From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Path: eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!gandalf.srv.welterde.de!news.jacob-sparre.dk!loke.jacob-sparre.dk!pnx.dk!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: J Kimball Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Your wish list for Ada 202X Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 04:02:07 -0500 Organization: Jacob Sparre Andersen Research & Innovation Message-ID: References: <7f1c01c5-3563-4b94-9831-152dbbf2ecdc@googlegroups.com> <206rutb9pqak$.11a3dufqvmrm4.dlg@40tude.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip174-70-58-159.om.om.cox.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: loke.gir.dk 1395824529 18316 174.70.58.159 (26 Mar 2014 09:02:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@jacob-sparre.dk NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2014 09:02:09 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:28.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/28.0 In-Reply-To: <206rutb9pqak$.11a3dufqvmrm4.dlg@40tude.net> Xref: news.eternal-september.org comp.lang.ada:18978 Date: 2014-03-26T04:02:07-05:00 List-Id: On 03/26/2014 03:17 AM, Dmitry A. Kazakov wrote: > On Tue, 25 Mar 2014 14:41:16 -0700 (PDT), Stoik wrote: > >> I think that even a casual user of Ada should be able to influence somehow >> the new version of Ada. I wonder what is high on your list of wishes for >> Ada 202X? > > No. Casual users have casual ideas. Ada already suffered too much from > casual additions. Casual users may also not be content with the status quo and may be spending their non-casual time keeping up with advances in programming language design that could benefit the language where a non-casual user may not have any additional time—of no fault of his own, of course. > >> I suspect many of the proposals could be tested in GNAT before being >> introduced (or rejected) in the new version. One could add a switch to >> GNAT indicating that we want to use some of the experimental features. > > Yes, an experimental sandbox is a good idea. However, better would be a > compiler from a generalized and simpler language with Ada type system > implemented as a library. Most of Ada complexity is due to irregularities > and weaknesses of its type system. > A casual user may avoid Ada, never becoming a non-casual user when he encounters these irregularities becoming disenchanted. The wishlist should include ameliorating these irregularities, strengthen the type system and maybe introduce some of the fancy types that academics are using to enforce correctness. I have recognized your very conservative approach to changes in Ada over time. Do you just want a language that suits Dmitry only or something that may grow interest in the language? Of all the sugar that was added in 2012, not much of it is going to convince anyone to pick up Ada.