From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Thread: a07f3367d7,6327f05d4989a68d X-Google-Attributes: gida07f3367d7,public,usenet X-Google-NewGroupId: yes X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Received: by 10.66.77.231 with SMTP id v7mr5650814paw.35.1356837709476; Sat, 29 Dec 2012 19:21:49 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Path: 6ni71714pbd.1!nntp.google.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border4.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!backlog2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border4.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border3.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!newsreader4.netcologne.de!news.netcologne.de!xlned.com!feeder1.xlned.com!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed4.news.xs4all.nl!xs4all!news.stack.nl!reality.xs3.de!news.jacob-sparre.dk!munin.jacob-sparre.dk!pnx.dk!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Randy Brukardt" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Press Release - Ada 2012 Language Standard Approved by ISO Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2012 19:17:22 -0600 Organization: Jacob Sparre Andersen Research & Innovation Message-ID: References: <7wrdmbre6jw9.qww9l0uzj6mg.dlg@40tude.net> <14oqoq06zhlu2.tcasif3hdyhw.dlg@40tude.net> <1drh1q1ln2dfh$.a9hwlg01fjfy.dlg@40tude.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: static-69-95-181-76.mad.choiceone.net X-Trace: munin.nbi.dk 1356571051 5617 69.95.181.76 (27 Dec 2012 01:17:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@jacob-sparre.dk NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2012 01:17:31 +0000 (UTC) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6157 X-Original-Bytes: 2983 Date: 2012-12-26T19:17:22-06:00 List-Id: "Dmitry A. Kazakov" wrote in message news:1drh1q1ln2dfh$.a9hwlg01fjfy.dlg@40tude.net... ... > In the first step I would rather prefer means to declare user-defined > operations pure, context-dependent pure, compile-time evaluated etc. This > would be more universal than mere predicates, and "proper" predicates > would > require that stuff anyway. An alternative, letting the compiler/vendor to > deduce such properties, is IMO unrealistic (an undecidable problem, I > think). Some of us wanted such capabilities in Ada 2005, but there has always been a strong contengent of people who do not believe in having these properties checked by the implementation. These misguided people are opposed by an equally strong group that thinks that declaring unchecked properties would lead to making programs less safe in the case when these properties are a lie (which is easy to do by mistake, especially when inheritance is involved). I was also hoping to have these properties be used for task-safety as well (truly pure functions are automatically task-safe so long as the parameters are different) -- but those who think "memo functions" are important to allow as pure bollix up the works. For Ada 2012, we tried an end run involving proper global in/out properties -- but it just got too complicated and we didn't finish it. (I understand that some of the tools AdaCore is working on use the proposed global in/out properties, so there is some hope that it will make it into Ada in the future). Randy.