From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, REPLYTO_WITHOUT_TO_CC autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Thread: 103376,93a8020cc980d113 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit Path: g2news1.google.com!news2.google.com!news.glorb.com!news2.arglkargh.de!noris.net!newsfeed.arcor.de!newsspool1.arcor-online.net!news.arcor.de.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Dmitry A. Kazakov" Subject: Re: What is wrong with Ada? Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada User-Agent: 40tude_Dialog/2.0.15.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reply-To: mailbox@dmitry-kazakov.de Organization: cbb software GmbH References: <1176150704.130880.248080@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> <461B52A6.20102@obry.net> <461BA892.3090002@obry.net> <82dgve.spf.ln@hunter.axlog.fr> <1176226291.589741.257600@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> <4eaive.6p9.ln@hunter.axlog.fr> <1rbtw92apxpl1.1ednvo8v6oiq8$.dlg@40tude.net> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2007 22:41:50 +0200 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Date: 12 Apr 2007 22:41:00 CEST NNTP-Posting-Host: d08c2388.newsspool3.arcor-online.net X-Trace: DXC=]GAfS]P_GE?lIh70@\BH3Y2\@63>n8SU:4DNcfSJ;bb[5IRnRBaCdkWABTiWBV23a3V438hMJ60 X-Complaints-To: usenet-abuse@arcor.de Xref: g2news1.google.com comp.lang.ada:14966 Date: 2007-04-12T22:41:00+02:00 List-Id: On 12 Apr 2007 19:54:05 GMT, Peter C. Chapin wrote: >> But the number of program states is finite, or else the program is wrong >> anyway? > > In a Turing complete programming language it is possible to write programs > with unbounded amount of state. Indeed... this is the essence of Turing > completeness. > > P.S. If I understand SPARK properly, the SPARK subset of Ada is not Turning > complete because for any given program there is a bound on how much state > information the program might use. As a result the halting problem is > decidable for SPARK programs. This is a consequence of the lack of dynamic > allocation and recursion. Of course useful programs can still be written > with SPARK despite its theoretical incompleteness. I imagine that making > SPARK less powerful than a Turing machine is the whole point of the > restrictions it imposes. Turing machines are hard to analyze. Yes, one should give up some power for security. This is why one should be suspicious to the arguments: "look how powerful is the language feature X!" -- Regards, Dmitry A. Kazakov http://www.dmitry-kazakov.de