From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.4 required=5.0 tests=AC_FROM_MANY_DOTS,BAYES_00 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 107f24,626a0a064b320310 X-Google-Attributes: gid107f24,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,ea8ea502d35ca2ce X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: 103d24,626a0a064b320310 X-Google-Attributes: gid103d24,public X-Google-Thread: 10259a,626a0a064b320310 X-Google-Attributes: gid10259a,public X-Google-Thread: 114809,626a0a064b320310 X-Google-Attributes: gid114809,public X-Google-Thread: f4fd2,626a0a064b320310 X-Google-Attributes: gidf4fd2,public X-Google-Thread: 1164ba,626a0a064b320310 X-Google-Attributes: gid1164ba,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-05-09 07:10:07 PST Path: newsfeed.google.com!sn-xit-02!supernews.com!news.gv.tsc.tdk.com!falcon.america.net!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!news.maxwell.syr.edu!isdnet!psinet-france!psiuk-f4!psiuk-p4!uknet!psiuk-n!news.pace.co.uk!nh.pace.co.uk!not-for-mail From: "Marin David Condic" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.lisp,comp.lang.smalltalk,comp.lang.basic,comp.lang.functional,comp.lang.scheme,comp.lang.perl Subject: Re: Beginner's Language? Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 09:55:15 -0400 Organization: Posted on a server owned by Pace Micro Technology plc Message-ID: <9dbi83$sji$1@nh.pace.co.uk> References: <9cukad$nn68@news-dxb> <9d6b6e$1bt$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <87snihxiwc.fsf@frown.here> NNTP-Posting-Host: 136.170.200.133 X-Trace: nh.pace.co.uk 989416515 29298 136.170.200.133 (9 May 2001 13:55:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@pace.co.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: 9 May 2001 13:55:15 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: newsfeed.google.com comp.lang.ada:7369 comp.lang.lisp:9867 comp.lang.smalltalk:9628 comp.lang.functional:5587 comp.lang.scheme:3729 comp.lang.perl:2732 Date: 2001-05-09T13:55:15+00:00 List-Id: First, let me point out that I have no objection to teaching anyone Lisp at some later point in their CS education. I have nothing against Lisp, in this sense. The reason I wouldn't teach it as a FIRST programming language should be fairly obvious. It is complex and unlike the bulk of other programming languages. Whatever one decides to teach as a FIRST language ought to be simple, easily understood, easy to work with, representative of most commonly used languages and reflective of well understood, sound programming practices. Lisp tends to not fit this description well at all. If you are familiar with Lisp, try this: Write a small program to read in a couple of numbers from a keyboard, do some math with them and print the result to the screen. Now look at it. Could a neophite with literally *zero* experience in programming computers read it and stand a chance of understanding what it does or how it does it? Could a neophite duplicate it easily or modify it to do something different? Is it intuitively obvious to even the most casual observer how to make a similar program? That's why I wouldn't recommend Lisp as a first programming language in an intro to CS course. Gee. I never thought I'd have to defend THAT statement! :-) MDC -- Marin David Condic Senior Software Engineer Pace Micro Technology Americas www.pacemicro.com Enabling the digital revolution e-Mail: marin.condic@pacemicro.com Web: http://www.mcondic.com/ "Friedrich Dominicus" wrote in message news:87snihxiwc.fsf@frown.here... > > Why no Lisp? >