From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,INVALID_MSGID autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 109fba,df854b5838c3e14 X-Google-Attributes: gid109fba,public X-Google-Thread: 1014db,df854b5838c3e14 X-Google-Attributes: gid1014db,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,df854b5838c3e14 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public From: Gene Ouye Subject: Re: C/C++ knocks the crap out of Ada Date: 1996/02/22 Message-ID: #1/1 X-Deja-AN: 140579543 references: <00001a73+00002504@msn.com> <4etcmm$lpd@nova.dimensional.com> <312515DF.7D3B@cmlj.demon.co.uk> <4gad29$ddp@druid.borland.com> <4gb4r3$psg@qualcomm.com> content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII organization: Rational Software Corporation mime-version: 1.0 newsgroups: comp.lang.c++,comp.lang.c,comp.lang.ada Date: 1996-02-22T00:00:00+00:00 List-Id: Dirk Dickmanns wrote: > >[another citation of Ada 83 Booch Components shrunk 80%, 90%, 100%, or more when written in C++ deleted...] > > My 2 Pfennig: It would have shrunk to 10 KLOC in all of Ada, C++, > Eiffel, Sather, whatever during recoding. Maybe we have some kind of > code compressors, but up to now any recode I saw shrunk a lot and was > -- even if done by me -- not neccessarily less readable. Dirk is right on the mark here (no pun intended:-). Grady has said MANY TIMES and in MANY LOCATIONS that the reason the components shrank so much was in no way due to the inherent expressiveness, goodness, or any other attribute of either Ada or C++, but was rather due to the "aha" factor after examining the completed work and then taking a second (or more) pass through and redoing it. He admitted that due to Ada's (at the time) lack of support for dynamic dispatching, there was some additional overhead that would be written into the code, but that regardless, there would have been an order of magnitude reduction in the size of the code similar to the reduction found in the C++ components had they been redone in Ada 83. Given Ada 95's support for tagged types, plus other goodies, it is expected that the size of the final Ada 95 version will likely be somewhat smaller than the C++ version. Do not construe from this that Ada 95 is now slightly more expressive than C++, probably if someone takes another pass through the C++ version, it could be made even smaller as well. Besides, statistics about a component library such as the Booch components, or Tools.h++, or anything like that are pretty much irrelevant to the normal programmer, who is NOT writing a reusable component library, but rather an application that, among other things, utilizes component libraries. These kinds of statistics make great flame war fodder, but one would hope that reasonable people making reasonable decisions about programming languages would be able to see them for what they are and USE THEM IN THE PROPER CONTEXT. > > Dirk > > -- > Dirk Dickmanns -- real-time dynamic computer vision > Sun OS 4.1.3; PC Linux; Transputers -- embedded > Ada 95, Ada 83, OCCAM2/3, ANSI C, Eiffel 3, PROLOG Gene Ouye