From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.4 required=5.0 tests=AC_FROM_MANY_DOTS,BAYES_00 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-06-25 10:05:51 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!newsfeed.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.tele.dk!212.43.194.69!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!newsfeed.planete.net!psinet-france!psiuk-f4!psiuk-p4!uknet!psiuk-n!news.pace.co.uk!nh.pace.co.uk!not-for-mail From: "Marin David Condic" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Market pressures for more reliable software Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 12:50:10 -0400 Organization: Posted on a server owned by Pace Micro Technology plc Message-ID: <9h7q45$6l$1@nh.pace.co.uk> References: <9gsvr7$7ho$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <9folnd$1t8$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3B1FE1FE.B49AE27F@noaa.gov> <9fotpi$4k6$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3b24dc21$1@news.tce.com> <3B25D5FB.15C9B240@dresdner-bank.com> <9g5as6$hbq$1@magnum.mmm.com> <9g5ipg$roq$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <9g614i$at4$1@magnum.mmm.com> <9g7r02$mni$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3b366a2b$6$fuzhry$mr2ice@va.news.verio.net> <9h7guv$pt1$1@nh.pace.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: 136.170.200.133 X-Trace: nh.pace.co.uk 993487813 213 136.170.200.133 (25 Jun 2001 16:50:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@pace.co.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: 25 Jun 2001 16:50:13 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:9098 Date: 2001-06-25T16:50:13+00:00 List-Id: O.K. I give up. There never were centralized computer centers where people logged on and did work on data and programs that were kept in a central place. People always had computers on their desks and computing was always distributed. Networks of computers existed since before the vacuume tube was invented and were *instantly* in use the very same day that the very first computer was turned on - even though there were no other computers to connect to. Bill Gates is therefore proposing something brand new that the world has never seen before. Everyone should run out and buy it now because it will dramatically change your life in a way never before seen or heard or even dreampt of! Just think: For the very first time in the entire history of the universe, you can store your data on a big disk shared by thousands of other users! You'll be able to execute a program maintained by a team of experts that is continually updated so that every time you execute it from its central storage location, you automatically get the latest and greatest version! Never before have your eyes witnessed such a monumental feat or such a huge advancement in the field of computer science! Watch and be amazed as our small team of highly trained technicians actually *back*up* your data on a nightly basis so that for the first time ever, you'll be safe in the event of a disk crash! Why, you'll be so amazed by the convenience that you'll *instantly* scrap that antique PC on your desk in favor of Microsoft's latest invention which the marketing guys are calling "The Teletype" utilizing all new "Paper v1.0 (tm)" as its micro-thin display technology. You'll be able to connect to the centralized computer from anywhere in the world at any hour of the day or night using a device Microsoft just invented called "The Modem". Gosh, I'm just so glad that everyone here has disabused me of the notion that this might have somehow sounded familiar. I've seen the light. I think I'll get down on my knees and thank God that Bill Gates is in the world inventing new things daily. Where do I sign up? Now maybe I can start an argument in the other direction? :-) MDC -- Marin David Condic Senior Software Engineer Pace Micro Technology Americas www.pacemicro.com Enabling the digital revolution e-Mail: marin.condic@pacemicro.com Web: http://www.mcondic.com/ "David C. Hoos" wrote in message news:mailman.993483499.4923.comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org... > It seems to me that what we have here is a semantic tempest in a teapot. > > In 1958, I had an IBM 610 computer that operated in an office > environment, and certainly was not "centralized," in that any member of > the engineering staff who wished to use it in his work was free to do so. > > A few years later we moved up to an IBM 1620, again in an office > environment and not "centralized." > > Not until we moved up to a 360, was there any semblance of > "centralization," and this was mainly for scheduling purposes. We still > did our own keypunching, and ran our own jobs. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marin David Condic" > Newsgroups: > comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.java.programmer,comp.lang.pl1,comp.lang.vrml,comp.la > ng.java.advocacy > To: > Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 9:13 AM > Subject: Re: Market pressures for more reliable software > > > > Maybe I'm just in the springtime of my senility, but that's pretty much > how > > I remember it and pretty much what I was trying to describe. "distributed" > > computing was not around in the days of the ENIAC and vacuume tube > > computing - so pretty much ipso facto, "centralized" computing existed > > first. When all that existed in the entire universe were big gigundous > > computers that had to be kept in hermetically sealed rooms, people didn't > > have one of them sitting under their desk - so "centralized" computing > > existed and "distributed" computing didn't. > > > > Like I said, I didn't think I was making an extravagant claim here or > going > > against what was pretty much accepted interpretation of computing > historical > > facts. Since I'm not trying to say something like "The Earth Is Flat!" I'm > > believing that somehow I'm miscommunicating. OTOH, if someone wants to > > believe that computing only started when IBM invented the PC, then I > suppose > > that belief would lead one to conclude that "distributed" and > "centralized" > > computing have always existed side-by-side and it has never been > otherwise. > > I suppose there really isn't anything I can do about that belief. > > > > MDC > > -- > > Marin David Condic > > Senior Software Engineer > > Pace Micro Technology Americas www.pacemicro.com > > Enabling the digital revolution > > e-Mail: marin.condic@pacemicro.com > > Web: http://www.mcondic.com/ > > > > > > "Gary Labowitz" wrote in message > > news:AkCZ6.1988$Tt6.825475@monger.newsread.com... > > > And now it's you that needs correction. Most shops in the early days > were > > > centralized computing. And most of those were centralized development as > > > well. [Definition: centralized -- a single computer at a centralized > > > location. All computing is done on that computer. Users go physically to > > > that computer site and either submit jobs directly to the machine, being > > > given time on the machine to use it, or submit jobs to a checkpoint from > > > which operators submit the jobs for the user. If the site was large > enough > > > to have several computers they were clustered in the same general area > and > > > users selected which of the computers would be used for their individual > > > jobs.] > > > > > > I can remember back to 1962 (when I started with IBM) but built my first > > > computer in 1956. > > > Your turn. > > > Gary > > > "Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz" wrote > in > > > message news:3b366a2b$6$fuzhry$mr2ice@va.news.verio.net... > > > > In , on 06/19/2001 > > > > at 08:21 AM, lesbell@nospam.lesbell.com.au said: > > > > > > > > >"Marin David Condic" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > >I seem to be getting misunderstood for reasons I don't comprehend. > > > > > > > > You haven't been misunderstood, you've been corrected. Your knowledge > > > > of DP history is faulty, and you haven't paid attention to those who > > > > were there in the old days and told you the reality. > > > > > > > > >We > > > > >*used*to* have centralized computing. > > > > > > > > What you mean "we", kimosabi? As I said, it's not a question of > > > > misunderstanding you, it's a question of correcting you. Maybe you > > > > worked at a shop that had centralized computing, although I doubt it. > > > > Such shops were not the norm. > > > > > > > > >What I *am* saying is that we once had a centralized model and opted > > > > >out of it > > > > > > > > And as long as you keep saying something demonstrably false your > > > > conclusions remain suspect. The industry has had both decentralized > > > > development on centralized hardware and centralized development on > > > > decentralized hardware for as long as I can remember. Centralization > > > > of one does not, has not and will not imply centralization of the > > > > other. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT > > > > Atid/2 > > > > Team OS/2 > > > > Team PL/I > > > > > > > > Any unsolicited commercial junk E-mail will be subject to legal > > > > action. I reserve the right to publicly post or ridicule any > > > > abusive E-mail. > > > > > > > > I mangled my E-mail address to foil automated spammers; reply to > > > > domain acm dot org user shmuel to contact me. Do not reply to > > > > spamtrap@library.lspace.org > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > comp.lang.ada mailing list > > comp.lang.ada@ada.eu.org > > http://ada.eu.org/mailman/listinfo/comp.lang.ada > > >