From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Received: by 2002:ac8:47d5:: with SMTP id d21mr42531679qtr.360.1563649826272; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 12:10:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:aca:a912:: with SMTP id s18mr5793oie.0.1563649825704; Sat, 20 Jul 2019 12:10:25 -0700 (PDT) Path: eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!news.gegeweb.eu!gegeweb.org!usenet-fr.net!proxad.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!209.85.160.216.MISMATCH!b26no7279390qtq.0!news-out.google.com!a5ni1237qtd.0!nntp.google.com!b26no7279389qtq.0!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2019 12:10:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <2872112d-6e9c-4f4c-a7cb-070adae957ca@googlegroups.com> Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=47.185.223.245; posting-account=zwxLlwoAAAChLBU7oraRzNDnqQYkYbpo NNTP-Posting-Host: 47.185.223.245 References: <2872112d-6e9c-4f4c-a7cb-070adae957ca@googlegroups.com> User-Agent: G2/1.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Subject: Re: How to make Ada popular. Get rid of ";" at end of statement. From: Optikos Injection-Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2019 19:10:26 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Xref: reader01.eternal-september.org comp.lang.ada:56904 Date: 2019-07-20T12:10:25-07:00 List-Id: On Saturday, July 20, 2019 at 12:24:29 PM UTC-5, jovi...@gmail.com wrote: > On Saturday, 20 July 2019 16:45:44 UTC+1, Optikos wrote: >=20 > > What newbies find off-putting ... memorization of the language > > international standard & its rationale instead of something automated > > in the toolchain >=20 > Sounds like you're complaining more about the Ada tools than the language > but to get better tools we need to drastically increase the Ada userbase. > So anything that might help Ada code look more familiar to people used to > other languages has to at least be considered. First, =E2=80=A2I=E2=80=A2 am not the one complaining; I am merely a report= er of what I have heard, even from C++ standards-body members and C++ lumin= aries, plus from debate between students & professors at my Ada-centric alm= a mater. Second, surface spelling syntax has absolutely nothing to either worsen or = rectify perceived-difficult-to-swallow =E2=80=A2semantic meaning=E2=80=A2. = People don't like Ada because it is a taskmaster of correctness. Actually= people don't mind Ada being a taskmaster of correctness per se; they mind = that they cannot easily find & memorize & digest the quantity-x rules that = it takes to satisfy the semantic restrictions without having a lengthy conv= ersation with the compiler that gives perceived-arcane, perceived-oblique, = and perceived-na-na-na-na-na-catch-me-if-you-can error messages (instead of= best-practice fix-it transforms of their source code). None of that is su= rface syntax of whether end-of-statement is spelled ; or newline syntactica= lly, of whether assignment is spelled =3D or :=3D, of whether blocks are {}= -bounded or begin/constructIntroducer-end-bounded, of whether comparison is= via =3D=3D or !=3D versus =3D or /=3D, of whether comments are spelled -- = versus //, nor of whether integer literals are spelled with 0x or 0 or 0b p= refixes versus with 16# or 8# or 2# prefixes.