From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.4 required=5.0 tests=AC_FROM_MANY_DOTS,BAYES_00 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,cec20777e0d41ea0 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-02-22 06:46:08 PST Path: supernews.google.com!sn-xit-03!supernews.com!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!nntp.news.xara.net!xara.net!gxn.net!news.lattis.xara.net!psiuk-f4!psiuk-p4!uknet!psiuk-n!news.pace.co.uk!nh.pace.co.uk!not-for-mail From: "Marin David Condic" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Increased Interest In Ada? Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:27:33 -0500 Organization: Posted on a server owned by Pace Micro Technology plc Message-ID: <9737md$rj2$1@nh.pace.co.uk> References: <3A82EFA2.C8756B09@acm.org> <970ma1$1l7$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <9719vr$8a2$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3A94ED5E.4FF1E8EB@praxis-cs.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: 136.170.200.133 X-Trace: nh.pace.co.uk 982852109 28258 136.170.200.133 (22 Feb 2001 14:28:29 GMT) X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@pace.co.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: 22 Feb 2001 14:28:29 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: supernews.google.com comp.lang.ada:5437 Date: 2001-02-22T14:28:29+00:00 List-Id: That sounds interesting. I'm wondering what sort of students you present this to and what are the learning objectives? Do you think they learn much about the embedded aspects, or do they learn more about realtime programming? My concern is that such a simulation would be useful for developing the high level algorithms for embedded, realtime controls, but probably won't do a good job of teaching the low level aspects of embedded programming. At the high level, embedded programming looks much like any other kind of programming - albeit, within a specialized problem domain. What I'd like to find is a good, inexpensive way of teaching the low level aspects - things like accessing different kinds of memory, interfacing to I/O devices, utilizing hardware interrupts, etc. as well as the higher level concepts of device control. You just don't get much of a feel for real embedded programming unless you've had to spend time fighting with a linker to get things located at specific places, or struggling to get bootstrap code to load your software across a comm link, or get into the "Broken Software/Broken Hardware" debate. I think it would be helpful to Ada to have a good embedded/realtime off-the-shelf course (book, software, hardware...) available, but I've just not encountered the components that would make this possible at a practical cost. Software simulation might make an interesting project, but I'm not sure that it would illustrate enough of the important parts of the embedded world. Now possibly, if one were to bundle a compiler with a simulation of an actual SBC with a popular processor, then you might have something there. However, that starts becoming more work than simply designing a board and retargeting a compiler... :-) MDC -- Marin David Condic Senior Software Engineer Pace Micro Technology Americas www.pacemicro.com Enabling the digital revolution e-Mail: marin.condic@pacemicro.com Web: http://www.mcondic.com/ "Peter Amey" wrote in message news:3A94ED5E.4FF1E8EB@praxis-cs.co.uk... > We have done something like this for the SPARK course. We have a visual > basic :-( on-screen emulation of a hardware device and students can > drive it from their SPARK code using interface packages we provide. The > link between SPARK and VB is done with David Botton's excellent COM > stuff. > > > Peter