From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM, FREEMAIL_REPLY autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,60e2922351e0e780 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-11-11 12:59:20 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news2.google.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!news.get2net.dk.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Clause "with and use" References: <3FACCBFB.9D288CF2@fakeaddress.nil> <3FAF8C99.5040201@noplace.com> From: Mark Lorenzen Message-ID: User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:HHXUug5wGPUTjRrFh+57d/ZgU+0= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2003 23:06:19 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.84.221.216 X-Complaints-To: abuse@colt-telecom.dk X-Trace: news.get2net.dk 1068584359 62.84.221.216 (Tue, 11 Nov 2003 21:59:19 CET) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2003 21:59:19 CET Organization: Colt Telecom Kunde Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:2374 Date: 2003-11-11T23:06:19+01:00 List-Id: 18k11tm001@sneakemail.com (Russ) writes: > Vinzent 'Gadget' Hoefler wrote in message news:... >> Preben Randhol wrote: >> >> >If you are interested in fixing leaks in the roof (to use your analogy), >> >I suggest that is what you should worry about too. Not run around in >> >the shed reorganising the tools. >> >> I guess, that's what Russ tried to point out. A typical manager would >> reorganize the complete toolchain first. BTST. > > This is amazing. My analogy was between redundant "with/use" clauses > and clutter in the front yard of a house for sale. What in the > frickin' world does that have to do with reorganizing a tool shed? > > Look, you are free to create your own analogies, but please don't > twist mine beyond recognition and then imagine that they are still my > analogies. It's unethical. Got that, little boy? > >> So it seems that a whole bunch of Ada users have a hard time dealing >> with manager's thinking and talking marketing speech. Oh, not that I >> would actually miss that. :-P > > I really feel sorry for all you poor guys with the clueless PHBs. My > managers are fairly reasonable for the most part. > > My job is as about as far from marketing and management as you can > get, but I am mature enough to understand that managers have an > important job to do. For starters, without them, I would get no Russ, this is the first time you have made me laugh. At least until I realized that you actually mean, what you wrote in the paragraph above. I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but the pointy haired boss from Dilbert is not a fictional figure. *A lot* of S/W engineering people are working for such a boss. > funding for my work. And they are wise enough to give me lots of > discretion on how I do my work. > > You seem to have nothing but disdain for your managers. Well, maybe > they earned it, but judging by your attitude, I'll bet that you are > simply too immature to appreciate their responsibilities. If they're > pinheads, then I'd say they deserve you and you deserve them. You > deserve each other. Maybe someday you'll grow up, little boy. They have no responsibilities. Only idiotic excuses and insane ideas. Every time a project fails miserably, who do you see stand in line in front of a sink, washing their hands? That's right - managers. Try to read a book like "Software failure: Management failure" and feel the pain of those working for idiotic managers. I clearly remember a paragraph from the post-morten report made after the complete failure of the London Ambulance Service project: "Management initially tried to deflect blame onto staff". - Mark Lorenzen