From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FREEMAIL_FROM autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Received: by 2002:a24:2c48:: with SMTP id i69mr7377721iti.12.1551087862054; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 01:44:22 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:aca:5884:: with SMTP id m126mr219565oib.4.1551087861773; Mon, 25 Feb 2019 01:44:21 -0800 (PST) Path: eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder6.news.weretis.net!feeder.usenetexpress.com!feeder-in1.iad1.usenetexpress.com!border1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!y42no525907ita.0!news-out.google.com!v188ni914itb.0!nntp.google.com!y42no525905ita.0!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 01:44:21 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=5.186.125.230; posting-account=evKiCQoAAAAlW4DRMPKd5GV_i1n41MVD NNTP-Posting-Host: 5.186.125.230 References: <2199b15b-d704-403f-a6c4-00fab29792d5@googlegroups.com> User-Agent: G2/1.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Ada in command / control systems From: Jesper Quorning Injection-Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2019 09:44:22 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Xref: reader01.eternal-september.org comp.lang.ada:55654 Date: 2019-02-25T01:44:21-08:00 List-Id: On Monday, February 25, 2019 at 9:24:33 AM UTC+1, Dmitry A. Kazakov wrote: > Because the PLC marked is dominated by vendors pushing their vendor-lock= =20 > solutions, e.g. Siemens. Is this so different from Ada suppliers? There are also vendors like Beckhoff (lightweight PLCs) using open standard= s. > Another reason is the customers lacking elementary programming and=20 > software design skills. They are usually technicians and electrical or=20 > mechanical engineers. Therefore, Ada is such an advantage. I myself am not a very good programmer= , so Ada would help me not be called at 3 am with a production line that do= es not work somewhere in a remote timezone. In SPS systems, we do not like dynamic memory allocation, so maybe SPARK wi= thout a tasking would be sufficient for many applications. The languages = =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8Bused already do what they can to limit the programmer to = not make too many mistakes. Technicians and engineers are people too. They try to do what they can with= the training af tools they have. > > It looks like there are elements of Ada in it. > Is it a joke? No, it's not a joke. For me, it seems that Ada was considered when SCL was designed, but was con= sidered too abitious. Ada is a much better language than SCL, which is Pasc= al-like. Small things like "=3D>" and "-" comments are used for online insp= ection. Also END_IF and END_CASE looks like Ada influence. > In about 5-10 years so-called industrial solutions will be swept away by= =20 > cheap hardware and hobby software coming from the home automation toy=20 > projects. These will be far worse than awful SPS, who could think that=20 > worse were possible? But the force of mass market is overwhelming. SPS=20 > et al will suffer the same fate as workstations did. SPS was also considered dead 20 years ago. However lots of new systems are = put into operation every single day. The SPS market is very conservative. W= hen a customer signs an acceptance test he expects the program to be workin= g flawlessly for 15+ years (in principle). Venders has tested and time-tested solutions with many documentation and sp= are parts delivery systems worldwide. Hobbyist does not have that. Jesper.