices that people make, then why on earth would this same company spend billions of dollars on advertising? It isn't very likely that this "advertising is vital in free markets in order to make potential customers aware of the benefits of using some product, and perhaps of the disadvantages of using a different one." I can't imagine there is single person on this planet that is unaware of Coca Cola (oops, let it slip). The major point of advertising, at least in recent history, is to influence people's decisions. If this is impossible, all the richest, most successful companies are deluding themselves. I agree that people aren't mindless zombies who only eat/drink/wear/buy what they are told, but there are understood psychological methods for influencing behavior. You're right, subliminal advertising, in terms of secret messages between frames or hidden nudity, doesn't work. I for one would like to see more substantive advertising (this product is better because of these points) and less associative advertising (watch this hot chick drink this product). But if you watch TV or read a magazine for a half hour, I think you'll see which is deemed more successful by companies. There's not much I can do about it if I want strong free speech. Still, saying advertising doesn't and isn't intended to influence behavior is sticking your head in the ground. The real solution is for consumers to be much more critical (and self-ware) of what is presented to them.